289: Social Change Anytime Everywhere – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guest this week:

Amy Sample Ward, our social media contributor and CEO of NTEN, the Nonprofit Technology Network.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

171: Mastering Millennials & Engage By Age – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Derrick Feldmann, lead researcher for The Millennial Impact Project and CEO of Achieve.

Amy Sample Ward, CEO of Nonprofit Technology Network (NTEN) and co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere.”

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host it’s friday, december thirteenth, twenty thirteen oh, i hope you were with me last week. I’d lapse into frigate triska, dick alia phobia that’s special for today if i came to learn that you had missed brandraise to fundraise. Sarah durham is principal and founder of big duck communications consultants for non-profits we talked about what brandraise ing is and how it paves the road to fund-raising and safeguard your donordigital how do you best preserve and protect your donor information? Scott koegler is our tech contributor and the editor of non-profit technology news, and he explained it this week. Mastering millennials derek feldman, co author of the millennial impact report, shares the research on how twenty to thirty two year olds connect, get involved and give two causes they’re passionate about and engaged by age. Amy sample ward, our social media contributor and ceo of non-profit technology network and ten nose which social platforms are best for which ages she has tips to engage by age and reveals the platforms to watch for in twenty fourteen plus. She’ll have her sixty sixty second style stop between the guests on tony’s take two my giving tuesday roundup of round ups we’re improvising a little bit right now because derek feldman, who wants to be in the studio, is supposed to be in the studio isn’t in the studio, but he’s he’s on by phone. In a cab, we’ll find out exactly where he is. Derek feldman leads the research team on the millennial impact project and is ceo of achieved, a consulting company he co authored caused for change. The why and how of non-profit millennial engagement, published by wiley he roots for he writes for philanthropy news digest of the foundation center and the huffington post impact channel on twitter. He’s at derek feldman spelled with two ends derek feldman welcome, thanks so much, tony. I think i’ll be there with you soon. Okay, where are you self? Tell me where you are. Well invited tunnels. So know what side of the city. And so i think i’m about ten minutes. So our eight minute ok, the tunnel. Which time we have a bunch of tunnels? Which tunnel you near lincoln? Oh, my god. You’re what time? Did you leave? Where? Julie? From indiana, i think. Well, it’s, a lot of traffic, but i’ll be there. I promise. Don’t worry. We’ll get okay. All right, now, that’s ok? We can improvise by phone, and then we’ll get you here when you get here. Um what you tell us why we should be even be be studying millennials? Why did you, uh, it was an interesting time is i was looking at, uh, how to understand that a connect with the donors in general about five years ago or so i looked at how we can help clients and individuals better engaged just donorsearch general, and one of the most interesting things that they started to do that i realized that millennials, those in their twenties, early thirties. Although i disagree with the cut office with roughly in the early thirty thirty one thirty two, i started to see some interesting differences between how their connection preference and how somebody who is a boomer had a preference true as well. And i thought, boy, uh, these are the donors of the future. We better start trying to understand what their expectations are. Supporters so that’s kind of how? It kind of got me interested in the discussion, okay? And what’s the history of the research you’ve been at this for several years. Yes, so we are embarking upon the fifth year of the research we’ve had the last four years, we’ve really focused and brought down that sort of engagement to focus on, as you mentioned, how to connect and then how they involve, and then how to give study, marketing, communication messages, solicitation of churches and so forth. And so this is the study of the reported twenty thirteen with the fourth year of the study, and next year we will be in our ship of the chronicle of philanthropy, how melanie alumni are engaging with their institutions, why or why not from their expectations as well. And then, in addition to that, be focusing on the corporate cause engagement side. So how employees millennial employees in particular our viewing, they’re causing gatien through their company and what they want to have happen? Okay, so the first don’t know. We’re talking about the ages twenty to thirty two, right? Is that that’s? What? Your research. Okay. Yeah, i know. There’s. Some a cz you mentioned there’s some you know, questions about where the age cuts off, whatever what? What’s a general, why what’s not, but what your research was twenty to thirty two correct. Okay, okay, and i’m sure that there are differences within that group even write a lot of twenty year old, you’re not like most thirty two year old, yeah, absolutely. And this is something that we’ve had teo look at overall when it comes to even social media engagement and sure, amy can talk about that well, the first year that we did, the study hi uses a facebook and even in our own studies, over the course of the four years we have seen facebook in the younger peer the generation, those twenty to twenty five that uses the cleaning high uses of instagram, image based type platforms like pinterest and so on, and so their differences between that and even as we look at the upper end of that, right? So those that are in the early thirty’s, late forties where starting families and they’re still in trapping exploration and sort it right in the middle, i like to say and there at a time where it’s not necessarily there giving to a lot of causes, and they’re starting to be much more, uh, sophisticated in their types of e-giving approaches so it’s a big age range, lots of changes going on. New technologies are always established that changed some of this, but also in combination of technologies, we see the actual individual going through their own philanthropic exploration. Well, yes. Okay. Studying on individual basis as well, right? I absolutely do. You have you have any objection to the term generation? Why? No, in fact, you know, here you want it like a generational terms and letters and so forth that craigconnects and wind and summer climbing season the next one. Now in that at all. I think the one thing that we are seeing is this trend of, uh, discussion around, you know, do we have to this label, you know, millennial millennial? Or is it just somebody’s in their twenties or even a young adult and so on? I think that will move away from the term millennial in the next three or four years. Our studies, we’ll look at other things, but but if in terms of just using that that name and knowing quite sure it does help some people understand what? Yeah, i mean that’s the advantage of having phrases that we understand. So i was just curious. It doesn’t matter to me what i’m happy to say millennials. I was just wondering if there was any particular, any objection you might had to gen gen y or something. Okay, all right. So the first really sort of phase of long term activity with non-profit is connecting. Yeah, absolutely. What do we what do we see among among millennials and how they get connected and what it is that moves them to connect? Exactly. So we have this is an important feature that a z we were even looking at the continuum of involvement, right? So how somebody moves from hearing about a cause to pure action, what they’re doing and so on way sort of been in this been in this mood that that that we have tto help the millennial move along and educational component that helps them understand the issue that caused issue much more importantly than necessarily the institution or the organization itself. Uh, so what we have what? We have really looked out over the course of the last couple. Years how can we better position the cause issue to try and connect with millennial interests in order to get them to act or commit to the cause? And we have discovered that when the issue is really at the forefront because that’s what they’re sharing our shared common value and shared common issue, the individual tenth have hyre reactionary. So this would be an example of saying, if you care about giving water to everybody in africa, you know, join us, participate, we’re leading with the issue versus saying, this is who we are. These are the three things we stand for, all that other stuff just like it because you heard about the brand right now, and so we’ve got a little bit of differences between those, and the connection point will be much stronger when we focus on the issue. Okay, interesting. So that that’s that’s really, the affinity is for the cause now, i just heard a little background noise. Does the cab driver know that he’s in a recording studio? He does, doesn’t he actually has been really great. So i have to get my cab driver really good. Yeah. Make sure you give it. Up. Give it generous. You make sure you give a generous tip and and if he’s any kind of performer, ask him if he’s a performer, maybe he could be on right now. Really focus. Okay, okay, i don’t know. Plus, i don’t know if he has a sag after card, so we may not be able to let him on if he’s not in the union that way would be able to do it anyway. And and in this in this connection phase, the the millennials are what? How extensive is their use of oven organization’s website? And we have just like, a minute or so before before our first break. Yeah, very, very, very important. We’re seeing that one of the first things that millennial does is look at the digital environment in which they’re attracted to from the issue. So here’s a good sort of play on how we’ve seen action happen. Colonial is interested in cause some impulsive pete. It might be from a peer. Still you google we directly into website, digital environment and from that environment, they do a couple key things. One is they’re trying to figure out if the issue necessarily does. Not what they’re wanting to do. The second thing is understanding how that organization our cause is related to that issue, and then third is going to a social network to see how they’re talking. So we’ve seen that happen time and again, as we do usability, testing and so forth to watch them do that what’s. Also important in that monisha pro quick is the use of the imagery to compel them to act and perform, at least in action, in the digital environment. Okay, excellent there’s a lot. There we’ll stay on this subject subject. What, that what that connect continuum looks like it’s, very interesting, starting going right to digital website, but then switching to social, which amy and amy sample, we’re not going to talk about the second half, okay, stay with us. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Do you need a business plan that can guide your company’s growth? Seven and seven will help bring the changes you need. Wear small business consultants and we pay attention to the details. You may miss our culture and consultant services a guaranteed to lead toe. Right, groat. For your business, call us at nine. One seven eight three, three, four, eight, six zero foreign, no obligation free consultation. Check out our website of ww dot covenant seven dot com are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time for the truth. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society politics, business it’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me very sure you’re neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s. Ivory tower radio dot com e every time i was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven, it will make you smarter. Hey, hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent let’s do a little live listener love mainz, germany welcome live listen, love to you, hyung zhao, china and shanghai china knee how oh, and dellaccio korea. Anya haserot i decided to start abroad with live listener love today from a cab on the west side, somewhere between the lincoln tunnel and seventy second street. Derek feldman, co author of the millennial impact report we’re talking about mastering millennials, so derek so the the non-profits website in the long term is not not as important to the connection, but initially it sounds like it is important. Yeah, it is. And tony really excited, actually here. Oh, you’re downstairs. Okay. All right, so why don’t you push the button for the floor number two and i’ll just speak while you’re while you’re on your way up. Okay. Derek has made it to the studio at one twenty five west seventy second between columbus and amsterdam. There was one time when amy sample ward had to run. Frequent listeners will remember that. And she will remember as well. I know she’s listening somewhere. Um, she had a run here and ah, little tap dance and she was a lot of breath, but it was no big deal. Derek derek took the civilised way. He took a cab so he will not be out of breath. He’ll be all poised a soon as he walks in and it’s very exciting. I can hear the elevator door opening and he’s actually, you know, he did not take the elevator. Derek feldman actually coming up the stairs, i’m pretty sure didn’t want to wait for the elevator because we’re we’re only on the twelfth floor, so he’s going to have ah, now we’re on the second floor. He’ll be here shortly. Um can’t tell whether he took the stairs or the elevator. The person on the stairs walked past, but so what’s interesting about the, uh, the use of the website is, as i was saying, it is important in the beginning, but then after that it’s ah it’s a switch to the social to the social platforms, so they’re clearly needs to be ease of transitioning someone from your sight too. Twitter, facebook, instagram, you know, however you believe you’re going to be connecting if you want to keep millennials engaged all right. Derek is here. It’s okay, he’s. A lot of breath, but ah, he did take the stairs and it’s only as something. One storey walk. All right, look, school welcome, derrick. Hey there. How are you? Great. Welcome. You know, get out the second person to do this, amy sample murcott same problem. Ah, months months ago when she was still here in new york, she had to she had to run. Okay, so take a breath. We were just talking about i was just recapping, like the importance of the website and the importance of making sure that it’s easy to jump from this website to social channels. Because that’s, what millennials want to do for the long term for the longer term? Absolutely. So what will also see from there is is that we will watch a millennial initially taken action on a site, but it also has a sharing component so it could be something like ah, sign a petition and then shared with your friends and then also going to their social networks. Todo eso quick called action on the site exactly on the website exactly. But because what we really want digital sites to do is help the millennial commit to the cause issue, right? So it’s, if i want water? Yeah, are you in for helping with water? A small action and then also saying, great. Now we want you to share your experience. This is where we share ours. You share ours too. Okay? The er and so so the website becomes less important people. You oh, you know, you know, you’re not finding millennial’s going back to the website very much after first first connection. Correct? Well, that’s sure. Yeah. And so the website has then become much more of ah, platform than to to continue to act upon so later on, there might be email campaigns, solicitations, those kinds of things, but whichever would drive back to the way exactly, sir, if they’re driven there. Well, they’re certainly going back. But if not driven, they’re getting long term information from the social network. Exactly. Okay, now, part of your study included video, right? You were watching people interact with non-profit websites? Yeah, we did use their testing. And so besides us just saying, hey, this is what we found out. We thought we should actually put this stuff in front. Of millennials and get and record their reaction to it. So we performed. We had about a hundred millennials nationwide that we put different types of solicitations infront of communication messages, digital experiences, we had them go through websites tell us what you like, what you don’t like. Tell us what you didn’t like with a solicitation. Why wouldn’t you give for? Why would you? And so all of that way actually shared some of that on her site. We plan to do more and share more of that in the next year. Well, i’m thinking of it. Why don’t you give the earl where people comparing the research and downloaded? Yeah, so all of the research is available for free and thanks to the case foundation stephen jean case foundation want in washington who’s really been helpful in allowing this for the field, and you can find that at the millennial impact dot com. Excellent. Thank you, since the website is important at the connection phase, should we be thinking about being mobile optimized? If we’re going to be optimized for millennials? Absolutely. This is something that’s been really interesting even around the text space first year we did. This study, haiti happens within two weeks after we started without oh my gosh, where you know the study is, the real researchers will be flawed and later on, even in this year when we look at text e-giving overall, it is remains in that year we did the haiti ans and it was eighteen percent of our pool had text to give this last year we had about eighteen and a half percent that have text to give. So for the last four years in our city and i can’t say everybody else’s studies, but then ours we have found that it’s been a little constant. What has risen during that time is the use of mobile engagement for transacting and so forth. So going to a mobile friendly website and then actually donating or taking a cause action after a connection, of course, comes involvement. Exactly what we what we see around involvement generally before we get specific s o i think the trends about eight, nine years ago wass in the field at least let’s create a young professionals group. That was our way to get to get millennials and young professionals, right? So segregated? Yeah, always. Like that in all good intentions, right? We figured that if we create this group, they’ll see they’re like minded friends, they’ll do certain things, and at the same time they’ll be able to actually learn from each other and get more engaged in the cause. But we were doing something very interesting is that we’re still we’re separating them from the true cause work of it. All right? So what we have discovered is this full integration together and secondly, is that we have to, as causes, allow an opportunity for our millennials and quite frankly, any age volunteer advocate to do things with us in a very short amount of time. So as you and i sit here right now, and if i wanted to do cause work for ten minutes, i should be able to do that and have that opportunity, and millennials want that too millennials they’re wanting the opportunity to actually be together at times, but also independently work and do cause work out the day when they can’t doesn’t mean i have to go down in the soup kitchen. How could i have the soup kitchen virtually as well? So that’s the trend that we’re seeing ok on dh also a lot of learning if there is going to be volunteer work. I saw i saw references in the study, too learning online versus making learning online available. Yeah, one of the biggest complaints millennials have told us is, you know, i go to a volunteer experience the first half hour is you teaching me what i’m going to do and their complaint is i don’t know if you know this, we live in an a on my environment, you can train us online prior to us getting there you can what you know, it’s an extra half hour, you’ve wasted thirty minutes exactly okay also a lot of interest in connecting with like minded peers, right? Seeing that as the reason for volunteering exact right, and so the some the initial engagement of causes either happens by themselves or with peers in pierre. Engagement is really hype here fund-raising is high with millennials and so on and when it comes to peer involvement, it’s the same thing, but here is where we get really challenged is that our organisations are not necessarily set up to do peer involvement tight service so, for instance if they go to the soup kitchen well, randy, you’re over there. Derek, you’re over here and you over there. I know you all came together here and you wanted to do this is appear thing, but we’re going to separate you and that’s another again, another complaint that we’ve heard hyre we talked about pure fund-raising or peer-to-peer fund-raising our runs, walks and rides popular very they are very, very and, you know, i’m not, and i think run race, walk is an incredible opportunity to expose people to cause work. The question is, what do we do with it? After that, we had about sixty three percent had participated in a run race walk in the highest, ah, one of the highest fund-raising components besides just giving out right as well, event based, i’ll fund-raising too. And so once we get this opportunity where we’re bringing our friends our peers altogether, and this is where amy can talk as well, that then how do we convert that to true engagement? The thing that a board of directors will do is say, oh, my gosh, derek brought ten of his friends. These ten friends now love the cancer society. That’s not true, they love america and they don’t love necessarily the rest, and so we have to be really cautious and we have always viewed, and we’ve put out some stuff there to say that you have to have a chain a drip campaign to engage them back in the cause because in art, as you said, connect involved, give we’ve skipped connect involved in pierre fund-raising and went directly to the give. Now sometimes we try to educate them as quick, but we haven’t had them act on behalf the cause except to give. So we’ve got to rework it a little bit more and get them to act now to the next stop. Okay, on one of our sponsors like to leave this in his rally bound, which does software for runs, walks, rides you say you say, what do you say? Runs races, walks, run, walk, race it’s old writes, is in there to get that right. We’re gonna work it all out, okay? After we are connected to involved. Now we get to giving and again generally, you know what? What do you see from the group that, um, in our population? Probably has the least available to give right cash wise haserot non-cash wise, i’m not and that’s not the only gift that people can give. Yeah, so i’m glad you mentioned that because i do want to make a statement that is we have looked at millennials, they view all the assets they have as valuable to the cause and that asset goes b the traditional form of philanthropy is time, talent, treasure? Well, i will have to come on here and say that there’s actually an expanded view for millennials, it is skill that they have it is the time that they have it is the money they have and the network they possess, their ability to tap into that network for you end too, in their voice, i mean, they’re considering all of those equal assets and opportunities for causes when it comes to giving, we have seen that a substantial amount of the giving efforts have involved peers, as i mentioned a little earlier, and what we do have, though, is this high level of transparency and expectation that there is some sort of feedback mechanism that will occur upon gift, and i’m not talking about the form letter that you get after you give right the twenty four hour rule that we want to try and teo, this is the so we asked you to give us ten dollars, to given at tau africa, you know, help somebody help in individual. Well, in thirty or forty days, i’m going to report back to you how that net actually had an impact on that individual and not waiting a long time on that reporting or that feedback, but actually bringing that shorter within the fifteen to forty five day mark is what we’re really looking at within fifteen days. Yeah, we or at least working on behalf of the cause there’s a great there’s a great cause. Col generosity water if you haven’t checked them out and online, they actually show the process they get through after they get your money. And and the greatest thing any organization can do is communicate along the way. You might not have impact for a full year. It doesn’t mean that you’re not working on their behalf and that’s what we forget and way think that the only thing our donors want to hear is when it’s completely job done, mission accomplished and we’re not we don’t need to go that george bush, i didn’t mean to do that make-a-wish on aircraft carrier mission come strike that job done! Wait that’s not the first report that doesn’t have to be the first report job done exactly so and this is where social media engagement is an incredible opportunity we can say all right, you know, after you give in fifteen days, i’m going to communicate with you and say you should check out our facebook, here’s here’s five images that are in our facebook environment right now from the people that were working with on your behalf if you want to continued updates head to our facebook environment because that’s where we can give that to, i would never use the word environment, but but you can see how we can use that social media engagement and say to our program, people, i need you to take three photos of the beneficiaries this week so we can continue to update our donors in real time of what’s going on and so forth and show the people that were actually helping in the cause. So so we have seen that in the use of annual every time we do the study is without i mean, it happens every time. It’s no annual reports, i don’t want that physical thing, it takes too long, and but we have to look at how millennials are doing things in general, in the consumer side and just in overall is that feedback loops in general have been much quicker. I mean, if you post something on facebook and nobody responds to it, it’s an immediate feedback like i shouldn’t opposed to that as well. So feedback overall in our society has been much quicker. I think the first time i took the g r e i it took me two months to get my my actual score. You had to wait in the mail, and then the last time i took it, which was a while ago, but they had it would tell you right there. You ready to find out your score? And of course, you freak out right in that moment thinking our life is going to be all dependent upon this next thing. Yeah. How important are, um, pictures, pictures and video? Very, very important imagery. And amy’s, they intend, has been doing some great studies around this to that imagery not only has hyre reaction posting commenting and engagement, then just text does to us well, in overlapping text upon imagery we saw really hyre amar’s high action or its high accelerates meaning either, like, retweeting, are commenting or posting upon that. Okay, excellent. Do you do you have time, tio, hang around? Absolutely. Absolutely. Amy, amy just gave me permission toe ask you to stay for for her part now she and i are going to be talking beyond millennials. I love because he’s great amy and i are friends, so okay, i sounded that way, okay? But we’re not going talking only about let millennials, but you’re certainly welcome to participating that part in any other part. But she not going to go a little further wonder teo thie other generations because there are other generations after that was but right now we happen to be talking about millennials. All right, here’s, what we’re going to do, sam, we’re going teo going toe. Go on, dh share, little sponsor information and then tony’s take two, and then amy will join us, and derek is gonna hang out cool. We are able to bring outstanding guests like derek and amy because there are companies that are helping me to produce the show me and everybody who works with me and you know that i am very good about e-giving credit at the end of the show to everybody, who’s, who’s a part of it on one of those sponsors is rally bound, and they’re the ones who i mentioned earlier with derek, they do software for rennes, runs, walks, rides, races, um, joe magee at rally bound will help you set up your campaign, and if you haven’t done this before, then he can be enormously helpful or if you’ve done it before, maybe you’ve used another platform and you not so thrilled or you’re not sure what might be out there for a different kind of peer-to-peer fund-raising management tool, then the best thing to do is talk to joe mcgee, and you could certainly you’ll find their product at rally bound dot com, but you’ll find joe magee at triple eight seven six seven nine o seven six for rally bound. And i’m also grateful that we are brought to you by t b r c cost recovery yourself. Rabinowitz is going to go over your past phone bills looking for errors, services you didn’t order well above market pricing, and when he finds those things which he does in ninety percent of the cases turns out phone phone companies are ah, not so careful, not so scrupulous about what they put on phone bills ninety percent of time he finds a mistake when he does he’s the one who talks to them, he picks up the phone, assuming you still have service and get your money back and you only pay him if in fact he does. So if he doesn’t get money back, you don’t owe him anything. Um, he was telling me about a non-profit where he had he had done some work for a company that maid apart for the mars rover and save them a ton of money. And then a couple of years later, someone from that company moved to a non-profit that woman brought him in, and he was able to find mistakes that equalled about three hundred dollars a month, and he went back three years, so over three hundred hours a month, three years, they’ve got a check for, like twelve thousand. Dollars so it works and you only pay him if he actually get you that money back. Theo sefer benowitz i’ve known him for about ten years and i’m grateful that he’s supporting the show you’ll find him at t brc dot com that’s tango bravo, romeo, charlie for those of you who know the phonetic alphabet that’s from my air force days or two. One two sixto before nine triple xero trc dot com tony’s take to my block this week is a giving tuesday roundup of round ups i have links to coverage from huffington post coverage. Um kruckel philanthropy forbes i have linked to an analysis from beth cantor and even a consultant who said his advice was avoid giving tuesday like the plague. So if you want to run the gamut of giving tuesday analyses and coverage, my blog’s is tony martignetti dot com and that is tony’s take two for friday, thirteenth of december forty eighth show of the year. Holy cow! I don’t want to think about forty eighth show of the year. Aimee semple ward she is high there it’s not your turn to say hi yet. Wait! Jumping the gun on me because i want to give you the proper introduction. Come on, she’s with us from portland, oregon, and she’s, ceo of non-profit technology network and ten her most recent co authored book is social change anytime everywhere her blog’s, amy, sample, war dot or ge on twitter she’s at amy rs ward, and in november, she was named a rising star by portland monthly magazine, so that on her facebook page she’s our own supernova. Amy amy sample ward, how are you doing? Amy, i’m doing okay. I’m actually working from home today to quarantine myself, so i don’t make the rest of the office sick, but other lives i am okay, alright. I’m sorry. You don’t feel good. Um, okay, it’s, one of those things where you know it’s the time of year where you feel fully functional but somehow are very naughty. So i have decided to not but that well, that yeah. Thank you. And thank you for that lovely imagery to it’s. A good thing, it’s. A good thing. This is radio. We’re not video streaming. I don’t know. With the imagery is in the mind. Images is quite sufficient. Okay, you were you were listening. I know. Did you think you wanted teo teo mention ofthe atop your head about millennial engagement? Lots of things i felt like i could have just jumped into that conversation. Okay, i want to see what happens when arika around, okay, so we can pick it up from where you guys were weaken, you know, i’m sure that you have some pieces that you want us to actually cover, but, you know, i think as a starting place the way that i normally talk about piela millennials or how to think about different generational groups with thinking of their advocacy campaigns or general engagements, you know, any anything for your organization? The easiest way i found to talk about the millennial group, which has a millennial? I think i and can talk about ourselves is, teo help people think about it in terms of millennials are kind of naturally community organizer, and when you think about it in that way, you don’t have to think of it. Is this like, you know, well, gosh, what would a millennial want in this campaign if you think of it from the place of you here’s a whole set of, uh, people? Who are naturally inclined to community organizing that a lot of what derek was hyre gliding really just falls into place when you think of anyone who the community organizer like trade, right? So they are at the ready to tap into a network of people they really want to get to be the person who’s connected to your cause, but is able to mobilize people, you know, to take some action. And at the end of the day, you’re probably the word invested in the relationship, not the people they’ve mobilized. You know, those people were there because of an action for this person, you know, is there because they want to be kind of they wanted they want to be the important valuable person that’s able to make action happens. You know, a lot of what derek said ten falls into that category, but i think that’s easier way instead of thinking, oh, gosh, there’s this whole, like bullet list of attributes of these millennials, right? I have to remember all this if you kind of think of it as that’s, a group of people twenty twenties, early thirties that are just naturally community organizer it’s it’s just easier. Wait a bundle it altogether. Derek natural community organizers. Hey, amy. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, this generation has grown up with things like america or on teach for america and all these other incredible programs service learning, involvement and so on. And amy is exactly right. I mean, the goal of somebody to go out and say, i want to do good, and i just want to rally my friends around doing good is so high with the generation, and we can see that every time when somebody says they’re in whether it’s in social media are whether it’s through text or whether it’s just two interpersonal saying, i want to go do something good and here it is and will you come along and sort of naturally organized together, let’s, talk a little about something that i think derek mentioned. Amy, you and i are going to explore the other the other generations to ok, and derek right has to catch a plane so he’s got two minutes or just so let’s go to him first. The decline in facebook among millennials planning facebook users yeah, you know, there’s, there’s, there’s a lot of individuals, and i’d love to hear it, amy has the sand is there’s a lot of researchers that have some assumptions as to why that is occurring. Parents are on their other things it’s just grown up, but i don’t there’s nothing in definitive that says this is exactly why it’s happening, but i will say that there is a rise in the use of imagery overall in marketing and general communication and the ability for us to show visually a cz well, so we haven’t seen that as necessarily a bad it’s just a different environment, and we’ve seen the use of more imagery to just compel other people to get excited, involved or show things about themselves. On how how strong is this declines? It hasn’t been really incredibly bad, you know, it’s still facebook by far is still when we look at the last for in our studies from twenty ages twenty thirty two, that it’s still the number one, but okay, we’ve seen the other ones rise higher, and then facebook has done gone down a little bit on, especially when we’re talking about those lower rungs. The twenty is the early twenties, not necessarily in the hyre ends, okay? Excellent. All right, so i think we have to let you go, but i’ll listen to you because i want to hear it. Okay, listen, in the cab, another cab drive will be involved. You headed to la guardia? Yes. Okay. That’s the easiest one to get through. Derek feldman leads the research team on the millennial impact project ceo of achieve and i would say let’s engagement is most prevalent on social networks. You’ll find him at derek feldman, spelled with two ends on twitter. Derek, thanks so much. Take a real pleasure. Thank you. Okay. I mean, you’re stuck with just me. It was fun having a bit of ah, like relay hand over wei together. Now. Well, we’ll race to the finish was like those relay races. Yeah, and i and i have my my, my, i’m not going to say the word i was gonna say snotty, but i’m not a partner in the relay. What’s your sense of the declining number still very deep penetration, but declining usage of facebook among those in the low twenties. Yeah, to derek’s point like i agree that everyone is their own effort. Um oh, gosh, this is why it’s happening, i wouldn’t just because there could bring it up. You know, i would argue against the theory that, you know, young people don’t want to be on facebook now the parents are on their of all of the generation, you know, young people are very used to having privacy profiles because unlike many, many people who were, you know, already an adult, when they got on the internet for the first time or really started creating some sort of online persona, young people have been doing that there were six, you know, like they were used to having to fill out everything check how they were set up, and i wouldn’t say, you know, young people don’t want to be on there since their parents, they just, you know, how to block their parent’s home in a way that maybe their parents don’t know andi, but he knows the latest numbers at least that i’ve been looking at, and i’m happy to send you like a long list of links that maybe you could put upon the blonde tony for folks that are listening and want to go. Just read through a bunch of the latest numbers through different platforms firm, you know, it’s really showing twitter as that surprising place. So if you know young people aren’t adopting book, we’ll have adopted something, right? So what is that other thing? For the most part, it looks like it’s twitter on and with that and then a couple other newer tools that are emerging that we could talk about a little bit later and and what that says to me, when you think about, you know what, twitter is, how it works on some of these other newer platforms compared to facebook. Well, they’re just simpler, you know, like when was the last time you saw your facebook this morning? Yesterday something and you just there’s just so much going on and not in a oh, my friends are so busy kind away in a is a platform filled with things there’s ads and there’s pages and there’s people in there so much, chef, when when we see, you know, drop in this in this eighteen to thirty four category and they’re moving to twitter that says to me they just want something that’s lightweight, simple they can easily do from their mobile phones, you know, the percentage. Of users on their mobile phone, especially in this younger demographic, is extremely high, so i push you want something really easy to just open up on your phone? You know, send a message check who talked to you that new a direct message, you know, whatever, it it totally makes sense to me that that they’re moving to something that’s more streamlined. Okay, maybe i could get you to add that the list of research to the could you put that on the facebook page for us? Yeah, sure. Okay. That’s a better place. I think more people engage with facebook then, then the blogged once the show is over. Okay, thank you. Um, let’s, let’s. Move away from the millennials and move to the next generation you have. Ah, you have some preferred channels for our gen xers. Say, roughly ages thirty three to forty. Yeah, nothing really starts. You know, you still see pretty strong facebook numbers, but you also after you leave this eighteen thirty whatever number on get into that next generation, or even the next couple generations is when you also see lincoln azua latto hyre semper. Because these are people, you know, kind. Of firmly situated in their career and for many people in those generations where you’re maybe a little bit further from college or high school friends, you know, our people that maybe you live in us, you know, fun apartment building and it’s, a sitcom on beauty, i don’t know and you know, you’re in a place where really it’s so it’s, so rational connections that are your network, maybe with millennials where we’re saying no it’s their friends, that their trying to mobilize to participate in the campaign with them the next couple generations, they’re using tools like facebook and linkedin as really a professional place, you know, people, they know the ones that end of the conference or that, you know, they schnoll the product teo or whatever that is. Those other platforms have seen a lincoln is very much a social platform with updates and messages and all the rest, you know, it makes sense that facebook and lincoln pretty high there. Do we have numbers? Oh, are we? Let me ask, how do we measure usages? A like number of hours per week or number of hours per month on a different planet wasn’t michelle all of these different platforms are measuring things differently, of course, on dh, you know, i would say when and i’ll post latto these links so folks can go through and look at it with their own lens for maybe the ages of folks they’re they’re trying to engage with, but the thing that is really important to try and get teo not everyone makes it very easy to find is the difference between total registered users and act e-giving users that her fogging into that platform, at least, you know, warns a month or however they define active because, you know, there could be a hundred tons of people that had signed up, but i have never loved in. So are they really your user on that a tricky thing, especially in the larger platform to find how many of these people, you know, when they’re saying the billions of users, how many of them are using the platform vs have ever signed up? Okay, all right, we got to take a break for a couple minutes. Amy and i are we’ll continue talking about engaging by age, and we’ll continue on talking about the older generations, so hang in. There. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Shin are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz it’s, a conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping countries. 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I’m sorry, i have to keep it too good to live listener love, because i don’t know how to welcome you in sweden, tokyo and saitama, japan. Konnichiwa, amy, what what engagement ideas do you have for tapping gen x, knowing that they’re spending more time on linked in than people who are younger, and they’re also, but they’re also on facebook a good bit. So i really like when when you and eric were chatting before and he was saying you lied with what that cause actions could be right away, because because people want to in that millennial generation, actually try it on, like, great, let me share this petition and see if any of my friends we asked to it and that’s kind of their way of gauging, you know, how well that’s going to stick for me? Because taking that action and being part of the organization is really a relationship and not just that transactions when we think about that next couple generations up who are maybe more boat gets on lengthen and facebook, there’s there’s still an opportunity for sharing, but what they’re going to share maybe isn’t the same kind of lightweight action in this more, especially when you’re thinking of those platforms with a professional presence that content is more positioning the poster, the user and someone who’s either very well connected, you know, they know the people that wrote that log post, etcetera, or they’re well informed, so they’re the first one to know about that topic or, you know, the first one to maybe not. Even the first one, but the one who has the most insight on a news story or a report that was just helpless, etcetera. So as an organization, how you can support that by saying, oh, as far as our supporters of people who’ve taken action, etcetera, we want to be sure you’re in the loop with the latest information on this topic or, you know, whatever it is that they are inclined to share your information where maybe they don’t as millennials, they’re not looking for all the times actions to be promoting to their network and said they want then that show, you know, they are really on top of this topic they really know about this issue, you know, they’re on top of the news, giving them some sort of, you know, easy and regular way get that content and share it so that their position in their network as that you know, smart person, how is that done on linked in? If i if i see, say, slideshare on linkedin imbedded or video or something, how do i then share that within linked in? Can i can i do that? I attended where you see it? So lincoln has, you know, they have invented application, so so i can for temple on my linkedin page, anytime i ask something the slideshare it just automatically shows up there, you might see it, but that’s different than if i were to actually, like, post a link to it, where is more of us? I don’t know what phrase they use, but like a status update, you know, i’m actually posting it into the network instead of just having it show up on my own profile. No, but i think a lot of organizations are trying out having a page, having a group all the different kind of organizational presence he says in lincoln as ways to post that information. So the people who follow that pager part of that group are getting it, but then they can re purpose it in their own channels on their own profile, etcetera. So that would be something that would be worthwhile for an organisation to test whether they’re goingto embed something or make it a discussion topic with a link. Exactly. Ok, cool. Yeah, i’m actually i’m all right. Um, okay, just before we before we leave generation x, which you’re aspiring to. I don’t know how close you are to it. But you’re. You’ll get there. And then after that, we’re gonna move into my generation. So since we’re any, any, any last tip you wanna leave us for for generation x. No, but i would say, you know, at least your last point there about really testing things it’s important, especially with this your generation accident, i think the lost generation, where a lot of people within those age groups maybe feel more aligned with one of the other groups, either the ones you know, slightly older, slightly younger than them. And so, you know, the end of the day, we’re all beautiful, like humans, and we want to be treated, you know, like on individual, so don’t just say, like, squash while everybody on our facebook page is thirty eight, this is exactly how they’re going to respond to our content. You’re still gonna have to test it, and you’re gonna have to figure out and pay attention, you know, what’s working what isn’t? How do we better, you know, provide content to our supporters? Okay, let’s, let’s, talk about the boomers a little bit. What? What? What kind of what kind of penetration do you see him in the various platforms? You know, they’re pretty good penetration, i guess. But it’s not no it’s. Just not going to be a natural tendencies the way younger generations, you know, wouldn’t. Think twice about getting out. You know how many times i’m in a situation where there’s people of all different generations at a table, you know what, a conference for example, everyone’s talking about something? There’s a disagreement about that fact and everyone at the table who’s under thirty five immediately take out their smartphones like, well, let me just do a search and find the answer no, no problem and everyone else it’s over thirty five tables like, well, let’s, just keep talking about it. You know what? Just to have an argument about it until we reach our own conclusion and, you know, the other half the tables like, oh, no, down on wikipedia, here’s the answer we’re done. So even though they’re there are fairly good numbers of boomers on these different channels, it’s gonna have to be an intentional decision. You know, they’re probably going to choose facebook because they have friends and family on facebook or they’re going teo you, it means they’re going to choose something. Were there enough of their network is already there before they make that decision. So that’s, really generation that uc has the most, um, most impact based on how popular is tougher, you know, you don’t see a lot of rumors like out there adopting brand new social channels that no one else is on because they’re only doing it for the connections in their family, you know, they’re definitely the followers. They don’t need to be the first, you know, out on the front here of the internet, right? Do not early. Do not early adopters. Okay, right. I think we have our topics for for next time when you’re on in january, which will be, well, continue a little more with baby boomers. And then you have cem cem platforms for twenty fourteen that we want to look at. Yeah, definitely. Okay, uh, give me a thirty second style stop. Well, you know, here in oregon, it was on that usually cold last week. I don’t know how new york once it was actually unseasonably cold or just reasonably dinner. But in oregon, it was much colder than than usual and office suffered because it meant half of the heaters were, like, roaring and the other half kind of puttered out and gave up. So my style tips and this could be only for me and is the most practical thing ever on that is to organize my my sweaters and like part against etcetera. Sai how heavy they are. So i kept one in the office that was very heavy. And then i kept one in the car that was lighter so that i could determine as they went through my day, something that still matched but was different weights because it was so called and then so hot on ly from amy sample ward, thank you very much. Her blog’s amy sample board dot org’s and on twitter she’s at amy rs ward. Thank you very much, amy springstead elearning next week, it’s going to an archive broadcast? I couldn’t get anybody to commit for december twentieth, but we have over one hundred, seven hundred seventy shows to choose from exactly fact. Next week. Last week was one hundred seventy, so i will pick you a winner for next week’s archive broadcast were brought to you by rally bound dot com and t brc dot com good people, please talk to them. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam leave wits is a line producer, shows social media is by deborah askanase of community organizer two point. Oh, and there are producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules that cool music is by scott stein. I hope you’ll be cool, and you’ll be with me next. Friday went to two p m eastern at talking alternative dot com. E-giving didn’t think that shooting. Good ending. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, waiting to get in. Are you a female entrepreneur? Ready to break through? Join us at sixty body sassy sol, where women are empowered to ask one received what they truly want in love, life and business. Tune in thursday, said noon eastern time to learn tips and juicy secrets from inspiring women and men who, there to define their success, get inspired, stay motivated and to find your version of giant success with sexy body sake. Soul. Every thursday ad, men in new york times on talking alternative that calms. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three that’s to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. I’m the aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent fund-raising board relations, social media, my guests and i cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern at talking alternative dot com. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office needs better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills. Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. 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161: Nonprofit Outcomes Toolbox & Optimize Your Social Profiles – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Dr. Robert Penna, author of “The Nonprofit Outcomes Toolbox.”

Amy Sample Ward, CEO of Nonprofit Technology Network (NTEN) and co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere”

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

View Full Transcript
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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i hope you were with me last week. I’d suffer ventricular ticket. I screwed that up. I’d suffer ventricular tachycardia if it came to my attention became within my ken that you had missed the non-profit outcomes toolbox. Dr robert penna, author of the non-profit outcomes toolbox, discussed the wave of reliance on outcomes measurement and gave concrete steps and tools so that small and midsize shops khun stay ahead of the trend toward outcomes assessment. That was part one of our interview from an earlier show and news sources new source maria simple are doi n of dirt cheap and free ideas is also the prospect finder, and last week she had advice for you on which news sources are best for your research and also a new free source from the foundation center foundation directory online this week, the non-profit outcomes toolbox part do from a previous show and optimize your social profiles. Amy sample ward, our social media contributor, has tips to find tune your profiles on the social networks like twitter and facebook. While staying true to mission and brand also using your profiles to promote campaigns and amy’s sixty seconds style stop she’s, the ceo of non-profit technology network and ten and her book is social change any time everywhere got lots of guests live in the studio is going to be lots of extra special live listener love as well as everybody listening worldwide. We’ll get to that right now. We’ll get to my previous interview with dr robert penna and the non-profit outcomes toolbox, bringing robert penna welcoming him back now, we were just before the break talking about the outcome statement should be meaningful, achievable, sustainable on dh the book goes into a little more detail, even oh, and i’d like to because i’d like to help our listeners achieve an outcome statement. You say that should be bound in time and number the outcome statement. What does that mean? Well, what it basically means is rather than saying, we’re going to change the world, it’s, that we’re going to specifically a change ah, certain measurable of facet of characteristic of someone for a certain number of people within a certain given period of time, so the idea said we’re going to achieve x for why number of people within two months, three months, one year, whatever it may be so that the idea is that first off it’s it’s tethered to ah, a certain number of people that you’re going teo achieve this for, and also a certain specific times. So that, for example, the investor knows when the payoff comes, let me give you another reason why this is crucial if you were if you read the book and i know you know you did, you probably came across the work capacity ten thousand times capacity. You don’t have to read the book to hear about capacity over the building, and i don’t know, but over here, this is a very, very specific use. If you haven’t outcomes approach, it automatically begs the capacity question, because if you are clear about what it is you want to achieve from that flows what it is you need to get there, which then challenges you to say, do i have that capacity most non-profits and i hate to use generalizations, but i think in this case, it’s true, most on profits and most people who are aware of the non-profit space, when you talk about capacity building the first thing they will think about his dollar signs. All right, we’re having a pass it e capacity raising effort. What? It’s a fund raiser. True capacity, however, has three levels. All right. The first one is structural capacity. How is the organization run? How is it managed? What’s the relationship between the board and the executive leadership what’s the quality of the training of the staff, et cetera. The second is what i call functional capacity. Basically, what that means is if you go, you do have the tools to do what you say you’re going to do. If you were an education organization, then you need educators. You need a curriculum. If you’re counseling organization unique counselors and you need some sort of models, they’re all your inputs. Yes, exactly. The third one, and perhaps the most important one is the implementation capacity. The’s are the thousand and one little things that not just non-profits, but anybody trips up, trips over when it comes to actually doing a job, it could be, for example, twenty. You or i are going to put up a curtain rod and it turns out, we don’t have a level. Well, if we don’t have a level, how we’re gonna make sure the curtain rod is level that’s an implementation capacity issue when you talk about a non-profit it could be everything from the from the requirement to provide transportation so the clients could actually get there to something like intake if you want. If you’re goingto have seventy five people, let us say graduate from your program will do you have the capacity for a nen take to actually process those seventy five people? So they’re not standing on line three hours and losing interest in wandering away who’s going to answer the phones let’s say you have a a an outreach effort going on and you have a training program and you put the word out on the street. But then it turns out that your non-profit is really run all by part timers, and most of the time, if anybody calls to get information, they’re either going to get just a phone that rings or they’re going to get an answering machine. That’s a capacity questions. So if you’re doing this correctly, it really forces you to look at a number. Of things including the capacity that you have to actually achieve the goals. If you don’t have it, then you either have to upgrade the capacity nufer have scaled back the goals and flowing from this quantification of of what you want outcomes to be is measurable because they become measurable when you’ve quantified and bound in-kind time number so we can, in fact, measure things that are i have previously been so just vague sort of objectives. Let me give you a classic example on this may sound like a bit of a stretch to euro to your readers, but you and i being roughly the same age, i think you have. You have readers we have listen that’s, right, our reader listeners, because they’re all gonna buy your book, my readers, just the non-profit outcomes toolbox published by wile e you recall when when when we were kids, we had things like, you know, lincoln logs and the directors were there, and they were even wood and the logs were made for right? Okay, this is going to sound like a bit of a weird one, but compare, think back, compare when you’re building one of those things. Too. When your mother built a big cake, your mother baked the cakes you took all the ingredients she pour them in a bowl should put him in a pan, she put in the oven and she lost at that point total control of what was going on. No one’s going to know whether cake was good or bad until after it was done. It came out. It was cool when you tasted it, and if something were on, there was nothing you could do. Thinking back, however, to the example, the lincoln logs with the tinker toys, the directors that we had a guide. The guide showed a step by step where we should be at every point in time if at any point in time, what we’re building didn’t look like the picture we could stop, we could go back and we could fix it, that’s one of the differences of working with outcomes as opposed to not when you don’t work without comes we have to be the only position you’re in is to hope for a good end result, but you can’t control it because you have no idea, really what’s going on with the variables. If you’re tracking using an outcome system, all right, and it is bound in time and is bound in number, and you do know that by a certain date x number of people should be at stage four. If they’re not there, then you still have time to fix it. If you have no clue where they’re supposed to be, or what we could do was hope for good results of the end. And if you don’t get it, well, then we did. You say sorry, better luck. Next time, you don’t know that as a child actually had an easy bake oven, i didn’t have the lincoln logs. My brother had elearning logs. I had the easy bake oven. They should also be your outcome statement verifiable, and this is all really, i’m i’m breaking it down the way you do in the book, but just flows naturally from the way you’re describing it. We have to be able to verify where we are time versus goal on dh and reassess, say more about verifiability. Verifiability basically means that some third party can look at it without spending a ton of money, because again, and this is that not to take anything away from professional evaluators, but evaluation cost money and professional evaluators and professional valuation services. I mean, these people are very good at what they do, but the point is that hopefully what you’re doing is verifiable in the easier way i mean, is there’s an old saying, you know, chicken soup is good for the soul? Well, it could be, but it’s, hard to tell. You know, what you want to do is you want to stick to things that have some fairly easily discernible evidence that can be seen and that’s what it means, my verifiable it means staying away from outcomes to talkabout, as you said before, well, somebody feels better about themselves in their place in the universe? Well, that’s a little bit nebulous. And so i would recommend that if you’re looking to create a good outcome statement, a good outcome for your program that you stay away from the cosmic, the psychic, the overly emotional and definitely the extraterrestrial. Okay, so first step to create a proper outcome statement is what decide what you want to be different at the end of this program. So you’re definitely looking forward toward the end, with the end in mind begins, and you say that the book begin with the engine dart with what do you want to be different about a certain situation or a certain set of conditions as a result of your program, start there. If you can’t define it, then maybe should rethink what you’re doing and in determining that you need to be bound in number and time and those miserable those of the descriptions as you working back, which is yes, but the idea is what you wanted start with is a change you want to start with being able to define a change. We’ve kind of alluded to this, but the basic basic idea of the changes what’s called the backs measures change in the behavior, attitude, condition, knowledge or status of those you seek to serve. So you start with the change in their behavior, their attitude, that condition and knowledge or the status and it doesn’t have to be a person. It could be a forest that could be it could could be a watershed. The status goes from being threatened to not tear being safe to being protected. But the idea is you start with the change and defining if you can’t define it, then my suggestion is you start to rethink a lot of organizations. Start with the problem. And then the next question is, what do we do? Well, what do we do? That’s that’s. The wrong place to start the place to start is first off. What changes do we want to bring about? Secondly, what resource is will it take to do that? Thirdly, you know what actions or programs will it take to effectuate that it’s? A total reverse of the usual way of approaching most of these issues. That’s. Ah, sort of a summary of of developing your own outcome statement. And there’s, obviously a lot more detail. In the book again, the book is the non-profit outcomes toolbox, we have just about a minute before the break, how do we start to apply on outcomes analysis? You have a lot of tools in the book, but how do we get there? Well, first off an easy thing by the book, but beyond that, there are any number of very, very thoughtful people who have created some of these tools that are out there. The problem is that most non-profits i don’t know about them. Everybody, for example, is heard of the logic model. Well, what they don’t understand what the logic model was originally intended to do was to intended to be a supposed to the way a lot of people are suggesting it be used. Today there are alternatives to this, and the book is one way of finding out about them, and reinventing the wheel is not necessary. These wheels have already being been admitted to the question is knowing which ones work for you. And that was the whole concept behind the toolbox approach to the book that perhaps we can talk about after the break. Okay, way are going to take a break. If you’ve not heard of the logic model, then you’re with me. So i’m going to ask robert after the break to just briefly talk about that. And then we’re going to talk about some of tools and lessons you can learn from the for-profit from the corporate sector in outcomes measurement. This is tony martignetti non-profit radio stay with us. 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What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. Very sharp. Your neo-sage. Tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s. Ivory tower radio, dot com e every time i was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com dahna welcome back to the show. Our last segment. Let’s define the logic model because maybe i know it by a different name, robert, but you may know that what is that? That is actually the name of it, of the logic model is a away that non-profits have had for some years now of planned it’s, one of the tools that they’ve used for planning how to get to the outcomes from the starting point. But the logic model became very well known when kellogg adopted at the kellogg foundation. Same is the cereal people, the telephone, isha and united way of america adopted. And in both of those cases they kind of put the word out amongst their there either case of kellogg, that grantees, and in case of the united way of america, the local affiliates, that this was one of the earliest outcomes frameworks that you could potentially use not doing under do plug. But in my previous book, outcome frameworks, that was one of the things we talked about, because the idea was there were these various models, and how do they compare one to the other? And what were the pluses and minuses of all of them that had never been done before? Which is why i wrote that previous book, but the logic model truly was meant as a graphic illustration of cause and effect within a program that this input will lead to that which will lead to the third, which will lead to the fourth and hopefully get you two the the the the end point that you that you desire, the problem is it was never actually designed to be a management or tracking tool. And when organizations and there are a lot of people, very thoughtful people who do use it for this personally, i think it’s cumbersome and what you wind up with since the whole design was a flow chart, very often you wind up with all of these various lines at the doubling back on each other. So some of someone i know, okay, so we’re past that now that we’re in the outcomes toolbox, right? And why did you choose the toolbox metaphor? Kinds of the toolbox was very simple. Let’s go back to that curtain, rod, you and i, we’re going to put a human. You don’t go back to my eagle scout. No, no, i’m still sinjin. I’m going to go back. To the curtain rod, you’re not going to put up a few minutes ago without the level. Let’s say you’re putting up the curtain, ron and all the tools you had. We were craftsman. And at one point you needed that level that i mentioned and you say, bob, give me a level. Well, if the level i gave you was a stanley, would you refuse to use it? Because it was a question like all the other tools? Probably not. You would. You would use the tools at hand. Okay. In that non-profit space, most of these frameworks, our proprietary, this one belongs to ran. That one belongs to the rental of ill institute, the third one’s associated with this with this person or this institution. As a result, what traditionally happened was, let us say, a representative of that organization or the consultant came in and they would wind up basically saying to non-profits my model b a, b, c or d it’s the bass dramatic of outcome frameworks. It slices it, dices it chops, it walks the dog. It does everything. The problem is, none of them do everything. All of them do something. All of them. Do several somethings some of them do some things very well, but none of them do everything well. And so what we wound up doing was inadvertently offering them the space, a defense, eighty percent solutions to one hundred percent problems. It’s telling people, for example, that the logic model was the be all and end all was one such example. My concept is, and the reason is called the toolbox in the book, i do not care about the authorship, the ownership, the providence or anything else about any of these tools. If it works, i want you to use it, and i’m not going to tell you not to use it because you’re not using the other pieces of the same sex that’s the concept truly a toolbox reaching grab what works for you, and if you’re not oriented towards tools, think about it as a kitchen, you know, again, you know, if you have ah, you know, one brand of, you know, say, blender and another brand of you’re not going to not use them to the same meal because the different brands you’re going to use, what you need now, you’re in my space because now i mean that’s for my easy bake oven days. Okay, right. The kitchenware. That’s. What if that’s why i went there? I can see that was resonating with much more comfortable with spatulas than i am. Phillips head screwdriver. First time i used when i had to go to the emergency room that’s because you were trying to scrape a pan with. So the book has a lot of model of of these tools. Talks about, i don’t know, maybe a dozen or so. Some of the simplest ones are you get what you measure results based accountability, even one from mckinsey and company capacity assessment tool. But maybe not those necessary. But a lot of the tools in the toolbox do emanate from corporate outcomes. Measurements. Some of the some of the latter ones. A lot of, you know, there’s. A lot of what are what? No. Why is it translatable? I mean, from for-profit enough, for-profit you know, a lot of times not-for-profits community is worried about things that come from corporations. Yeah, with peter drucker. Except for money. Then i will write a cz investigators investors. But but now there is that fear. What were some of the lessons peter drucker made the comment that non-profit should be run more like business. And everyone thought that, you know, he was he was the prostate, and he was ah, heretical and my god, you know, corporations of big, nasty things. And after all we care, you know, we were the non-profit sector. The truth of the matter is that no one is more interested in outcomes in the corporate world. Now they tend to call the court that their outcomes profitability, market share, etcetera. But the idea is they’ve been leading the way literally since, you know henry ford was putting model tease out of on assembly line, there are tools, for example, like six sigma, there are tools eichsteadt saying, sabat against there are tools like six, six, six sigma six sigma. The question is, what the hells of sigma and where the six of them that’s explained in the book it’s basically a measure of quality. All right, six sigma focuses on how many failure rates are there per million opportunities to fail. I mean, you don’t really have to get into that, but the concept is it has some key insight something for example, like t q m t q jargon jail. Oh, ok, you know, you know, take your total quality, man. You know, i didn’t know what i mean. That’s what a quantum! And i’m not gonna go lock myself in georgian jail. What it means is critical to quality most non-profits when they’re designing a programme, do not ask this question, as the corporate world does with corporal world is launching and launching an effort one of the first things under six six but they would do is say, what is the most critical part of this that we need to have? If a non-profit were to adopt that kind of that kind of concept and that kind of analysis, it could go very, very far towards helping them focus on the most important parts of a program, the key things that they absolutely must have. But this is a a perspective that is very often far into the non-profit space, but very, very built into the corporate space, particularly using something like six sigma, i see a future masters degree in non-profit outcomes engineering yet it’s perfect, exactly there’ll be exactly well, but when we have maybe a moment, so we can talk about something called serve qual, which they use in pizza hut, if you imagine, think a tool from pizza being used in the non-profit space now that’s the that’s the suggestion that we talked about, regrettably, we’re out of moments right of moments, but the lesson is don’t be fearful of what comes from the non-profit from from the for-profit sector because these are all important, easily quantified things that corporations are focusing on, like earnings per share in a quarter, right? Exactly. And how do you get there? What do you need to do to get there? The book is the non-profit outcomes toolbox, a complete guide to program effectiveness, performance measurement and results published by wally wiley and sons, you’ll find robert penn is blogged at outcomes, outcomes toolbox, dot com robert, thank you very much for being on the show. Pleasure. Thank you very much for having it was a pleasure and enjoyed immensely. Thank you. Very valuable interview and and a really valuable book. That non-profit outcomes. Toolbox. I got to start sending live listener love because we have in studio love. It’s. Incredible. My sister in law, christi weber. My niece by marriage. Morocco. Weber. My father in law, which also happens to be by marriage, pete drum, live in the studio, it’s. Unbelievable friends, jason kapoor and mark silverman, friends of mine from here in the city, and i, a visitor from from baden hyre, germany. Julia lights, julia, guten tag, all live listeners, all in the studio. At this moment, of course, we’ve got live listeners around the world, including kandahar, afghanistan, which is where my nephew is listening from shout out to him in afghanistan. Right now, we take a break when we come back. Tony’s, take two, and then amy sample ward, optimize your social profiles hanging there. They didn’t think that shooting, getting dink, dink, dink, dink. You’re listening to the talking alternative network, waiting to get me anything. Nothing. Cubine are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight free that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m ostomel role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re going invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Durney hi, this is claire meyerhoff from the plan giving agency. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at tony martignetti non-profit radio. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent let’s ah, let’s, move into tony’s, take two this week on my blogged is let’s help a non-profit listener listener matt from minnesota, centene emailed me a question that his office was having a problem with seems that about six thousand of their end of year appeal letters went out asking people for the wrong donation amount because the spreadsheets or the query didn’t quite line up on dh. It had incorrect previous year’s donation amounts, so a fifty, dollar donors from two thousand twelve was said in the letter to have given fifteen hundred and was asked for a two thousand dollar gift when something more like seventy five or one hundred would have been appropriate and that went out about six thousand people. So matt was wondering, what do you think we should do? And i’ve got a bunch comments on the blogged from people around the country offering advice, and you can give your advice. Also, most of the comments run along the lines of send a very contrite letter, you know, apologize very explicitly and say that you’re taking steps so that it never happens again and that, you know, we value every donor. We’re very sorry and please don’t stop supporting us that’s the way most of the comments run, but you can give your advice to matt in minnesota, the post is called let’s help a non-profit listener and it’s on my block at tony martignetti dot com. I also want you to know that i’m going to be at bebe con this coming monday. The thirtieth of september b become is the blackbaud conference it’s going to be at the gaylord conference center outside washington, d c i’ll be there all day monday, doing interviews for the show got interviews lined up on mobile giving e-giving tuesday, which is a hashtag on twitter e-giving getting different society level gif ts building a fund-raising board fraud protection and a bunch more amy sample ward will be there as well. I’ll be talking to her as if we don’t talk to her enough, but she’s going to be there be becoming also, and i’m giving away some consulting time on monday. Two hours there’s two different ways to win one hour of consulting time you can either ah tweet on using the hashtag non-profit radio on monday and if you do that, you’ll be entered into a contest, and the other way is if you’re at the big con, come to the stage where i’ll be doing the interviews on the exhibit floor and drop your business card in the bowl and i’ll select a business card at the end of the day and one of you a tte. The conference will win a free hour of consulting it’s your choice can have either plant e-giving consulting or charity registration. Two different ways to win i’m giving away on our of sorry two hours of free consulting on monday, so have to either see you would be become or see your tweets using the hashtag non-profit radio, and that is tony’s take two for friday, twenty seventh of september thirty eighth show of the year. I’m always privilege to welcome amy sample ward back she’s, the ceo of the non-profit technology network, and ten her most recent co authored book is social change anytime everywhere about online multi-channel engagement her block is amy sample, ward, dot or ge and she’s at amy r s ward on twitter. Welcome back, amy, thanks for having me, you sound terrific, you’re you’re in toronto, on skype, right? I am. Can you hear me? Ok, actually, yes, sounds very, very good, actually sounds almost sort of studio quality. You must be in a nice, quiet room. What were you doing in toronto? I i’m not. I’m actually in a hallway, but i’m glad it soon. Good. I’m here for our test interactions with the conference yesterday, and a lot of it was a lot of fun, actually, people from all different sides of the non-profit technology, a topic coming together and a lot of a lot of case studies sharing what they have been working on, things like that, okay? And, uh, you want to share one thing that is memorable for you so far from the conference. I was really excited how many people were there ready to talk about data, not as a like idea, but people saying, oh, so we’ve been measuring x and we have seen this trend have you seen it? You know, and really jumping into commerce stations with the expectation that everyone else was also really looking at their impact, really trying to quantify what they were doing and, you know, share their tips or commiserating in some failures together. Cool sounds like a lot of valuable cross talk, all right? Yeah, i guess you’re going from toronto to washington area for b becomes yes, exactly. Okay, we’ll talk about that a little later. I know i’ll be seeing you there, but we want to talk about today optimizing your social profile. So we’re getting a little a little a little tactical today. Sometimes we’re sometimes were strategic and little, well, theoretical, but always valuable, but today would be a little tactical. Um, wait, we got to keep our social profiles, whether it’s, facebook, twitter, these have to be aligned with our work. How do we how do we make sure we’re doing that? Well, it’s, you know, i think a lot of people start from this place where they have heard that, you know, social channels, all these social profiles are an opportunity to extend their brand or you really make themselves visible out there. And so that here these kind of jargon, jail type phrases and think, oh, great, so we just put up a facebook page and, you know, put slap our logo on it, just like our website. Excuse me. Hey, but in reality, that’s not what? Extending your branded but also doesn’t match what’s happening there. It isn’t a good representation of your mission. So how can those channel really serve that goal? Well, think about it. Not just and here’s your logo and your profile picture, but who are the people behind your organization or who had that? Supporters? You know, how do you how do you let those social channels? The social, but also really clear photos, text, etcetera. You could explain just what you do, you know, it’s an opportunity. All the webs, you know, website like present that different but targeted across across the web. You know what i think about organizations that do kind admission direction well, you, whatever channel you’re on, you know, it’s, but it feels different each one feels like, you know, a different room in the same house, you know, the living room is maybe still the same style of the people that lived there, but it has more couches and maybe a fireplace, and then you go into the kitchen and again, maybe same style of the people that lived there, but this is where, you know, there’s more lights, there’s, a bunch of cookery, etcetera. So so how how do you make that on the different social profiles will, first of all, don’t forget that they’re trying to help you. You know, you don’t want to try and hide all of the different components of that facebook page, for example, let those pieces be there because people on facebook, i expect them to be there used them to your advantage, you know, you don’t and feel the furniture out of every room where all the way across the house really put, you know, make those counters. The best darn couch is, they could be in the living room, even though maybe there you’re branded colors and they met kayman uniform makes sense, but before and even before you start there, i mean, you have to take a look at which channels you should even be in, you know? You’re talking about a lion with where your people are, you know, you you have to know that and what we’re just what sites are appropriate for your for your work and your people exactly, and some of that, you know, i’m always surprised when i think data is important and helpful and valuable, and if you can look at data to say, oh, wow, you know that the demographics of these certain tools or that you know, our our community, probably there that’s only one side of the equation just because you may have a bunch of, you know, parents between the ages of thirty six and forty five in your community, it doesn’t mean that they necessarily want to be engaging with your programs and content on facebook just because demographically, they’re probably on facebook, they maybe see facebook is a, you know, a place to go share photos of beds with their parents. You know what? It’s nine o’clock at night and they’ve finally gotten tohave happen our to themselves, they don’t want to. Spend a half hour with you, you know, maybe there’s a different channel for your for engaging with your community beyond just what the demographics say. So i think you have to also look at what is the content you even delivering just because your people, maybe you’re on twitter, the content you’re sharing with them, maybe can’t ever fit in one hundred forty characters are maybe isn’t something they’re going to pick out of their twitter street. You know anyone? Who’s just opened up twitter and let it sit there it’s just flowing by so finding a match between like you said, your community and the channel, but also your content in the channel and made it may just not make sense to be posted there. Okay, we’re going toe were to take a break on dh. Well, amy and i have ah, well, extra time today, so we’re going to keep talking about aligning your work with the social networks where you where you ought to be, how to keep consistent with the brand and even, you know, if you happen to be in a campaign, how to do that promotion successfully and when we come right back. It’ll be mohr live listener, love. Stay with us. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Lots more live listener love we’ve got listeners in moscow in chung ching, beijing and shenzhen, china, for those in china knee how? Seoul, korea, seoul always checks in always multiple people in seoul i love that anya haserot for our listeners in in korea and also tokio japan frequently have people from japan could each awhile. All right, amy, um let’s, let’s, wait, we got to get to some details here so we don’t leave people which i know concerns you as well, you know, we don’t leave people with more questions than answers, so let’s let’s get in. I mean, how do you how would you test whether twitter that’s a great example because it does go by so fast? What questions would you asked to determine whether twitter is a good platform for you? Treyz well, i mean, i think we’ve talked about this on the show before and that is try to do some research, ask people directly, you know, do you want to be engaging with us on this channel? A are you using this channel? You know, just try and get that information, but there is nothing like the empirical proof of just testing. It and, you know, setting up a profile even if it isn’t, you know, necessarily the most intense organizational profile, and you have a mess of content strategy if you just want to devote a couple weeks testing the channel tested out, see how it goes, keep track of what you’re doing, you know, organisations that have really been able to increase amount of engagement on twitter have done things like, you know, don’t just track all we put, we tweeted, and people reply just but say what time of day did the most retweets happened? Not just when did you tweet, but when we’re other people finding your content and re posting it, you know or how many times did people reply or or retweet a certain post versus another one? Okay, what was special about that content? You know, really tryingto understand the mechanics of what’s going on with the community there because, you know again, it is both the content and the people that your you have to try and match, so testing it out is the only way to really you know, prue? What? What does that what doesn’t work okay? And then, of course, you have all your analytics, the analytical tools also, exactly. Okay, let’s, talk about the profile now, since you know we’re supposed to say we’re focusing on the profile what you get let’s, keep with the twitter example, but then we’ll look at a couple others because you and i have some extra time together today twitter, twitter, your your limited number of characters you khun you can devote to your profile how how do you know what belongs in there? Upleaf well, i think what what belongs first of all is the shortest version of what you can say about your mission. Next is who it is that’s tweeting because at the end of the day, no one thinks it’s actually quote unquote your organization, they know it’s, some staff, a person or people, so call it out, make that transparent, and then leslie is including a link backto either you know what i mean to your website, but i would encourage you not to just use the home page of your website to send people to a more tailored entry, whether that’s, you know, maybe a community page where you linked to your different social profiles and then expect people to be, you know, clicking back and saying, oh, this is where you know they engage or maybe of a specific program area you want a link to but include that direct connection back to the website let’s, talk about facebook profiles. What if you have? If you’ve gone through your analytics, you determine that facebook is a suitable platform for you is what you’re goingto do on your facebook profile. It’s going to be different than twitter? I mean, it allows more media, too. Yeah, exactly. And you know it, what you do with that profile, especially on a channel like facebook where there’s, just so much content opportunity, you’re setting the tone for how you want people to engage with that page, are you? You know you have a really engaging, bright fun, you know, header, photo and and you are posting photos along with your text well, that’s encouraging the community to also pose that you know, that’s, the content they seize on the page, or are you you know, do not even have a header image, and then you just have your logo is your profile photo, and you’re just, you know, constantly posting links. To your website? Well, if that’s the nasty example no one’s going to post because they don’t have a link to your website to share, you know, you really think about it as, like here’s, the example of what you want the community to do and build it out around that which is why, you know, some of the most engaging facebook pages, the ones that have, you know, the most number of people that like it, but also consistently engaged with paige are ones that have photos of the community or, you know, photos from events that the organization has done things where people go to the page and they see it as hears that window into the programs and the impact the organization is having and of course, you want to be there. Don’t you want to be a part of the fun impact and, you know, making that mission happen? Of course, you know, on one side, we certainly think that’s what people be on our website, but they just get so heavy and bogged down with every piece of content we’ve ever created and, you know, on the social profiles we get highlights the really great engaging pieces first, here we are talking about twitter and i get a little phone quick phone alerts when i give a new twitter follower. I just got a new twitter follower as we’re sitting here talking about twitter kapin remind, you have to be my niece who’s sitting in the studio, but no would take whatever the hell we can get it. And if you want to join my niece, you khun, you can follow me at tony martignetti um, let’s let’s keep keep going because, you know, i get i get a little ah troubled, always talking about twitter and facebook. Let’s, let’s, pick another couple profile what’s, another what’s, another another site that you see non-profits spending time on and doing well and again after you’ve been through your own analytics and you’ve tested it as amy was describing, you’ve described that this other channel, which is about to talk about, might make sense for you. What? What should your profile look like on that channel? What do want talk about amy? You know, i’ve seen some non-profits re certainly really doing a great job on instagram and, you know, it’s, obviously a morning platforms so you’re not going to see, you know, on facebook, sometimes you see a big organization has, like, you know, a thousand likes on a poster on a image, and you’re just not going to have a thousand likes on your instagram photo or video, but you’re still gonna have some, you know, andi, what i think is great is that organization you’re already planning and creating this content well, you have images, and you you have what, mr graham? So, you know, each channel could be the same quote unquote, like horse, which is packaged in different ways that makes sense for that channel. So including instagram in your your list of outlets, i think it’s great a great thing to test out to try see if you have community there because it’s so unlike facebook, where if you posted, you know, multiple posts and multiple photos and one day people would, you know, get a little turned off the algorithm is hiding your post already from, you know, most of your your fans, instagram there’s, no filter, no one, you know, whatever isn’t in the cds in the feed and it’s not the kind of channel where organizations they’re saying like if you post multiple times in a day, people are getting tired of it instead they’re like oh, cool, what are you doing now? You know, because that’s, the culture of that channel is cool. What what’s the photo? What are you doing now? And just kind of scrolling through them? Okay, now you and i devoted segment not too long ago, teo tumbler so and listeners could go back and look for that. So we’ll we’ll skip tumbler, but what’s, another what’s, another site you you’d like to talk about? Same, you know, same same you know what? What should you profile be focused on? Yeah, i mean, i think one as faras like this conversation of extending your brand and really you leveraging what the components of that platform are to engage people, you’ll bring them into your content. I think youtube is super underutilized because for non-profits you can have so many of the additional youtube customization tools and components for free so you can have a totally branded youtube channel. You could have called action and your video i mean there’s just so much that non-profits they’re missing out because, you know, even if you don’t have huge, like documentaries it’s not hard to create videos, especially now that, you know we’re all we’re all create them with their phone, even so having these short pieces, whether captured at events or, you know, even like a thirty second video that says we’re about to launch a campaign tomorrow you get ready and it’s just it’s just kind of there to make people feel like they’re in the know, and they’re part of your work again because you can post it to a channel that’s totally branded you could have, like, like folders, you know, hear all the videos about this topic on people can scroll through, i think there’s a lot of potential with youtube non-profit durney kapin okay, maybe we should devote a show. Teo youtube. Okay, okay. And those folders appreciated referring teo playlists. You can have a playlist on different topics like on mind theirs. B b com twenty twelve there’s different conferences have been too there’s. One for stand up comedy, i think that’s the folders you’re referring to yet played their playlist. Okay, okay. All right. You know, since we have the luxury of time, is there one more channel? You want to. You want to talk about? Hyre no. Okay, i don’t want to just spot, okay? Okay. Because you think about it. That’s ok? We got it. We got other topics. We don’t talk about depth on channels. Um, let’s, talk about your campaign. If you happen to have a campaign, whether it’s a thirty day campaign or, you know, a more traditional sort of campaigns, you know, might last three year, three, four years, you know, some capital campaigns go on that long. How do you expose that campaign within your within these the social sites profiles? Well, and then this goes back to the earlier point about really taking advantage of the specific functionality that each platform has, you know, unique teo like with facebook because that’s leverage that is very in the example. You have two photos that you get to take advantage of. You have that big header image, but then you also have your profile photo, and again, just how you are setting the tone for the kind of engagement you want there campaigns have also been really successful at taking advantage of that profile photo and encouraging people to eat to share that and they get their own profile photo. And really spreading the campaign message or brand that way, you know, because it’s facebook makes it very easy just click on something and say, make-a-wish my probono so where, you know, on other channels, it may not be quite as easy, but you see, you see similar profile photo based campaign extensions on twitter, you know, where they have, you know, i think it’s called a women are things like that where you’re just adding kind of an image layer on top of the photo, so it has a little, you know, i’m sure you’ve seen them stars are a little banner along the bottom that says, you know, media campaign hashtag etcetera so i think that’s a really clear called action for a campaign is like, okay, today we’re launching everyone make this your profile photo, for example, andi, i think one of the most recent, very large scale example that that was the hrc campaign about turning facebook red. Okay? Ohh even write human rights campaign. Yes. Ok. Yeah. And you know beyond just the image on the on the various profiles associated to a campaign. You also have the opportunity. If you are, you say running. A campaign where you’re really encouraging engagement on twitter and you know you have a pacific campaign hashtag go edit your twitter bio to say we are running this campaign the hashtag learned more so that as people retweets your tweets and they’re like, oh, my retreated this, i’m going to check him out, they don’t open up, you know your twitter profile and see okay, you’re some organization based wherever you know, make sure that you’re you’re actually updating the profile information on the different channels when you’re running a campaign and not just the image or don’t just start posting the content, make sure that you know the profile itself when people find you explain the campaign and just your organization. It’s probably so easy to forget toe update your profile here you are doing all this multi-channel strategy around a campaign on don’t forget toa talk about it and you’re and publicizing your profiles exactly because you set the profile up, you know it’s, not something that people keep up to date and that’s that’s sort of i mean, that’s really subsumed everything everything you’re saying you got news all the time profile is not something you only look at when you set up the accountant on don’t look at it that’s all subsumed in what you’re saying, right? Okay, especially during campaign times when you’re getting in theory, hopefully a lot more new people singing your social profile. Well, they’re saying that for the first time, they want to know why. Five friends, we’re just talking about you and of all that you have is information about your general mission. Well, they don’t know why they’re friends were talking about you, you know, it’s a great place to put some of those campaign hooks and called action just in a couple of minutes. We want to emphasize something that you and i have always talked about. This is not only multi-channel online, but you’re offline strategies have to coordinate with all this as well. Exactly. So that was your if you are planning to have any direct mail pieces, you know, make sure those match up and it’s a great way to think we checked before time. Direct mail drops with when you launch things online, so send an email that says, hey, we’re going to be, you know, standing up for this campaign a couple days later and direct mail piece comes and then you know, that same day or the next day, you really launch it on social well, by the time you tweeted they’ve already seen it three times in really personal ways that got emails, they got, you know, postcards and now you posted about it on twitter there, ready to actually engage. Excellent. Okay, we have to leave that topic there. It’s time for your your first sixty second style stop. Wei had this. We’re talking. Yeah, we’re talking about either travel or leisure or food. What? What do you have? Sixty seconds. Only sixty second style stop. Oh, my goodness. Well, i was thinking about this today because i am actually traveling and my at least my personal tip is whatever i need right after i land whether it’s, my pajama or, you know, food, whatever. I put that in my like purser carryon bag because i hate feeling like i have to unpack my entire suitcase just to go to bed when i get to the hotel in the night or something, you know that way, whatever you actually need in your first few hours where you land is in the same bag outstanding. Cool. Thank you for sharing. Yeah. From the hallway in toronto. Amy sample war. Exactly. Any simple board ceo of non-profit technology network you’ll find her blah, gamey sample war dot or ge, and on twitter at amy rs ward and i’ll be seeing you on monday with your co author, alison kapin, right? Yeah, and looking forward to it. Okay, cool metoo haven’t seen you for a while. Bye, amy. I think i got some last minute live listener love new bern, north carolina, paradise valley, arizona bloomfield, new jersey and bill in court, france welcome live listener love and, of course, always to our podcast listeners podcast pleasantries, always grateful for the podcast listeners next week. Roger, matt lov and joy hunter show you are the co authors of non-profit investment and development solutions, a guide to thriving in today’s economy, and they will be with me for the hour over nine thousand leaders, fundraisers and board members of small and midsize charities listen each week, you know how to reach me. If you’d like to talk about sponsoring the show, we’ve got one that’s going to be starting next week, early october. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is our line producer, shows social media is by deborah askanase of community organizer two point. Oh, the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules, and our music is by scott stein. I hope you’ll be with me next friday, one to two p, m eastern on talking alternative broadcasting at talking alternative dot com e-giving didn’t think dick tooting getting thinking. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. E-giving nothing. Good. 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You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication. And the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership? Customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills? 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157: Trim Tab Marketing & More Social, Now What? – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

James Heaton, president and creative director at Tronvig Group

Amy Sample Ward, CEO of Nonprofit Technology Network and co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere”

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. I hope you’re with me last week, i’d suffer pilot nephritis if i learned that you had missed cool crowd funding dahna ostomel, founder and ceo of deposit, a gift, shared her wisdom on how to create a successful crowdsourced campaign from appearance and copy to who you’re reaching and how and in-kind investment anita fi willis, vice president of strategic partnerships at new york, needs you. She and i talked about how to create or grow your in-kind giving program, she stepped through the process from assessment to thank you this week. Trim tab marketing james eaton is president and creative director of the tronvig group. The metaphor of the trim tab as one person who can move an entire society has professional and personal meeting from him. We’ll hear about both of those he explains how something small and seemingly insignificant could make a big difference in your marketing and had to figure out what that small thing is. This is an archive show originally aired on july twentieth last year and more social now what? Amy sample ward, our social media contributor, co author of social change, anytime everywhere and ceo of non-profit technology network, has thoughts about how to manage the internal changes. When you make social media a part of your office culture, amy’s lives and on tony’s, take through this week, take time off. In fact, i’m off this week. Where, ah, were pre recorded. My pleasure. Now, to bring you. James he eaten and trim tab marketing with me now in the studio is james eaton he’s president and creative director of tronvig group. He grew up in florida and left the u s at nineteen for an eight year odyssey in asia, where he had a near death experience in the north of tibet, became a terra bod in buddhist monk in thailand and studied calligraphy in japan. He’s, fluent in japanese and proficient in chinese tronvig group, has worked for clients in a wide variety of business and non-profit categories, including museums, community organizations, funds and think tanks. His philosophy is based on the power and efficiency of truth and importance of doing good in the world. James speaks on marketing and branding, and he blog’s at tronvig group dot com. I’m very pleased that his work and his very interesting background bringing to the studio james welcome. Thank you, pleasure to have you on the show. What is your definition of marketing? Marketing is tactical activity that you engage in on top of your brand messaging so that’s, very dense technical activity, your brand messaging, what does? What does it mean in your heart? So for example, uh, marketing activity will get you to buy a particular toyota s o you’ll see an ad, you’ll say, wow, that’s a great price. I’m going to go buy that toyota, and but that needs to be built on a brand and it’s the brand that allows you to ally yourself within that that product and believe in it so that you will subsequently say, never buy another car other than a toyota for the rest of your life. So the marketing is tactical in the branding is strategic ah, the marketing ask youto to engage in a particular activity make this donation volunteermatch volunteers have to be all about money that’s right here beyond our board and that supported by your mission, you’re your brand or the the the notion in people’s mind of, of why you exist and why you matter so ah, the so marketing is essential as the communication tool to get out a request for specific activity and you want to do this all in your own voice, right. This is why marketing you matters that’s, right? You want to do it such that you are creating a sense of alignment with your with your organizational with your organizational brand. You want them to do what you want them to do. But then, at the end of the day, you also want them to believe it and believe in you and believe that they have done something good. And before they can believe in you. They have to know about you and there’s. Where the right communications eso marketing is communications there’s an interesting statistic that just came out from nancy shorts. Men’s blood getting attention which says that eighty four percent of non-profits characterized their own messages as difficult to remember. Oh, my eighty four percent of non-profit difficult to remember difficulty. Remember how this is a communications, but they know it well. Yeah, then and there’s nowhere. This issue, they know. So, what we gonna do to cut through this so first, uh, one thing that’s important is teo. Not be afraid of marketing. When people think of marketing the i did get a little bit of cold. Feet like this is something that’s going to be costly it’s going to be in order for it to be effective it’s going to have to be big, and for some people it’s just a pejorative term. And for some people it’s a sort of term it’s ugly thing it’s a it’s, a it’s, a it’s, a right it’s a for-profit or it’s a commercial activity that non-profit shouldn’t be engaged in, but actually because it is about communication. If you have an organization whose mission is good who’s doing something good in the world, it’s almost a crime not to communicate that if you don’t communicate that thousands of people who are actually in alignment with what you do, who care deeply about what you do don’t know about it, right, you don’t want to hide and right. So marketing is your is a means teo, get that out in your own voice. Um to those who are already predisposed to want what you do to to want to support what you do. Ah, so it’s not it’s, not about a chain, you know, trying to create a marketing message like a ginsu knife. Kind of like push of course, it’s really about just explaining in ways i think old thirty second infomercials at four in the morning or too expensive, anyway, it can’t be engaging in that. So put those aside no it’s about communicating the true value of of your offerings so that people can understand it with with, with clarity and and and understanding of what there they need need or want to hear. So it’s this overlap this intersection between what you are and what you do and what they’re ready to listen to and to find that place and we’ll talk about. We can talk about that a little more in in a minute, but don’t take over the show we’ll get, we’ll follow my agenda, okay, okay, but we’ll get to that point, but you have some very good ideas. First, about howto identify who these people are, who might be predisposed. We have just about a minute before the break, and then we have lots of time after the break, so we just sort of tease the, uh, the your idea around finding the right people for your message. You have lots of information already, probably about your constituency. Who gives you money? Who comes to your events? Who visits your institution? That data, i cannot just sit idly at the, you know, in the corner somewhere. One of the things that an organization can do that can be tremendously effective in this is something that anyone can do, and it doesn’t require any money at all. And that is to take all that data and build it up into what we call personas teo to make of that information, eh, really, person, something imaginary person that you can talk to that will, that you can use toe bounce off your marketing ideas and your location idea. Okay, we’re going to talk about these personas after the break. Hope you stay with me. Trim tab marketing with james eaton talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Do you need a business plan that can guide your company’s growth? Seven and seven will help bring the changes you need. Wear small business consultants and we pay attention to the details. You may miss our culture and consultant services a guaranteed to lead toe. Right, groat. For your business, call us at nine. One seven eight three, three, four, eight, six zero foreign, no obligation. Free consultation. Check out our website of ww dot covenant seven dot com are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time. Join me. Larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society politics, business it’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. Very sharp. Your neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s ivory. Tower radio. Dot com. Every tower is a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com so let’s, look a little more into these thes personas that may be could be a donor or could be a potential boardmember or maybe some other kind of volunteer. Or how do we identify these people? You want to think about who engages with your organization and essentially list them out first by type? You know we have donorsearch thes general characteristics age, you know, sixty five who’s retired who’s, you know, has time now too volunteer at the organization and so forth. So you you’ll know these people are but what you need to do is too create hey ah, an amalgam of a couple different people, but then make that into a persona that is very specific. So it has a name birthday on address. Particular children, particular pet peeves. Interests? Yeah. Such that you can actually write a journal entry and their in their head a cz if you were them. And of course, you could have multiple personas for each category. You wanna have a view percent might be a teenager. That’s, right? I also be your retiree that’s, right? You want to create a number of them? I think the maximum number is about nine but you want to have these very specific persons and you, khun, you know, grab a picture off the internet, give them a face, make them as real as possible, and you can actually bring them to meeting. What else do we know about them? What? Where they shop exactly where they shop. What? That, what websites they visit? You know what they do in their free time? What their secret fears are? What would be the hope? What would be the worst thing that could possibly imagine happening to them in their entire life for you? So that you create something that’s sort of a sort of psychologically formed imaginary person. And you give it a name and a face, and you use that to look at what you’re doing. Look at oh, we’re going to send this appeal letter out. Well, what would george think of that? And you be george, read the letter and say, well, this is this part of the letter is silly. I don’t i don’t care about that. So it gives you this consumer. Ah, perspective on what it is that you’re trying to say and it can make it substantially better. And it takes some work, but it doesn’t really cost you anything to put this put these personas together and it doesn’t cost you anything to bring them to a meeting and some people, like physically, like, have a little alright, stand on then or do these people talk in the meeting? What are we doing with them? You could so yes, they will criticize and review what you’re planning on doing that the actual program that you’re going to come to put out there, and that gives you this view that internally you don’t have and it’s, like focus group almost, but you but you’ve got this sort of imaginary person in the room and this can be extremely beneficial if particularly you then sort of look at your organization to create a kind of a latto vent diagram. What do we do? What we do this and we do this and we do this and he’s like the three areas of our of our activity. Where do these personas overlay on that you could like? You have little chest piece is almost like where did they sit on this thing? And where is our sweet spot that is? That is going to capture the broadest group of our constituents. And how do we need to talk to them? Who are they? And what language did they understand and will make sense to them? You can then tail your broad brand message. Your your your overall institutional organizational messaging to speak to them it’s one hundred times more reflective already already writing in their voice. I mean, you said you can even write their journalist that’s, right? Right? To write to them right to a specific person and not to this sort of amorphous, fuzzy general audience. And it will make whatever you’re doing one hundred times better. Okay, who do you who should be involved in creating these personas? Well, that’s an interesting thing and and it’s. Okay, say that’s a good question. It is a great. Even though i admonished you before you can say that’s a good question, that’s allowed. Can i tell a little story about this? Sure welcome. Who should? Who should be involved in understanding the consumer’s perspective in relation to an organization? The best answer is everyone that may be impractical, but arnel lehman, the director of the of the brooklyn museum who i think has a kind of a visionary and an adherent to trim, to have marketing, whether he recognises it or not initiated a few months back. A new program on this institution wide program where he requires every single person in the institution, whether the c f o the chief curator or a research associate to sign up on a sheet or not maintenance maintenance on a rolling basis. Ah, spend an hour on the floor of the museum interacting with the general public. Yeah, and just a knauer or an hour a week or just an hour on a rotating basis. So i don’t know how many employees they have. Quite a few, so copy takes a while to get through that cycle. And i think he instituted this, you know, basically with a switch of an aven edict in this case, and i think there was quite a bit of resistance internally to this. But what this does is it gives everyone that kind of on the ground retail insight about the experience of the exhibitions at that museum. Uh, the insights gained there will have, eh, a long term sort of cascading impact on improving everything that they do because they’ll be aware of the ultimate final on the ground, sort of experienced how people are using that museum because they’re interacting with absolutely answering their cause. They get to their watching. Maybe even yes. And i went to an unrelated meeting there recently. And when i came out of the meeting, i went into the great hall, and there was a fantastic exhibition there, and i had to tell somebody about it. So i walked overto this man who looked official. And i started saying, this is an absolutely fantastic exhibition. And, well, what was it? What was it was thie connecting cultures in there in the great hall? Okay. And we started up what turned into a forty five minute conversation about the exhibition and the institution and how it relates to the public. And it turns out that he was serving his his one our mountains from the borders of his three quarters of his one hour, i think, to both of our both of our ar benefits and that it was actually edward bleiberg who’s thie, curator of egyptian cloudgood on ancient eastern art. So but what he learned from you in that forty five minutes, do you think it was very interesting because he had contributed to that exhibition and he was resistant to the notion of that exhibition? And i spent, like fifteen minutes extolling how basically saying why? I thought the exhibition was great. And in fact i brought my kids to the exhibition that the following saturday, and they thought it was great. So he was getting retail in sight. He was getting what? No, i as the actual, like coming to it, knowing nothing about the background or the struggles that led to that exhibition, but the the actual user interface he was getting a firsthand account of how his work and the work of all the other curator’s who worked on that played out on the and this is the this’s, the tactical experiential level which makes all the difference for the success or failure of a particular exhibition, and ultimately of the institution and all that. And in order for that to happen all aren’t a lehman had to do is just have this idea. Yes didn’t cost him a thing. And this would obviously contribute to the creation of the personas? Yes. Okay. James eaton is president and creative director of tronvig group, which you’ll find at tronvig t r o n v g group. Dot com. What is tronvig yeah, that’s. My great uncles name. Carl tronvig emigrated to the united states in the nineteenth century and went to north dakota. Okay, south next-gen in memory, and we’re gonna talk a little about another family member of yours shortly. Let’s, talk about the trim tab. What? What is it? What’s. A trim tab. And why is this trim tab marketing a trim tab is, uh, a little a device the edge of a rudder that helps it turn. But the importance of the trim tab is a metaphor is let’s. Say you’re a child and you’re in a bathtub. And you have a little replica. A miniature replica of the queen elizabeth to this huge ocean liner and it’s floating in the bathtub. And you want to turn it well, the natural reaction would have to be in the tub with my brother. Do i? I hated bathing my brother. You want to turn the ship chips, and i’m there alone, we think my little boat. So you touched the bow, right? To turn the ship. You wanted to go left. So you you touch the touch the bow and that turns the ship. But if you had an actual queen elizabeth to ocean liner and you wanted to turn it by touching the bow, the force required to move the ship by touching the bow is astronomical. So how does this ship actually turn the rudder? Right. The rudder is in fact the size of a house, so i can’t turn it with my own strength. So in fact, on the end of the writer there’s, a little tiny rudder i called a trim tab turns in the opposite directions writer creates a vacuum and allows the rider to swing easily the direction that you wanted to go. Okay, so now if i take that model and i lifted out of the water and i tried to figure out what makes this ship turn it’s going to be very difficult for me to understand that it’s, that little tiny trim tab on the tip of the rudder on the rather runner on the redder, they’re actually allows me to easily turn this ship. So this notion of the obvious small changes that can turn the whole organization is what we’re talking about. This is the notion of a trim tab this’s finding those things that that actually can steer the whole system in the direction you want but are not big, they’re not costly, they’re not. We have this idea that big solutions are big problems have to be solved with big answers that end marketing is one. Of these big answers it’s like oh, well, we need to have more money. Well, let’s, let’s mount a big marketing dr and that there’s big marketing drive is going to give us big results. That notion is flawed and that’s good news for small and midsize charity is very good news in the fact of the matter is that if you think about the system and you think deeply enough about changes that can be made at the user experience level, there are some very minor that’s what i say when i say tactical, they’re very minor changes that can be made that can have the same effect as these big marketing programs were. We recently did a thing for the bronx museum, where we were asked to get more people to come into the museum. Ah wei have a certain amount of money, and they wanted to do a traditional marketing program, you know, bust signs, bus shelters, subway posters and so forth, which we did, but we set aside a little bit of that money to do something else that they didn’t really ask us to do. And that was to change the sign ege on the door and the windows of this at the street level of the museum. Okay, that thousand dollars from the however many thousand dollar budget we had was the best money we spent because that’s what actually brought people? How do you know that? How do you know that? The door sign it and the windows made the difference. Because when we were a few, a few a few things one when we were talking to people as they were walking on the right on the grand concourse, they’ve been there for forty years. Ah, and we were asking people on the street will what’s this. And they were saying, i don’t know they’re working buy-in causevox busy. Is that? Is that a courthouse? I don’t know. And if you looked at it, then considering okay, why don’t they know? Well, let’s, look at it. Oh, okay. There’s. The sign the sign is is way up there over the top of the door and there’s a flag way up there. But people tend not to really look up when they’re walking down the street. So and it’s a beautiful building. But there was nothing on the front door that you could see that the windows there wasn’t really anything that was big and obvious telling you what this was and and they were announcing in this case that they were free. So we put big orange signs in all of these places that you would see on the street and lo and behold, people walk. How come? How can charities find their trim tab? The the example that i give you that i give you a minute ago about understanding who you’re talking to and how they see you is a is a is a kind of trim to have activity the personas as a function of your spending the time because i think any trim tab action requires a kind of research it requires thought you’ve got to find that thing it’s not going to be obvious it’s not going to be the the i mean the thing that’s right there in front of you it won’t be the big an obvious thing, so you have to look at your system. How does it operate? What mental models are you operating with? What is what is this? And this is also how personas are interesting because they get you out. Of your mental models, you’re your marketing department might have its own vision of, like what? What the organization is or what have you and you we work psychologically with this kind of shorthand? We don’t necessarily think through every step along the way that gets us to a particular decision. We we use shortcuts and mental models are a shortcut, and we have them for our for organizations and and the way we operate and also who we think we’re talking to. Bye that’s what the specificity of these personas? Why it’s so important? Because you’re getting at something that breaks through these short hand models that we have of, well, we have this, you know, the retired over sixty five crowded and is too superficial, yeah, it’s the need to get into the detail we need to get in. We didn’t think we need to talk to the time you know, the curmudgeon, right, who comes every saturday and, you know and complaints to the guard, you’ve got to get into his head and start talking to him, and then he will break down your you’re in perfectly formed mental models and help you create useful ones, we have just a minute before we have to go this trip tap metaphor has personal residence with you. You explain. Tell listeners why that is. Yes, well, the notion is not applied to marketing. It may be mine, but it’s, not mine at all, in the sense that my great great uncle, buckminster fuller, whose people know as thie, inventor of the geodesic dome, futurist designer argast maximilian of the dime actually and map, and maxine carr and and the geodesic dome, which everyone knows because it’s, the lightest, most cost efficient, strongest structure in the world and your uncle, has this on his on his tombstone. Great uncle martignetti he on his tombstone, has engraved. Call me trim tab. Great nephew of buckminster fuller, james eaton is the president in creative director of tronvig group. You’ll find his blaga tronvig group dot com james, a real pleasure having you on the show. Thank you, thank you so much. My pleasure. I was a very touching end to that interview. I remember it very finally, we’re go to a break, and when we come back, tony’s take two, and then amy sample ward talking about cultural change. When your organization becomes more social, how do you manage that? Just keep listening. E-giving didn’t think dick tooting getting ding, ding, ding ding. You’re listening to the talking alternate network e-giving. E-giving good. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m lost in a role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour eleven a m we’re gonna have fun shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re going invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a m on talking alternative dot com you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Hyre sametz hi, i’m kate piela, executive director of dance, new amsterdam. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Durney welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, i can’t send live listener love this week, but i certainly do love the people who are listening live were pre recorded this week for a couple of weeks, but i know california, texas, oregon occasionally, and we got oregon represented very soon with amy, new york, new york, brooklyn, new york and all our asian listeners. I’m sure you’re out there live listener love to each of you, thanks so much for listening podcast pleasantries for everybody listening through itunes and all the other podcast sites that the show is on. Thank you so much, tony, take two a sigh said, i’m away this week. If you go to my block this week, you’ll see it says gone swimming, and i’m a tte bethany beach in delaware taking a week completely off offgrid off line i’m not looking at email, not checking phone messages, not checking twitter it’s just a week disconnected on the beach, and i heartily recommend that for you you’re each in a urine e-giving profession you’re either giving to the organization or you’re directly giving to the people that you’re non-profit helps. And when you give and give and give, i believe you’ve got to take and that is time off. So think about yourself. I hope this summer you took time off to whatever you whatever you love to do, call it decompressing generally, but whatever it is you love. I hope you got some time to do it away from your phone and all the social networks that we enjoy so much most of the time. But we got to take some time away from all that just for ourselves and that’s. My that’s, my week that’s, my suggestion and that’s tony’s take two for friday, august twenty ninth, the thirty fifth show of the year. Amy sample ward. You know her she’s, a ceo of non-profit technology network. Our most recent car third book is social change. Anytime, everywhere. She’s, our regular social media contributor on dh her blogger is amy sample ward dot or ge? How are you? Amy? Welcome back. How are you? I’m terrific. Welcome. Welcome from oregon. Yeah, thanks. And i’m very jealous about a week. Totally unplugged on beach. That sounds like heaven. Well, you’re a very connected person. Do you? Do you take time off for yourself where you’re where you’re offline, i do not as often as i probably should and, you know, i definitely unplug from feeling like i need teo, you said, check twitter or stay on top of e mail, but it’s rare that i wouldn’t i even have my phone, right? Well, now you are ceo of intent. So that’s hyre responsibility. Yeah, i think you would be hard for you to go away and not be connected to them for however long, right? Exactly. Yeah. Ok, but the social networks you can let those go and and your friends and your followers they’ll all still be there, right? When you come back. Exactly. And it’s, you know, it’s kind of a nice feeling to come back from vacation and see people have kind of left left pieces of conversation for you to jump back into that that’s one of the cool things about social media. Yeah, you can get back right in. Yeah, a tte this point, i would say, i’m looking forward to my vacation and then, while this is playing, i’ll be on it. So let’s talk about what it looks like inside an organization. And some strategies for managing on organization when it becomes more social. What are what are some of the concerns that we wantto talk about? Well, i think we’ve talked before about how, you know, if you want your staff to be engaging in social media, we need to create some sources for them, like a social media handbook or even part of your arm fully handbook that there’s examples of you know what his customer service was like or here’s some commonly asked questions so that you can, uh, answer them with these examples, things like that, but the next step beyond that, when you’re when you’re really trying to move your organization to be a social organization and let those staff across the organization, not just one, engage online with your community, that next step then is to identify what that engagement looks like it’s part of their job description because it may be different department to department for staff buy-in staff person and it may be that some people, you just want to be accessible and to show that people across the organization or online and it may be that there’s a certain department, that actually you know, responsible for campaigns and it’s a bigger part of their job description, but it’s, hard as we know toe hold staff accountable to different pieces of that work is it isn’t explicitly in their job description that you can’t then put it in their review. Okay, so we’re going to make that, and we’ll talk a little more in detail, i think about what? Maybe some of those, uh, descriptions and maybe some of those metrics might look like it does impact the organization broadly when even even beyond individual responsibility. When you start sharing annual reports and financial disclosures on, you know, the way you’re supposed to be in good practice with transparency, people are going to start to ask questions about those things, man. So yeah, so i think what’s interesting is that, you know, organization sometimes start to share piela finance older annual reports or or, you know, impact reporting in some way and think, okay, here we go, one step you could be a lot of questions sometimes there isn’t because people just wanted to know, and that was it. But again, once you put it out there, it’s sometimes more about the culture changed. Within the organization that staff that staff realize that kind of information that really reporting is going to be shared publicly on getting all of the staff across the organization comfortable and batted on. Understanding why it’s important to do more so than it is now. You’re going to get it a lot of questions from twitter because people just read your annual okay, now i can see that probably true, right? It’s hard. It takes more cultural change to get it approved and understood. Then it does once it’s actually out there because that is true. How many people are actually gonna pore over your annual report? Like you said, they just want to know that it’s available right? Well, isn’t it a a great annual report? I mean there’s so many examples now of organizations really rethinking what the annual report did so that even as a report itself, its social and it’s engaging so it’s something that people come and directly interact with, you know, to open up different pieces and see different stories, maybe watch videos and then click on something else. Looked at the data from that program. You know what? Whatever it may be. But taking advantage of the fact they’re posting it on the web and making it and engaging interactive pieces of information on and that too, is going to take some culture change because many organizations have have created annual reports every year that are pretty static, you know, usually, like are are meant to be printed and then given to thunderzord donors are longtime supporters, but then also used in, you know, fund in different ways for forward over the coming year. Well, the idea, just creating an interactive, you know, the web page or something khun definitely could definitely take some convincing, especially when people are thinking of the annual port less so of it needs to look like this, but but more of a i like to have it in my hand when i meet with someone, how am i gonna have this interactive website in my hand when i meet with someone so recognizing where those people are coming from because of how they use that data so that you’re not creating us an infographic that’s how you know they couldn’t ever using the situation, but maybe something interactive online that still has some of the feature. Stories and the rial financial and, you know, fundez breakdown over the year and things like that so they could still pull the pieces out that they used in those meetings and when they’re trying to convince me funders teo, give you some more funds, but that otherwise it’s still meeting the need online have seen something a little more engaging. This all has implications also for our volunteers, and i’m thinking of the key volunteers, the board members, they need to be a part of this cultural shift also. Oh, exactly, i mean, you know, there are a lot of organizations out there where the board is technically considered, you know, working board, it’s a it’s, a very small organization, and the board is there to really contribute directly to the operations of the organization, which for many organizations now means someone on the board or a couple people on the border actually managing the social media accounts for the organization, and that doesn’t mean that they just talk about how great, you know, the organization is on twitter once a week. If whoever is going to be a man, you know, social channel needs to be prepared to answer questions, jump into conversations, be accessible regularly and if that’s not something that a boardmember who, as you pointed out is a volunteer, is able to commit to it not then that you don’t want the board to have access to the channels, but they’re just not gonna be able to be there as much as the community is on dh, maybe that’s an opportunity to have boardmember have personal accounts where they can certainly, you know, engage with people directly representing themselves, but you still have that organizational profile managed by a staff person just so that it is more more reliably online account. We’ve had lots of guests on talk about the setting, the expectations for board members appropriately at the recruitment stage, and if you do expect them to be out there and engaged socially on behalf of the organization, i think you’d want teo make that clear in your board expectations discussion while you’re recruiting people. Yeah, exactly make sure if you know, that’s something that there isn’t capacity on staff for and you need to recruit for it on the board. Be very open about that end about you know, how big nose communities potentially are how much time commitment and engagement there will need to be, and then, you know, proactively look for someone who is, as you and i have talked about before, recognizes the way that social work’s so it’s not someone trying to come into, you know, quote unquote have that message control, but someone that gets that this is a conversation we’re here to engage with the community directly it’s a great opportunity to do that and that we’re going to shave the conversation together and not someone who’s going to say, well, i’ma boardmember and this is all that we want the community to talk about, so, you know, that’s what? We’re going to tweet because you know that it doesn’t matter if they have all the time in the world to be on there because they’re just not going to be engaging in the right way? Yes, okay, we’re talking about getting buying at all different levels from leadership certainly employees, volunteers, key volunteers like board members were goingto go away for a couple minutes, and when we come back, of course, amy and i will keep talking about more social now what? Keep listening. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Welcome back on dh amy and i are still we’re going to continue talking about the cultural change and howto manage that when your organization becomes more social, more engaged. Amy well, let’s, talk about some of the strategies we you mentioned, including in job descriptions, what are what are different levels of engagement that might be appropriate for different, uh, sorry, different job descriptions where it’s not the person’s primary job when they’re not, they’re not the organization’s social media manager. What is just sametz samples of different levels of engagement, you might you might call on, well, one example that i like to use from n ten it’s. You know, for us, we want to make sure that all staff across the organization have an opportunity to connect with the community because that’s important to us and your mission is to help all staff use technology well. And so if we only had our community, you know, well the manager online engaging in social media, we also wouldn’t be practicing what we preach that all staff could be using social media. So we want to make sure that it’s staff running those channels what they can, but we also recognize that some people just you know, i know that it sounds crazy and unbelievable, but some people don’t have a facebook account for twitter accounts, and we’re not goingto have them create an account just because they work at ten and then have them not. I feel comfortable using it or not engaged very much there, because ultimately, that’s, what happens in this movie will be feel feel more just connected on confused then, if that person didn’t have a twitter account that s o that also is going to be contrary to what, what you stand for, which is real engagement, and if you’re not comfortable doing it, then you don’t force people into it exactly it’s not going it’s not gonna feel like a great conversation and came across their twitter account anyway, but there are opportunities to be accessible to the community and engage with them in a way that is comfortable and authentic. And so we have what we call weekly touchpoint and we have, you know, listening dashboards and all of those kind of resource is talked about in the past, and staff are expected to find one one thing that they want. To comment on or engaged with maybe, you know, someone participates in a twitter chat on, you know, a topic that they’re interested in or that is part of their work. Other people will find a news story about non-profit or technology sectors, you know, whether it’s from the chronicle for him to be or non-profit times and, you know, something like that, other people will just find block post from someone in the community, and you leave a comment and engage in that way, but whatever it is that you feel comfortable doing, the expectation is that you participate once a week, you find one conversation to contribute to in some way because the goal for us is, yeah, that you contributed, but it’s that actually, that means that was one member or maybe many members, if it was something like a tweet chat that feels like they got to have a direct touch from the organization and that it was it was really it wasn’t just, you know, one more email that we’ve sent out, but it was that staffers sense going and reading your block post, which feels good, you know, someone actually left a comment on your vlog and twenty thirteen were killed, like knowing these cummings anymore. So that’s one way where we set the expectations but left it open for open for interpretation, if you will so that staff can pick the channel that makes sense, and then if they’re doing this once a week, that’s fifty engagements per year per staff member that’s that’s, considerable, exactly, yeah, there’s twelve staff and, you know, easily fifty weeks where we’re online, so yeah, it adds up to feel like we’ve we’ve done a lot of external engagement and that’s not counting, you know, the actual social media engagement out of the organization’s profile, the foster parents and so on. And if you have that metric of one a week, some people are going to embrace it and do three or four or five a week it’s more natural for some people, others will be at that many others will be at that minimum, but even at the minimum, that’s still pretty good fifty engagements a year out of somebody who is not really that comfortable, but you know, that does what they do, what they’re being asked to do. That’s pretty good, exactly, and we have staff who, you know are are those staff i was talking about before that don’t have a twitter account that, you know, don’t log in to facebook, teo really use that, and so they choose the blog’s comments because for them they always get excited to actually hear what one of the end members was thinking about our working on so as much as it’s an opportunity to go the comment yes, engage directly, it also lets them feel like, you know, they can turn around in their chair and tell the rest of the office, hey, did you know that twenty martignetti thousand each right now, her, uh, whatever it may be, you know, because they just got to read, you know, take a few minutes out of their day of of otherwise, you know, just doing work and here, directly from a member as well, i love it and thank you for using intent as an example because i think that’s uplifting and motivating people because you are the non-profit technology network and still you’re saying you have people who aren’t all that comfortable don’t have a twitter account of facebook account and there’s still able to engage the love that you love it. Okay, so, uh, the the implication of including this in someone’s job description, as you said earlier, is that this is now going to be part of their performance review. We’re going, we’re going to talk about this once a year, once every six months hopeful i think once two years kind of bare minimum, but once in every six months, maybe in evaluating their their performance and maybe help them, i feel more comfortable or get to the next level if they are feeling like they’d like to get to next level, this can all be sort of growth opportunity. Oh, exactly. We’ve had staff where when they first join the organization, you know, they didn’t have have twitter accounts, for example, and they started out doing the community touchpoint knowing they had to find something to comment on or engage with and over time they got more interested and because it is and then they were on our own webinars as the half percent, you know, leaving the webinar and of course, that means you do the intro. You make sure that everyone’s able to log in eleven art, but then it means you’re listeningto all of these. Seminars throughout the year from, you know, experts in their in their different fields. So at one of the reviews, the staff person said, okay, i i listen to enough webinars about social media, i want to create a twitter account and i want to try engaging with the community there, you know, before our next unconference so that i can, you know, be a part of that online side of the conference, and i thought that was great a great way to for the organisation instead of us saying, we have a lot of people tweeting during the npc shouldn’t really have to do in our account and said by just saying here’s, the community, you need to be accessible, find the channel for you on the expectations you do something, you know, whatever town that is that over time they were able to see oh, i’m missing, you know, i’m missing this piece it’s on twitter, where i see people are doing things that i’m not there and they foreign fired-up join that channel on dh recognized the value themselves instead of us just deciding that they needed to be there. We have just a minute or so. Left, this should be part of staff training, too, not just the evaluation process, but regular staff training. Yeah, i mean, let’s think about how many times we complain that facebook has once again changed, you know, the the way that your friend list work or five settings or anything else if if you and some of plugged in recognized that weinger changing that it needs other people probably don’t recognize that. So having a regular checkpoints, uh, throughout the year where people can get together and say, oh, you know, i’ve actually been trying out google plus, does anyone want to talk about that? You know, or hey here’s, something that has changed in facebook setting, living off anyone needs to walk through it together. It could be a collaborative, learning type of meanings. That way everyone has a chance to share and to hear from each other just what’s working or what has changed in the different channel people are using under their own names. Thank you very much. Thank you for sharing. Amy, amy, sample ward, dot org’s, herb log and on twitter she’s at amy r s board and she’ll be back in a month thank you again next week, the overhead myth letter it’s coming, the three co signers of the letter will be with me, the ceos of the better business bureau wise giving alliance guide star and charity navigator do you want to ask them a question? Put it on her facebook page or send it to me on twitter. I won’t answer this week, but i will next week and we’ll have your question for them. So please love to have your questions. Also, jean takagi returns are legal contributor what overhead should you invest in to protect your non-profit coming from the overhead myth letter what’s wise overhead investment so that you protect your non-profit those you’re helping your employees and your board members. If you love tony martignetti non-profit radio, you might also love fund-raising fundamentals it’s, a monthly podcast devoted to fund-raising topics that i host for the chronicle of philanthropy, you’ll find it on their website, and you’ll also find fund-raising fundamentals on itunes. Our creative producer is claire miree off sam liebowitz is our line producer shows social media is by deborah askanase of community organizer two point oh, and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. I hope you’ll be with me next week. Friday one to two p. M eastern at talking alternative dot com, which is talking alternative broadcasting. Dahna hyre e-giving thing duitz good ending. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network waiting to get in. Nothing. Cubine are you a female entrepreneur? Ready to break through? Join us at sixty body sassy sol, where women are empowered to ask one received what they truly want in love, life and business. Tune in thursday, said noon eastern time to learn tips and juicy secrets from inspiring women and men who, there to define their success, get inspired, stay motivated and to find your version of giant success with sexy body sake. Sold every thursday ad. Men in new york times on talking alternative dot com. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three that’s two one two, seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. You’re listening to talking alt-right network at www. Dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all just better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership? Customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com that’s improving communications, dot com improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier and make more. Money improving communications, that’s. The answer. Talking. Hyre

151: Maria Cuomo Cole: Relationships & Tumblr Tactics – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Maria Cuomo Cole, chair of the board of Help USA

Amy Sample Ward, CEO of Nonprofit Technology Network and co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere”

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Durney hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host it’s friday, july nineteen oh, i hope you’re with me last week why i didn’t do it dermatitis if it came to my attention that you had missed measuring the network non-profit with beth cantor she’s, co author of the network non-profit and measuring the network’s non-profit and she talked to me a tte fund-raising day last month about wide engagement and measuring your multi-channel outcomes and goodbye google alerts maria simple, our prospect research contributor and the prospect finder had free alternatives in case google alerts disappear this week. Mario cuomo, cole on relationships miss cole, a philanthropist and board chair of help yusa shares the professional value of all of her relationships, including her mom and how they’ve helped her and help yusa succeed. We talked at the june meeting of executive women in non-profits, which is a part of the new york society of association executives and tumbler tactics. Amy sample ward, our social media contributor, co author of social change, anytime everywhere and ceo of inten, explains the value of tumbler how to decide whether you should be in tumbler, blogging and how to get started between the guests on tony’s, take two there’s a myth going around planned e-giving that we’ve got planned e-giving covered, and i think a lot of non-profits actually don’t have it covered talk about that. My pleasure. Now, to introduce my interview with maria cuomo cole, i do want you to know that the second half of this interview so after the break, there’s a part of the discussion because we at the meeting, we opened up the conversation to a broad discussion. Part of discussion is kind of quiet, little low. I know about it already. You don’t have to tweet or email everything i know, but a couple of women said some very poignant things about relationships in their lives, and i wanted to include it. It’s, not silent, but if you have had headsets or earbuds, you may wanna use those in the second half of this maria cuomo cool interview. Here you go, everyone welcome. We’re at a meeting of the executive women in non-profits a shared interest group of the new york society of association executives. You will find them at n y. U s a net dahna that was the obligatory video in trim for this will be on youtube in a couple of weeks, and you’ll all get the link from holly and very shortly, it’ll also beyond my pad podcast on a non-profit radio you’re talking about relationships today and first i’m goingto have a chat with maria, and then after that, we’re going to open it up and have you share some stories about relationships that have been important to you personally or professionally and how those have helped you professionally. Lots of different kinds of relationships, whether their peers, people working for you people work. You work for mentor mentee, lots of different possibilities. I’m very pleased to introduce my voice. Just crack. Did you hear that? Pleased to like a sixteen bad alex. Like a sixteen year old, my voice is cracked. Very pleased to introduce maria cuomo. Cole she’s, the chair of the board of help yusa, a leading developer of housing for those suffering homelessness and low income she blocks for the huffington post she’s, a film producer and a philanthropist. We’re gonna learn more about all of her work. Maria cuomo, call. Welcome. Thank you it’s a real pleasure to have you. Why don’t you start telling us a little about maura about help us? We’ll help you say, uh, well, our mission is to create opportunities through housing and services to help stabilize families and crises and individuals and crises who are not living independently. Andare are long term mission is to help those individuals sustain housing stability. And we do that through a very innovative a real estate model of permanent housing with support services on site, child care services, employment, mental health counseling, etcetera. Is there also something transitional before people are bottle? Actually, yes. The model was actually created in the nineteen eighties. Find my brother andrew, um, during the koch administration as a family transitional homeless model and that that model has grown in new york. We have over two hundred colleagues today providing transitional homeless services and thie help model was named a congressional model in nineteen, eighty seven and b has become part of each administrations working with homeless populations across the country. Actually, our permanent housing model is a more sophisticated application, basically another another financial model that has enabled us to provide a long term permanent housing for the same populations um, including a lot of veterans latto very is a no that’s. Homelessness is a yeah fine problem. That’s unfortunately true. One and four homeless men is a veteran that’s been the case? Actually, for many years some say that the number is closer now to one point three one out of three. There are sixty one thousand homeless veterans each night, sleeping on the streets in america, which is just devastating for women as well. And for women, well, for female vets is a growing population that have that are largely underserved. Um and it’s, a population that help yusa has tailored programmes to accommodate there has been improvement. The va has quickly improved and expanded their services for women and for young for young veterans returning the Numbers were as high as 1 hundred twenty one even hyre two hundred thousand homeless veterans just three years ago. So so things are improving, but a great deal of work needs to be done quickly to accommodate our returning veterans. You have some interesting revenue sources, including comfort foods. I saw a chocolate. You, my brandraise sample. Try and focus for the morning. But no way try everything. Yes, we’ve been able to use our help, yusa, artwork and the brand for some social enterprises, we’re very fortunate to be one of the nineteen eighties non-profits in new york that benefited so generously by, uh, keep bearing such a remarkable talent artist philanthropist in his own right said such a generous spirit, the organization can’t achieve this kind of success and prominence on its own so let’s move and talk a little about relationships how have generally relationships been important? To help us is growth and to your, you know, your professional ball so well, i mean, relations abroad, a broad question, but i mean the very model, uh, of help usa, the innovative model is really one of public private sector partnership, and the model on lee only works because we have the interests of serving special needs constituency using private resources and public a public resource opportunity. So local governments, state government, federal government, private banking communities, for-profit uh, businesses and individuals, all i have to really partner work together in order, tio, create a bill, help residents and provide services long term on dh for you personally, relationships, whether they’re let’s. Let’s, start with. Since there were talking about the organization, level your relationships with peers that other organisations, whether for-profit or non-profit, well, our community. I’m partial. I think that the new york city non-profit community as a whole is really, really the most robust, professional, sophisticated and collaborative in the country. Ground experience. Um, and i think we really set a standard here for communities around. Give a shout out for new york city, new york city. Relationships, collaboration. And now in our in our space of developing housing and services for special needs populations, uh, provider community has has been extremely collaborative through the years. In fact, when my my brother andrew was hud secretary, we were required in new york city to work as a consortium application for funding toe hood. So, you know, the mayor’s office communities, state and providers had to work cooperatively at designing assessment and and proposing strategies for support so there’s no greater exercise than to bring two hundred plus organisations into, uh, into one collaborative application process. Andi, i think the community works very well in maximizing core strengths, individual agencies to work with populations that they have the head home to the expertise to serve. Uh, i know our agency and many others try hyre very, very hard not to recreate the wheel. You know ourselves if we are providing services in the bronx for children. And the children’s aid society, for example, is a very prominent agency, of course in new york city for youth services. We’ve turned to them to ask them to help with, you know, with complimentary services for our homeless youth after school. And in many in many such examples, we’ve been able to better serve our populations on dh there could be challenges to in in for exam, for instance, bringing together two hundred organizations or even just partnering oneto one there has to be compromised and saying little about overcoming some of those challenge that’s true that’s true, i mean, i think that our experience has has been that when there is a need that another organization can serve and we’re providing, we’re providing whether it’s, the constituency, the population, the resource of our buildings, for example, we have beautiful community spaces and, you know, retail space that a lot of non-profits need to deliberative services so that’s ah, point of partnership and and, uh, coop cooperative collaboration, um, so we we really haven’t encountered i can’t say that we really encountered problems in that regard, it’s such a rich community in new york of service providers that we have been able to find partnerships to serve our families, our single homeless individuals, veterans, children and really enhance our overall delivery. Right now we take a break for a couple of seconds, and while we do, if you have your ah, you’re buds or headset. You may want to get it, because the second part of the upcoming segment, after the break is a little quiet, but very good, things said by the women who were there. Thanks. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Do you need a business plan that can guide your company’s growth? Seven and seven will help bring the changes you need. Wear small business consultants and we pay attention to the details. You may miss our coaching and consultant services a guaranteed to lead toe. Right, groat. For your business, call us at nine. One seven eight three, three, four, eight, six zero foreign, no obligation. Free consultation checkout on the website of ww dot covenant seven dot com are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over intellect no more it’s time for action. Join me. Larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the isaac tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society, politics, business and family. It’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to know what’s. Really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me, larry sharp, your neo-sage. Tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s. Ivory tower radio dot com everytime was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com yeah, those watching from outside new york city. I hope your thing close attention because new york is not a unfriendly place should come. You should come. You should visit. You should collaborate. Way all know this here in the room. So i’m speaking to those who are watching from outside new york were not unfriendly here we welcome you. We want to work with you. We want to collaborate. Let’s, move to the personal side, i think dahna all of us benefit from personal mentor mentee relationships, maybe with peers. Other colleagues say little about how that’s helped your professional. Well, this is my twentieth year with help u s a all right, a measurable amount of time. Two decades. And i could say, you know, some of the relationships that we’ve developed through the years with private businesses with other non-profits have really helped our model flourish, you know? I can i can say kapin partnerships with unrelated businesses to specifically what we do with bloomingdale’s the retailer, we’ve had a very close partnership with them for now. Over fifteen years, serving children have been volunteermatch entering youth program. That’s got to mean that you have a good relationship with the ceo there or someone at the high level. And then you and the children from the ceo’s leadership, of course, is always essential and establishing the value of voluntarism within a company, certainly and cooperative spirit it’s gotta trick your spirit has to trickle down, but, you know, they have a fantastic executive team that really cares very much about giving back to the communities and our partnership that started in new york with volunteer mentoring after school mentoring for at risk youth has grown teo all of their forty stores across the country, really expanding our model and our service delivery. You have some specific advice for the relationship between the ceo or chair and the volunteer board of trustees within the organization to help us, you know, here, too, we’ve been blessed with tremendous, tremendous board leadership through the years, um, individuals who bring different sorts of talents and acumen to help us do what we do, which is a fairly sophisticated, complex collection of services. So whether the individuals have business acumen, real estate, finance, thie arts, education, health um it’s, a very mixed group and there’s always that challenge there’s always that challenge. Of finding the right trusty who has the skills that you’re lacking and we know there were plenty of attorneys, there are plenty of sepa is but finding that right, one who works well with the mission believes in the mission and is going to be a value to the board. Yes, that’s true, that is true. Our board members tend to be tend to be long timers, too. I can’t think i can’t think of more than one or two cases where board members have actually had to leave for different reasons moving, you know, changes, work or environment, but it’s a very, very committed team, and we work hard building those relationships and really keeping our board very engaged. We need their service, we need there their contributions. So we tried to make careful matches of program, area and growth area where they can, you know, really make a difference and participate, contribute and and that’s critical to find out what they want to contribute to what programs interest them so that they are used in the best of the best are definitely yes, i’d say that’s true, absolutely. On the sort of on the more personal side of know your mom has been and important mentor for you say, say something about that, my mother, my mother jokes that she works for me, and i joke that i worked for her. I think it goes both ways. Sometimes i see we actually have been running her one two, one youth mentoring program since nineteen ninety four. She had started it in the early eighties, she’s truly a national pioneer and the mentoring movement, and, uh and believes in it passionately and developed an excellent model that is still used today. Um, she started it in the early eighties in new york state schools to lower the dropout rate and focused on foster care aged out. You and we’ve been able to maintain and nurture and grow that model since nineteen ninety four into mentoring yusa, which is delivering services in eleven markets around the country and really thrives on partnership because, of course, it’s, a volunteer mentoring program, we work closely with the corporate community and community organizations. The model is expert in training mentors, so very good at the engagement piece of bringing a volunteer in working. With them improving their skills and then managing and, uh, providing support for that volunteer. Want one it’s very special mentoring partnership. What would you, uh, would you say you’ve learned most important you’ve learned from your mom? Oh my gosh, she is remarkable still today at i won’t sit well, she loves being a tea, so i can say that she absolutely loves being eighty and celebrated it now she’s more than eighty and she is just a dynamo. She contributes to the program significantly, strategically, operationally still, and i’ve learned everything about how to well, i’ve learned everything really about what voluntarism means from her she’s always prized that word that term, we don’t use it much in our non-profits space, i think to an extent it becomes the notion of volunteering just becomes part of what you do, right? And we were working with volunteer constituents. We don’t often value their contribution of giving personal time and making that commitment, which really is a very special special make perhaps the most special sort of contribution, and she values and prize is it reminds me to respect it and honor it all the time. How did you learn? That that ethic growing up, she was always doing it, and she always no matter what you know her period of life. Wass but, you know, as a young age, she had us out you no selling daffodils for american cancer society, and this spring, i mean, i had no idea what even wasit was so young, you know, we sort of just followed her along, like her ducklings and all her various activities, whether it was, you know, school, church, american cancer society, other you no other formidable non-profit efforts always service oriented, and then, of course, in her work with my father, their mission was service, of course, that their lives have been dedicated to public service. And how can we pay this forward to the next generation of non-profit ceos? You know, i think that you i think for every non-profits ceo on dh through the staff line and the board lines, you know, again, i think that people, especially here in our community, i think people really, um, value and respect what they’re doing, they’re making a clear choice, making a clear choice to work in a non-profit environment, everybody knows that most likely you’re going to make more money in the private sector. So you’re you’re making a choice, you’re making a sacrifice and i believe that’s because you’re a person of mission and and, you know that passion it’s what allows you to do the best work? And and how can we be good role models for the for the next-gen coming, the next generation, i think, is to, you know, it’s summertime, we all have this valuable prized interns it’s, you know, include them, include them in the work, really mentor them the mentoring, uh, mentorship we can all provide now at this point in our careers is really very, very important and valuable. Um, and i think we could do that with our co workers with our young leaders is to just, you know, really be their share with them and support them and there’s often a lot that we can learn from those were mentor from the mission, yes, we need to stay sharp, yeah, in things that they’re much better versed in. Yeah, and that doesn’t only mean social media and technology, but we’re going to talk about that in the bigger discussion miree anything you want to leave, leave. Viewers listeners with around the value of of of a relationship on gets its report lies as supposed the relationship with are your viewers, our listeners today, that non-profit initiatives work because of public support, that it’s it’s, not just the small universe that we design and interact with, but it is the greater community, and that we need the support. We need the interest of the greater community. Teo, please follow us. Watch us think about how you can contribute and be apart of the work. Thank you very much. Thank you for sharing your expertise and your experience. Fremery in-kind. I’d like to open up tio to a real group discussion. Who wants to share a story of a mentor? That was that was important to you. Excellent. Yeah, linda. Miree treyz i don’t want to put you on the spot to single someone out, because then that’s. Not fair. But i’m sure women all know who you’re. They all know who you’re talking about. Oh, there you go. Your strategy. No. Yeah. Hyre wells was the share. Ah, a story from someone who was important to your influential to you. Maybe not. A formal may not have been a formal mentor. Mentee, please. Thanks, michelle. Hyre it sounds like randy was always there for you, either formally or informally, right on the record or off the record. Yeah. Beautiful. Thank you. Thanks, michelle. How about others? Anybody on the left side of the room? One somebody who was important. Police wonder what about a special project? Four. Introduce yourself, please. I want the special projects report issue i want with outside consultant had been a corporate person for a very long time. This this particular opportunity was really fairly new for me, and he was really great at a kind of coaching me counseling me on a lot of some of the things that we needed to do some of the things you expect because it was very successful, whether there would be what panels or or other things that you would be invited, too, because i was a person who worked on the project and he was just very generous with his thoughts about what was going to happen next, what to expect and something sounding board to kind of know how to respond sometimes wasn’t a formal mentor, like lots of programs with someone somewhere else is mental, but it’s just sort of up a relationship that you kind of developed with somebody because you seem to have some sort of kinship and they’re just going to be generals with heimans thoughts just trying to help you go in the right direction and help successful and that’s really important. So whether it’s an organization like this or whether it’s i’m something should happen to work outside, those people kind of help you shape your life. What do you make a really excellent point about us having to be open to these kinds of relationships? You just never know who the next person is going to be. That khun, you know, help in a small way, helping a really long term, valuable way the way wanda and michelle are talking about. We just have to be open to these. And they’re not as you said, wanted. Not always formal. Not always. This person is assigned to you a lot of times, right? People just come into our lives, and i think we need to be open tio to the possibilities. Uh, you know, holly, please. Good morning, falik connick, vice president, accounting company. Listening to maria talked about her mom and i heard a top about her mom before. It reminds me when i grow up. Grew up in the early sixties. I know it stays. When all my friends mom’s home, you know, and she was having and i was having dinner with my baby sitter, my mom was always working. I wasn’t a very well child. I had a lot of healthy hands. I always thought that when i got older, my life would be a little limited with what i could do with my career. And my mom used to always say to me, holly, when somebody tells you that you can’t do something, you just keep keep going at it and you just keep going at it on my mom today, next week, could you usedto work continues to try heimans you’re so crap, because i’ve been where i have been for twenty five, you’re like the rest of you being in the non-profit morning in-kind mama’s variety has nothing that i haven’t been able to in all my years and so on. My mentor holly. Thank you, it’s. Very touching, thanks very much. Stephen colbert. I don’t know if any of you saw this brooke broke character, which i don’t know if it’s impressive probably is unprecedented broke his his character on is on the show for the first four minutes. I think it was two days ago wednesday to pay tribute to his mom, who just died. I do. That was so touching. You know, he is the guy. I mean, i’ve seen him live and he, you know, it’s very rarely breaks character, but i hear him to see him do that. That was special in itself. And then just the words no r hyre very special tribute. So, thanks a lot. Thanks for sharing my thanks to everybody at that shared interest group of se e the executive women in non-profits there was a very, very lovely and times touching meeting. A lot of the women shared some very poignant stories, and i appreciate that it was it was really lovely to be there. And so my thanks to you, everyone there i gotta live listener love before we take this break. Tons of people in new york, freeport, new york, new york, new york, hicksville, new york’s a long island two out of three long island newport, north carolina. I’m going to be there soon. Reston, virginia and oregon lake oswego. I wonder if it’s amy live listener love to everybody, though. Is that those that’s everybody? In the u s but continuing in north america reinardy mexico. Welcome, live, listen, love to you and going further south. Campiness, brazil. Welcome. Lots of visitors in asia will get to them. Right now. We go away for a couple seconds when we come back. Tony’s, take two, and then amy sample ward on tumbler tactics. Stay with me e-giving thinking, shooting, getting, thinking things, you’re listening to the talking, alternate network waiting to get in. E-giving good. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m ostomel role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re gonna invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Latto if you have big ideas and an average budget tune. Tony martin. Any non-profit radio we dio i’m jonah helper, nari team in co founders of next-gen charity dahna welcome back that gentleman whose voice you heard say you’re listening to talking alternative broadcasting he’s from australia and i just met him about a half an hour ago. He was in studio he’s, now a buddhist monk. I don’t know what his name is now, but at the time that he that recording he was his name was giorgio rivetti. I don’t know. I don’t know what he uses now, it’s sam says he still uses george over petty so he’s but he’s but he’s provoc rah george, your petty a buddhist monk um, more live listener love, asia gotta hit asia hard. Lots of listeners in seoul, south korea, thank you very much. And also in sioux on korea live listener love to everyone in korea on your haserot fuck uac of japan in chino, maya, japan and tokyo welcome live listener love, konichiwa, it’s, time for tony’s take two there’s this myth going around non-profits i’ve heard it for many years as someone who does planned e-giving consulting and that is that if you have someone in your organization who has planned giving in their title, then you’ve got planned, giving covered it’s taken care of and what that full short when that title is shared with some other title like i’ve seen director of annual giving and planned e-giving i’ve seen director of major gifts and planned e-giving i’ve seen foundation and planned giving fund-raising, and the problem becomes that any of those things or others that plan giving might be paired with in one person’s job responsibilities job spec is that everything will take priority over planned e-giving because anything that you pair it with will have more immediate deadlines that’s especially true in annual giving any e-giving sometimes has weekly production goals and certainly monthly, but anything you pair it with, it’ll have more immediate deadlines, and it’ll be more immediate cash to the organization because planned e-giving is cash to the charity at the donor’s death, in most cases, a couple of exceptions, but most it’s at the donor’s death. So the other thing that the plan giving his paired with is always going to take precedence and it’s going to get a lot more time than the proportional representation it has in the title. So if it’s half the title, it’ll probably get about five percent of the time if it’s a third of the title, i have seen it paired with two other things once it’ll probably get two percent of the time. So just because you have planned giving in someone’s title, you don’t have plan giving covered for your non-profit that’s not on my block at tony martignetti dot com this week, it will be, but it’s not, i wanted to just raise it irrespective of it not being on the block and that is tony’s take two for friday, nineteenth of july twenty ninth show of the year. I’m having a hard time believing it’s nineteenth of july amy sample ward is with me you know her high i love so having a hard time believing it’s the nineteen no kidding, but you’re not supposed to talk yet. I didn’t give you the proper introduction. Oh my gosh, yeah, i blew it! She’s, the ceo at non-profit technology network and ten her most recent co authored book is social change anytime everywhere about online multi-channel engagement, her blog’s that amy sample, ward dot or ge? And on twitter she’s at amy r s ward. Welcome amy sample aboard hello, we’re talking about tumbler today, but you’re out and you’re out in oregon in the portland area. I am. I think that live listener out in oregon was not me. It must be someone else related. Lake, we go. Oh, it is oswego, not a wego. Okay, oswego. Thank you. You’ve corrected me in the past about pronouncing oregon, which i have now. It’s ah, weak a sweet go. Thank you. But you are in portland proper. Is that true? Yes. Panepento office eyes right downtown. Okay. The city of roses i found yes, sophie of roses. Even have a rose festival and a rose garden. Yes, i don’t. You have a research rose garden upon a mountain? I think i read. So you’re the city of roses in in the beaver state. Excellent. Exactly. Okay, we’re talking about tumbler this month. Yeah, you know, way whenever we talk about specific social media channels or how to use the social tools, i feel like you and i always get back, teo, at least a couple of minutes talking about staffing. And i thought that was so appropriate after your take two today. Because whether it’s fund-raising or you know any of the other kind of tools and communications that we’ve talked about on the show before, just because someone has a title does not mean that is the only person that could do that work or that is responsible for that work. So, you know, today talking about tumbler think it gets categorized into ah, blawg, you know, because it kind of functions and that that’s the way the content operates, but that doesn’t mean that just because you have a staff person who normally puts content onto your website that they’re the person that’s now going to be managing if you have a tumbler account, you know, it has to be based on what we need outside the organization is who’s reading that content? Where is the content coming from? On dh, how do you deliver that? Not whose title inside of the organization is tumbler manager, you know? Yeah, i see tumbler often called a microblogging site, and i don’t really think that does it justice it’s it’s so much more than what what people think of is blogging. So i think the first thought when you see that description is not going to be as rich’s tumbler really is. Yeah, that’s a great point, i mean the description of it as a micro blogging is trying to be objective about how the content works because it does like a block have, you know, each post going chronologically, and you can put your content in their etcetera and it’s, you know, a static kind of place, but i’ve finally seen over the last few months, people really recognizing that tumbler is a social platform, not necessarily like a social network in the way that you think of facebook, for example, but the purpose of it is social. When allison and i were doing research on the kinds of user demographics of all different major social platforms, when we were putting the book together, one thing that surprised us too see written down is the number but didn’t surprise us from the qualitative experience side is that the majority of tumblers content is re blogged, meaning i posted something on my tumbler and you liked it and you, you know, re posted it onto your tumblr like a re pending on pinterest, yeah, so if we’re retweet into him, has to be a social platform if all the content is getting shared around and the purpose, you know. Of having your tumbler is kind of like, um, it’s a little bit if you want to think about it, like pinteresque, where you’re there and engaging and checking out other people’s content because you’re kind of curating your space, you know? And and that means you’re going to pull from all different users because you’re creating this one, you know, tumbler account that that’s all on your topic or whatever you do, you want to say so? It’s definitely social and i think that’s why organizations, they’re starting to realize it may have a role in their content plan and their community engagement plan because it isn’t just one more place for their randomly posting content. You know, there are people really engaged there, okay? And it’s also visual there’s a big visual content, which reminds me of pinterest and a little bit of facebook, facebook is pretty visual, too heimans has that beyond you know what? What you’d think of if you hear microblogging has this visual aspect, yeah, exactly. And so there’s there’s so many visual type platforms now that are gaining tons of popularity, we saw that huge spike in adoption for a pinterest but now we’re also seen instagram and vine and then instagrams video because of vine, so these this focus on pictures or really short videos and wanting to engage, you know, around a visual piece of content less so that the traditional kind of a block post where your you’ve written out some tacks on and i think what’s great about tumbler, is that it is such a hybrid, you know, it isn’t like pinterest where it is just going to be photos all over the place, and just by the functionality of the tool, the text is often kind of hidden or rolled up, you know, you have to click on it to see what the caption may have been or what the comments were it’s really trying to be photo first or a blogger where it’s obviously text first, so tumbler kind of merges them together where the photos are really prominent or video or whatever you’ve posted there, but it doesn’t hide whatever text you do include also sort of like twitter it’s it’s pretty quick moving too? Yeah, for sure i mean both from the user sample, you know it’s pretty easy, tio, if you have the app. On your phone or you’re doing it from the web, you know, just post that quick photo. It integrates with lots of platforms so people could be auto posting to tumbler every time they, you know, save content somewhere else. But as faras the digesting of that content inside the followers of your tumbler, i mean, tumbler just has really high numbers as faras people, you know, total engaged users, active users, users, they log in regularly, but also people, you know, using the mobile site, checking at multiple times a day to follow along. So it is fast moving, i think because people keep checking it. And so then people want to keep adding to it all the time. We have just about a minute before we go away for a couple minutes. Let’s talk a little about the engagement around conversations to and what non-profits should be could be looking for around their issues. Yeah, i think it’s tumbler is an interesting channel and we can talk more about this after the break. You? But i think there’s there’s two riel opportunities one is toe kind of, you know, own own account. Creating the count. Make it very clearly, your organization’s account and manage it. The other avenue to go is to support your community members or a superfan or ah, long time volunteer or even donor-centric area, because it’s their personal passion and just supporting them. Managing that account, whether that sending them, you know, content or news, they’re great photos or pointing people their way, you know, using it as a as a spotlight. So and then you’re just kind of sending stuff their way, but you’re not directly managing it. So i think there’s two, two ofthe avenues to go. Okay, we’re gonna take that break, and when we come back, of course, i mean, now keep talking about tumbler tactics and stay with us. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. We got more live listener love ryan from washington, d c first time listener. Welcome to the show. Thanks for tweeting. Hangzhou, china, ni hao and hong kong welcome live listener love to everybody listening like, oh, we got more in the u s laguna woods, california and is it lee hae l e h i utah welcome live listener loved when we were all over the country love it, love it. Maybe sample would you bring in you bring lots of listeners. It’s amazing. Yeah. Imagine if you actually promoted the fact that you’re on the show. No, you promote. I’m joking. Okay, so we got lots of alternative zoho before we continue, i have to give credit. Tio actually, the new york city affiliative end ten, which is five o one tech. And why? And i see five point check. N y c. Yes, i was at their meeting last night, and amanda mccormick spoke about tumbler, so i got a i got sort of a last minute education from amanda mccormick was very smart about tumbler, and you’ll find amanda at jelly bean boom dot com jelly bean boom dot com. I want to give her a shout because she helped educate me for today’s segment. Um, okay, so we have this different ways you were suggesting of managing or of joining conversations, but i think isn’t that really the interest that non-profits would have if they’re not in tumbler, is to find conversations that are about their issues? Oh, definitely and i think, you know, some organizations have found that when they tried tio jump into temblor, see who may be out there already talking about their topic or, you know, be a passionate person in that cause area they found again because tumbler is such a sharing re posting culture that there were people where they maybe had a post that was really passionate or had a striking image. But then when you scroll down to their next one it’s on a totally different topic on, so it wasn’t as, you know, it wasn’t like there were tumbler accounts being managed by individuals where the whole focus of it was that cause area, because again, if you’re looking for individuals, well, individuals have more than one interest and it’s the same as if you were to, you know, look through a facebook, but you’re going to see people post him out all different things they care about. So if you do want to go find those conversations that already happening it’s important to remember that you may not be finding a specific tumbler post that is reflective of an entire tumbler account being focused on that issue, you know, and trying to away where tio jump in, or who may be just posted it because it was provocative versus who’s really passionate about that topic. Now, to help with this, the tumbler does have hashtags. Yeah. So if you find hashtags related to your the conversations that impact your issues, you could you could pass those along. You couldn’t pass along the individual posts? Yes, exactly. Okay, but not necessarily the entire person. Although you might, you know, it’s it’s hard to tell. In fact, there was someone at the meeting yesterday who expressed concern about exactly what you’re talking about, that ah lot of the conversation, a lot of people in a conversation around her issue, which was, um e-giving a transportation alternative to prevent gender based attacks at night. You know, those people like you said they’re multidemensional there people, and they weren’t always talking about things. That the organization was comfortable referring its its supporters too. Okay, so just, you know, an example. Of what you’re saying now for charities to get started, there are there are templates like themed templates sort of like wordpress has yeah, exactly i would like to say a little more than you can jump in, you know, i think what a lot of the social platforms have have shown people is that we’ve we continue to get further and further away from the super designed and mohr into the simple. So a lot of tumblr account that you will find whether it’s an actual organization, you know, that has has created that channel or an individual’s simpler is the way to go, you know, having a very clear or maybe funny or provocative or what have you title and sub header on the account, but the design doesn’t need to have this, you know, beautiful kind of gray scale background photo with all of these other, you know, buttons and labels it’s meant to be focused on the content, so just having a very clean, simple design so that the content and those especially if it is photos or videos, they really just pop out and the question just flooded my mind, okay? The so you can you khun brand it, but it doesn’t have to be it doesn’t to be super branded and super elegant is it’s more about the content? If someone if a charity wants to get involved and start a tumbler account and make that for a, how much should they expect to be participating? How maney posts or or re re posts? Should they be doing in a day? Let’s say, orlando, i’m not necessarily today like maybe in a week or something like that? Yeah, i mean, i think that magic number question is the same, you know, with any with setting up a facebook page or sending up a twitter account, you know you’re gonna have to test out and find what that magic number is for your organization and for your community. The important piece isn’t necessarily how frequently but it’s that it is constant, you know, like it is every weekday if you’re going to commit to one today or you know it is every month it’s regular so that people don’t come and see that you posted ten things all on friday, the nineteenth and then you don’t post anything and tell august first, you know it. Isn’t that there’s a look? There’s nineteen great post here, whatever, but that it’s a regular so that your logging in you’re saying what’s going on on dh, just like twitter, it can’t just be you posting when it’s such a social platform, you need to be searching using hashtags or, you know, looking for different users and finding those posts that are great and reese posting them. So just like on twitter, you know those accounts that are always just pushing things out? Well, there’s not a lot of engagement there, but when you start retweeting other people and replying to other people, you know, you create more of a loop for engagement, sharing, participating, engaging all the things we’ve talked about on all the different platforms we’ve talked about, all right? We’re going to get their sample ward, thank you very much. Sure, you’ll find amy at amy, sample ward, dot or ge, and on twitter she’s at amy r s ward next week event leadership honorees, chairs and committees recruiting, motivating and working with event volunteers. It’s another fund-raising day interview from this past june, and jean takagi returns he’s, our legal contributor and principal of the non-profit and exempt organizations law group in san francisco. Have you looked at our youtube channel there? I have over eighty interviews there and a couple of standup comedy clips. The youtube channel is riel tony martignetti insert sponsor message over nine thousand leaders, fundraisers and board members of small and midsize charities. Listen, each week you can reach me on the block. If you’d like to talk about sponsoring the show. Our creative producer was claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz, his line producer, shows social media is by regina walton, of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Oh, i hope you’ll be with me next week. Friday, one to two eastern at talking alternative broadcasting at talking alternative dot com hyre. Dahna you didn’t even think that shooting getting, thinking. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Get in. Take it. You could are you a female entrepreneur ready to break through? Join us at sixty body sassy sol, where women are empowered to ask one received what they truly want in love, life and business. Tune in thursday, said noon eastern time to learn tips and juicy secrets from inspiring women and men who, there to define their success, get inspired, stay motivated and defying your version of giant success with sexy body sake. Soul. Every thursday ad, men in new york times on talking alternative dot com. 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Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication. And the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership? Customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com that’s improving communications, dot com improve your professional environment. Be more effective, be happier. And make more money. Improving communications. That’s. The answer. Talking.

143: Twitter Tactics and ASW FAQs – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Melanie Mathos and Chad Norman, co-authors of “101 Social Media Tactics for Nonprofits”

Amy Sample Ward, co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere,” membership director for Nonprofit Technology Network and our monthly social media contributor.

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent i’m your aptly named host it’s friday, may twenty fourth oh, i hope you’re with me last week, i’d suffer pilo nephritis. If i heard that you had missed a conversation with gary vaynerchuk, we found out from this new york times best selling author sought after speakers, social media consultant and wine expert. What insights his book the thank you economy holds for leaders of small and midsize non-profits one takeaway from last week treat your employees better than your donors and maria’s mixed bag maria simple, the prospect finder and our regular prospect research contributor had a few things for us ah conference reminder a tweak to google alerts and the report millennials and money from merrill lynch this week twitter tactics melanie mathos and chad norman are with me. They co authored one hundred one social media tactics for non-profits melanie mathis and chad norman and i will talk twitter and a s w f accuse amy sample ward, our social media contributor, membership director for non-profit technology network and ten and co author of social change, anytime, everywhere had five speaking gigs this week in washington, d, c and burlington, vermont, and here in new york city and she’s going to share the questions that she was asked throughout the east coast. My pleasure now, to welcome melanie mathis. First, she is senior public relations manager at blackbaud, spreading the word about their products, services, employees, customers and research. Before joining blackbaud, she worked as a development consultant and in the publishing industry on twitter, she’s at m e l emma tho, mel method and chad norman he’s, director of marketing at spark, a technology services company. In two thousand seven, he founded go green charleston, a technology focused non-profit helping charleston, south carolina area residents engage around the local sustainability community. He is at chad’s norman on twitter melanie chadwell comm thanks, honey. A credit to you. Yeah, tony. Thanks. Thanks for having to stay pumped to be here. That’s a pleasure. Thanks, chad. All right. Pleasure to have both of you. Um, your book is very tactical one hundred one social media tactics. But we need to start mohr strategically. Is that is that? Is that right, melanie? Yes. Way often refer to the book is a book about tactics has a sneaky strategy undertone, and we’ll skip well, we’ll get a quick little give away the one hundred first tactic. Is that a strategy? If you’ve made it that far and you haven’t thought through a strategy shouldn’t be implementing any tactics because you generally wouldn’t have a direction that you’re playing. George, right? And we’ve emphasized that on this show many times not just to jump into social media, but what are your goals? Why are you thinking about? Ah facebook page or twitter? Presidents are linked in group or a hashtag on twitter, which we’ll talk about s o you have some you have some advice in the book about strategy post chad, you wantto just brief us quickly on what post is about? Yeah, absolutely. The post method was actually created by gesture enough and charlene lee from their book ground swell and it’s just a really simple, easy way to break through like the scariness of actually creating a strategy, right? I think a lot of people hear that word and get a little freaked out and which is precisely why it’s in the book, right? Because then people just go straight to tactics. Like, well, i don’t really want to write down a strategy i’m just going to actually go through and, you know, implement some things quickly so the post melkis simple it’s just actually think about the people that you’re trying to reach that theo in post our p e and the o is objective like, what do you trying to achieve? Try to put some smart goals in there from numbers and things? Your strategy is the s and that’s sort of how things are going to look on the other side, where the outcomes you’re looking for and then finally, the technology or the tactics in our case, how are you going to implement or what do you gonna implement actually reach get those three things first, three things in order. We’ve talked a lot on this show with amy sample ward, who is going to be with me later about strategy and, in fact, the two full shows on march fifteenth and april nineteenth, we talked about her book that she co authored social change anytime, everywhere so we’ve had voted two full hours in the very recent past to that strategic thinking around online engagement, so now i thought this was a very good balance. Let’s do some tactical and i want to focus on twitter. That’s ah, you two are amenable to that? Absolutely no. Okay, it’s, a favorite goat can’t really it’s your favorite. Okay, okay, um, i’m glad you’re amenable. Otherwise we wouldn’t have too much talk about if you had said no, i’d rather not know. Then we’d be pretty much out of luck. So let’s start with something really pretty basic creating a twitter background. Um, melanie, why is this important for ah your strategy and how it fits into your general branding rather than just having some a default twitter background? Sure so read by non-profits surely take advantage of all of the different platforms and all the different space allotted to them personalized and bring your brand through to their communities, so that could be a twitter background. Google plus cover facebook cover whatever it may be, you’re given this st an avatar of background to tell your story and so it’s very important, i think, because not the visitors here perspective social accounts, that’s the first thing you’re going to see, they’re going to see how your organization is. Representing itself, and you should really be able to tell very quickly, but a nonstop is trying to convey it. So that’s, why it’s very important to put a lot of thought into the detail around all of your social branding, and you have a very good example in the book, the high veld horse care unit, can you maybe you, khun melanie, give a couple of tips either either using that as an example or just, you know, some general tips that you saw that that they did sure have a commission that is it’s pretty upsetting it’s all about ending cruelty to animals so they could have gone that route? But what they’ve chosen to do is to really provide a really uplifting photo it’s gonna fire people help them towards their mission of happy horses. So i think it’s hcc you is their twitter handle. I will get back to if it’s not, but what i like about it is they have ah, clear call to action. They have other ways that you can get in touch with the organization right there. They’re using this space wisely. They have one strong image, they’re on brand they’re using. The right colors, they’re using their logo and just overall it really reflects their overall lead presidents as well. And chad, how would we get started with creating a twitter background? We can’t go through, you know, we can’t go through all these tactical tips step by step, although the book is very good step one, two, three, four, five and but but how would we get started with creating our own twitter background? Right? I think you take a start, it like looking at what you want to have that back on, right? Like taking your brand and sort of interpret it, you know, interpreting that through the lens of twitter like, what does that mean on twitter? How could my background graphic look? Maybe look at some examples get some ideas of things you like then actually executing a strategy and what you want have on it’s pretty simple, you just demographics editor, whether that’s, photoshopped or one of the free ones that you can download or a graphic designer like he would have to happen on fast, right and pretty much you’re just kind of creating something from scratch, right? A good size to use is sixteen. Hundred by twelve hundred pixels that’s going to cover most most twitter backgrounds most computer sizes or they go really big if you’d like andi, i tend to recommend for people to actually do a full image rather than use the tiled approach, which we can create one small image in the tile it you’ve been a full, big, large image give you really good control over where the elements are going to sit in the background. So i think the idea that not over think it, you can find some good examples that you like and, you know, really put a lot of that good stuff in the upper left and then really make sure the rest of the page really looks great on twitter, right? Because you’ve got the chance to not only is your twitter background, but then customize the link color and some of the elements on your twitter profile page and, you know, again don’t spend too much time and because most people going to ingest twitter from a twitter client or something like that. But again, like melanie said, this is a great first impression opportunity, as a lot of times people are seeking. A proper for the first time on social and so make sure your twitter profile page looks off when they land there. You mentioned the upper left, you said important stuff in the upper left. What what’s that about? Yeah, so the upper left is a really visible part of the twitter profile page, right? You know you’re going to get a little bit if you look at the way the twitter page renders there’s a little space up there like a few hundred pixels, we can squeeze some stuff in there and then kind of moving down the left hand side, so we’ll be seeing a lot of people doing is putting a really nice brand image up there, whether it’s a photo are their logo or something like that. And then i have some information that the left side where you can actually put information about your website, maybe a leak they called action. You could maybe even includes some people that are going to be posting on your twitter account there so it’s just a good opportunity to throw some content up because we know people are people’s eyes on the web, go to the upper left. And there is a little bit of space there on the twitter profile. Okay, we know that that’s, where people look first when they go to a new page bilich upper left. Okay, do we know where they go? Second, probably just reading a book down, going, going to the right down from there, right, straight across, diagonally to the right. Okay, we’re gonna take a break for a couple minutes. Go away. Of course. Melanie mathos and chad norman, stay with me. We’re going to keep talking about twitter tactics, and i hope you stay with us, too. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you confused about which died it’s, right for you? Are you tired of being tired? How about improving your energy strength and appearance? Hi, i’m ricky keck, holistic nutrition and wellness consultant. If you have answered yes to any of my questions, contact me now at n y integrated health dot com, or it’s, six for six to eight, five, eight five eight eight initiate change and transform your life. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s. The answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’ve got lots of live listener love going out to singapore. I don’t think we’ve had singapore represented before and in china, chung ching and beijing and also taiwan. So to everybody in singapore, china and taiwan knee how los angeles, california. Mira loma california in fort worth, texas welcome live listen to love to all of you and lots of other live listeners as well. Um, let’s talk some more about sort of getting started on twitter. Melanie and chad one of your recommendations is to add a twitter follow button. Melanie, how is this? How is this helpful or what is it sure so a lot of the tactics in our first chapter, which set up chapter, just focused on things that you, khun due to optimize all your channels and to really make it easy for you your community to engage with you. So twitter has provided these lovely buttons about four different kinds that you can actually put on your site or on your bog, and they have different focus areas so you can have a button that allows people to easily share a link like i’m sure people are super familiar with justin blogging platforms, but you can also use this for other valuable pieces of content, so think resource is not brochures. I doubt anyone’s going to get so inspired they wanted to share your brochure on twitter, but something that is going to be x stating maybe research or cool article in-kind follow button is probably the most used button behind that and it’s just a button that you can place on your contact page in a foot or sidebar on your site. Donation confirmation form is a good place that allows people just click right on your website and instantly follow you without having to go to twitter and do it there on the hash tag is another one that’s really good that you khun you can pre populate which hash tag? The tweet will mention so it’s, good for a campaign if you’re asking people to add their voices, conversation, et cetera and then the mention wantedto awesome one for asking questions and getting support. So perhaps you have online fund-raising support person who you could add their handle right there, so it’s easy for people to contact them. On their preferred channel, if it’s twitter so there are all kinds of ways to really incorporate into your sight into your different channels, and i want listeners to know that we’re live tweeting because the shows social media manager regina walton is in the studio so you can follow the hashtag non-profit radio. Also, we found the the twitter id melanie for high veld horse care unit it’s at h h c u regina found that gina found that no problem, of course you know we’re covering you, i put you on the spot, regina found it and she live tweeted it. But beyond that we’re live tweeting this shows you can follow the hashtag non-profit radio. Okay, melanie there’s so there’s a lot there. Where would you recommend putting the the content ad button with tzekel right by the title of something? Or where does that go on a block post or something else that you want people to share? I’m going to throw this went over the chad because he’s more of the technical implementation. He probably has a better insight on this. Yeah, so i mean a lot of time. This is that is in response. To the people that have, you know what, i’m supposed to put a twitter icon like on their on their pages, like you can click that and go to twitter dot com and follow from there, but the idea of having us followed button instead, it is a little more powerful and you can put it kind of anywhere but needs to make sense, right? You don’t want to put this in sort of your social sharing area where you want people to tweet a blogger post or like it on facebook, or share it on pensions or something this would go sort of in some other places, like alongside a twitter box like a weird showing your feed right? You can put the follow-up button right there and say, hey, i just want to follow, you know, follow from here, you can put it in blog’s sidebars you could put at the top of bottom of block post greatly labbate you’re about us, page, write a page where you’re listening out a lot of other ways to get in contact with you. A donation confirmation page is another great place where you can actually have it like hey, thanks. For making that donation here keep up to date with the followers on twitter and having just do it right there, your press room or even on a custom kapin facebook so kind of any other places where you’re trying to, you know, get people teo, you know, communicate with you more and follow you and give you give your contact information you mentioned the twitter feed how do we how do we put that chad in in our on our blogger on our site, right? So it’s it’s, another widget from twitter you can actually go to twitter dot com and their resource section, as well as a place where you get the followed button and you can actually get a nice live twitter feed. You’ve seen these on lots of different sites. It’s another tactic in the book and you can actually bring your live twitter feed onto your website, right, which is great for two reasons one and explosions all the great things they’re doing on twitter and helps get get that message out farther, but it also brings in dynamic, real time content to your site to make it more of a lively place we see. A lot organizations doing this even on their home page, where they pull in like their latest tweet, i think you may decide it does that so it’s just again, another way to bring twitter outside of twitter itself and put it on your website. Can you modify that chad so that’s not only your twitter feed, but it’s it’s the occurrence of any time that somebody uses your twitter id? Absolutely yeah, you can do it search results, you can do a hashtag, you can do just the profile so it’s very customizable both from my content perspective and from a design effective you can actually use the css and use some of the attributes actually make it match the html of your website, so it doesn’t look like like a placid on there, so you have very customizable bullet from a content and design perspective. How technically savvy do you have to do tow b to do some of these things? Almost almost not none at all, right? Both, though all the wages are customizable on twitter with a really great with the wig, what you see is what you get type interface we just kind of get select colors if you’re non-technical person, they don’t have access to the website your website. You may need someone what basically twitter dot com spits out a piece of code and you could take that piece of code and put it on your website. So if you can’t do that yourself, you just need to send it to the person that can and do a little we should just take a couple minutes so so really rates again dynamic conta countryside as well. So you mentioned if you’re not a technical person, so a lot of small non-profits i think run into this problem where they just don’t have a lead person on staff to be able to do updates all the time. So what does that really pulls a dynamic content? So when people go to your site it’s not gonna look like it hasn’t been updated in a month? Yeah, it doesn’t look like a site from two thousand three. Exactly. Okay, okay. Um let’s see? Oh, chad. So you mentioned your doing this? What you see is what you get so you’re basically designing it and then the twitter site this is this is all through twitter. Dot com will give you the code based on the way you designed it. Absolutely. Yeah. You just you selected another color you want the links to be and how you want the outline, the look and what the font should be. And you say, you know, i think it’s generate code or i forget the button is but and it actually just spit out some code that you can copy and paste on and that it’s a little nice little in bed code. And where do we find the resource is paige? Is that is that the the navigation barman twitter we goto our twitter page. Wait schnoll looked at out, milady. Did you have that on the top of hands? I think it’s, just twitter dot com flash about flash resource is possibly, um but again, i didn’t have that handup okay. That’s ok, i put you on the spot. So it’s twitter dot com slash about slash resource is ok. Ok. We like to like to share the detail here on tony money enough. So i like it. Get people, you know, get people started a swell as engaged. Okay, well, since we’re talking about all this stuff that could be on our site um, i’m going to turn to you still, chad, how do we make sure that our site is not getting too crowded now? We’re talking about these buttons and the background should have certain detail. How do we make sure we’re not getting too overwhelming? Yeah, absolutely. You want to avoid sort of the nascar factor, right where she’s got, you know, just tons of things kind of all clapped when one page again, you have to be strategic about it. You don’t want to just throw these things all over the place. You want to kind of think about when you’re designing any web page, what you want, the primary and secondary action for someone to be on that page, right? And so i think when you’re looking at, for instance, a twitter follow button that’s not going to probably fall into any of those two categories unless it’s a page about your social presidents are a page about reaching out to your connecting with you more so i think, you know, you really got to look at it from that perspective, right? When you’re adding anything to a page, is this? Is this contributing to the one thing i want them to do on this page, right? So again, get putting twitter but putting on extra stuff on there just going to detract from that so again be strategic about it. Okay, very important. Yes, we want this is all these tactics are part of a bigger strategy, which absolutely said, but merits saying again okay for you, melanie there’s a there’s, a recommendation in the book that you can personalize twitter and share, whose share with with visitors who’s doing the tweeting. Why? Why is that a good idea? Well, because twitter and facebook, it’ll get more crowded by brands, i think it’s even more important, to really personalize it and humanize organization people give the people and fund-raising right, and people communicate with people over a brand all day long, so if you’re doing it right, communicating on social should really feel very personal there much of a one on one conversation, and it often is if if you are doing it right, you are going to be you having those one on one interactions of advertise with your constituents so it’s nice to be able to present who’s. Behind this mystical organization accountants, you know who are the people that are actually behind it? They’re not robots, they have names, they probably have their own twitter handles and even better if you can add a photo to really human eyes who this person is that you’re communicating with its really going to increase engagement in the long run, you used the example of the humane society doing this very well, right? They have one thing they had several people treating on their account, that’s another really good thing to bring up is, you know, you’re going to try to get that consistency and voice, but everyone’s in a community a little differently, so just hurry up acknowledging that content organizations choose to even put initials on you, the author of the treated if it’s a team tweeting, uh, right now, i think they just have one person who’s kind of the face of their twitter account that if you go to their handle it’s very clear who it is and it’s a friendly face pompel durney can relate teo and have met hundred persons is very much the same when she portrays herself on social, so i think it’s really, really adds to the credibility of the brand and the mission. How do you manage this at at blackboard? Melanie so the blackbaud we have cheryl black who’s heading up our social now, so if you go to this site, you’ll see her face and her twitter handle right there, so people know exactly who they’re talking about, so you’re not hypocritical. You actually are following your own advice. Yes, actually, dad and i built the social program together a blackbaud and at one point, both of our mugs were up there because way were the voice of blackbaud but now we we’ve kind of handed over that torch, so people know that cheryl is the person that they’re communicating with. I have lots of hypocrites who our guests on twenty martignetti cafferata art, in fact, i tried to recruit them that way, you know? I like people who just have advice for others, so you’re an exception to that on admirable exception, both of you. All right, chad, where we’re going to share this? This personalization, these photos names. Where do we do this? On our site? Yeah. Again. You can sew the couple ways, i think. Melanie talked about having to be part of your twitter background graphic you can have it be a part of your on twitter, your description of the site you know where you talk about hey, this is who our brand is and by the way, the tweets or by so and so on and again, i think money may have mentioned some people do it on a twitter level. You’ve got five people actually tweeting you can do it like i think it’s a little, a little carrot and then some initials, so people at it that way you can also put on your website again when you’re when you’re talking, a lot of a lot of accusations do this in different ways, put out who their public faces are, who is talking, they could be on the contact that page, it could be in the press room again, just another opportunity to get that faith associate with the brand. I think it also goes both ways. We talk about being engaged to the to your supporters, into your audience, but also, i think, engaging the other way where it makes the person who’s doing the tweeting and doing the actual social activity feel a little more empowered within their own company, right? And helps them develop their own brand, which makes them do their job better, right? They become more invested. And so i think it kind of works both ways it’s really powerful tactic to get people were just really involved in really engaged in twitter on both sides. I’m talking with melanie mathos and chad norman. They are co authors of one hundred one social media tactics for non-profits the book goes much broader than twitter, we’re just focusing on twitter because on this show we haven’t talked about that specifically for quite some time. But the show there’s the book is much broader tactics in ah, all the social media sites um, we can we can make this even more personal chat with some actual, like meetings and getting to know people locally. You have some ideas around that? Absolutely so i mean, twitter is one of the best ways you can use it is to actually reach out and to attract new people right now, it’s a great public facing tool that people really looked too now as an extension of your your media arm. And an organization so there’s, definitely some great waste interact locally, so we talk about a couple of them in the book. One of the coolest things a lot of people don’t know about is a site called tweet aholic and there’s lots of ways to like look att who’s tweeting locally and who’s actually, you know, because the hashtag because of geo location but tweet aholic, take it one step further and allows you to, like you could dig in and see who are the top tweeters by city name, right? So you can look up a city like new york city or charleston, south carolina and actually see a list ranked by who tweets the most, who is the most followers? So this enables you to actually go out and say, like, hey, i want to find out who the fifty, noisiest people in charleston, people that i may not want to engage with. But, you know, people that if i could get them entrenched into my brand and the my message, they may re tweet us because they have a big influence over people. So it’s a great way to when you’re starting out sort of target. A local group of people that may eventually become your advocates and help you spread your message locally on another way to get involved in almost every city now has a hashtag right so new york city’s on this i’m guessing it’s probably n y c charleston’s see hs a lot of time it say your airport code or just, you know, whatever your tower goes by outlay is definitely ella for los angeles, so you can follow these hashtag you could put him in a search feed as many ways to contract it, but again, that helps you monitor the general chatter of a city, right? So you can kind of see who’s talking about what and you can use the hashtag actually put on your own tweets to get into that stream of people that may not already be following you. We have just about a minute and a half or so left. Melanie and i wanted to spend some time, make sure we talk about measuring your outcomes on twitter. You have some ways of doing that to see how effective you’re being. Yes, definitely, and part of developing your strategy is really, you know, defining what? Those measurable objectives are because everyone asks, how do i know what to measure? Well, if you know what you’re trying to achieve, you know what you want to measure, so there are a ton of ways to do this. Facebook has amazing tool built in with facebook in site where you can really get down to even very specific demographics gender location, something with you two really looking within your own website, really seeing where people are coming from through social referrals is very informative because some social networks pop up that you may not be on your radar atop channel for you and and specific to twitter you, khun, you can monitor your own name on twitter. You can you can even calculate your influence. You have ah, have a site where you can calculate influence what’s that so cloud has been around for some time, and now you’re seeing it surface in a lot of different tools who we now have krauz scores, which are influence scores, dealt right into profiles so that’s another way to really i d who your influence there’s are and how influential you are. Uh, if it’s if it’s trending up it says a lot if it’s turning down, if you want to see, you know what you’re doing differently, that kind of lessening your impact and your message, amplification and that’s, that cloud is k l o ut right, kale o ut, dot com, yes, okay, melanie and chad, we have to leave it there. Thank you so much for being part of the show. Great, thanks for having me, it’s. Been a it’s, been a real pleasure. Thank you both. Right now, we take a break when we come back. Tony’s, take two and then amy sample wards. F ake, use. Stay with me, e-giving thinking, tooting, getting dink, dink, dink, dink. You’re listening to the talking alternative network duitz nothing to get. Thank you, cubine. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m lost him a role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re gonna invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll dahna i’m leslie goldman with the us fund for unicef, and i’m casey rodder with us fun for unicef, you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Welcome back, maura live listener love joining us from asia, new delhi, india, and joining us from new zealand christ church also italy. But we don’t know your city in italy, you’re you’re masking yourself or we just we just can’t see you. But welcome italy born jar no um, norcross, georgia, new bern, north carolina, jersey city, new jersey, jersey city i used to visit new jersey city over on ah, what street was that? Where my grandmother lived? My father was born, mcadoo have mcadoo have in jersey city that’s? Probably not the part of jersey city you’re in, but but jersey city, new bern, north carolina and norcross, georgia live listener love to you time for tony’s, take two on my block this week, i feel bad for the irs determinations unit that’s, the irs office that is accused of unfairly scrutinizing and delaying applications for tax exempt status from mostly not exclusively but mostly conservative political organizations like the tea party and but i have been seeing that office struggle for years because i’ve seen applications for tax exemption routinely take close to a year, and i personally know groups that have waited more than a year even there was an automation project, the form that you fill out to get your tax exemption from the irs is formed ten, twenty three, and there was supposed to be an automation project where you could fill that form out online. Then they delayed the launch of that, and then i stopped hearing about it. So i always thought that that was bad news, you know, not a priority among the irs development staff toe automate that on and then in two thousand eleven, there were two hundred seventy five thousand charities that lost their tax exempt status, and tens of thousands of those reapplied they didn’t want to lose their tax exempt status. They were still active organizations, they re applied and to that same unit, so tens of thousands of new applications probably came in within months, i’d say of when that that iris loss of exempt status list was issued. So, you know, i just think that i’ve been seeing this determinations unit struggling for years many years as i’ve been around non-profits and i think it just came to a head and people were trying to be more efficient and flag something’s and categorize. Something’s and that turned out not to be such a good idea, but i don’t think it was politically motivated. I think it’s ah, staff people trying to just be more efficient, there’s more about that on my blogged at tony martignetti dot com, including some links that i have, and also including links that some commenters have had gotten some very good comments with with links to that post called i feel bad for the irs determinations unit and that’s tony’s take two for friday, the twenty fourth of may twenty first show of the year and also want to wish you happy. Memorial day long weekend coming happy memorial day and thinking about our our veterans who gave the ultimate sacrifice that’s what memorial days about? So we want to keep that in mind. Amy sample ward is with me now, and we know that she’s, our regular social media contributor, we know that she’s, the membership director at non-profit technology network, and we know that her most recent co authored book is social change. Anytime everywhere you may not recall that herb log is at amy sample war dot org’s but you probably do recall that on twitter she’s at amy, r s ward. Welcome back in the simple word. Thank you. I feel like maybe you’re experiencing ground hog day, and so for you you’re just like, oh, i have said all of this so many times you may recall it may recall it alright, but maybe some people don’t recall it. We could maybe, just maybe, the rest of us aren’t experiencing ground hog day. All right, welcome. I don’t know why. Why my welcoming you? Because if we if i don’t allow you to speak, then i’m at a loss for what to do for the next twenty minutes. I guess we’re gonna have to go ahead anyway. All right. You’ve been travelling. I saw you checked in laguardia airport like seven o’clock this morning. Yeah, that’s when i landed with seven a. M from where? From burlington. Okay, early flight from burlington. Yes, but i’m since four. Thirty. All right. All right. So you’ve been on the eastern seaboard this week? Yes. I have been taking a tour of the thunderstorm region and experiencing a lot of high humidity and sudden downpours. Okay. Yeah, well, welcome home. Thank you. You’ve been talking, i guess, about your book. Yeah, about the book. And and, you know, some of the events have been q and a’s. Some of them. I was joined by alison cape in and we did it together, and others were more like hands on workshops really focused on getting organizations kind of from the from the very beginning stages of maybe having a facebook page, but they don’t know who set. It up, or why? Or maybe not even really engaging much online and and just having an email newsletter, and that was it, and helping them figure out how to how to have some strategy and resource is in place so that they could go start engaging. Alison kapin of course, your co author of the book, how long do these workshops go? I mean, how long’s it take to get people to be more more savvy and strategic about what they’ve already jumped into and are not doing very well. It does not matter how much time the event is, people will say it was not enough time, you know? So i’ve done workshops that air just a knauer long i’ve done workshops that ahron entire eight hour day, and you get to the end of eight hours and i can barely speak out loud and certainly don’t want to hear my voice any longer, and yet people are like, so can you come back tomorrow and we’ll keep working on this, you know, because i think there is that feeling that when when someone who’s gone gone down the path before comes back to the beginning of the trail, you know, and is willing to go with you, will you don’t want them to just go the like the first mile of the hike you like, no take whole appellation trail is pretty long, you know, george, i don’t want you to leave me now, so but but ultimately the point of the workshops at least those that that i’ve been doing recently are really to get people not to a place where they leave the workshop feeling like, well, i have my strategy in place, i have a community map finished, you know, i know every piece of content i’m ever going to create, but instead they know how they can go create that content plan and how to create a community map so they can go do it with their staff, because ultimately, i don’t know what they dio i don’t know what their strategic plan is, so they can take it back, work on it with their staff and put something in place that makes sense for them. Okay, so let’s, talk about some of the questions that you’ve been getting talking about brought issues, certainly and right, but why don’t you start to share? What you got for us? I have a long list after five events i was so you’re you’re speaking is not very good because people have millions of questions you and as you know, i’m anticipating the questions, which is what a good speaker as you know, i find it very hard t just talk and talk my way talked about your that yes, exactly. Tim sample on the line, i don’t know what way have oregon. So the first one that i that i got consistently almost every event wass you know, not not so much the how much time should we invest but the why does it take so much time? Why, you know as if they assume they’re doing, they’re doing facebook wrong and that’s why it’s taking time? And i think it was really indicative that there is still no matter how much we hope it goes away, there is still the sense that you could just create some social media profiles and bam, you’re going to have a super engaged community that wants to, like, take that video viral like whatever it’s going to be and that’s it it’s not a silver bullet, you know? Social media is a place where you can you’re gonna have to invest time because it is a it’s, a slow burn, you know, you’re just going to build that community over over time, and it will continue growing if you continue investing time and, you know, all the rest. But, you know, people were really disappointed. Like, why is it taking me so much time to use facebook on overtime meaning years, right? This is long term stra, tragic engagement conversations, all the stuff that, you know exactly exactly, i mean, you know, some of those organizations, for example, that chad melanie we’re talking about and pointing to his great examples, especially using twitter. Well, they’ve been using twitter, most of them, you know, since two thousand seven eight nine and it’s been a while, you know, and and it’s not because they they joined twitter because they thought it was only going to be here for a year, they joined it saying, ok, well, you know, our communities out there, i think we can engage let’s just start engaging, and we’ll keep building on to what we’re doing. All right, you’ve got to recognize this is a long term right, irrespective of the platform. Exactly. Exactly. And, you know, even if for some reason, you know twitter shutdown tomorrow permanently, you’re going to have to go somewhere else and start building because the community also does the same thing even as people you know, when we join a new platform or go try out a new tool it’s not like we instantly all have our, you know, three hundred high school graduation friends that have somehow found us already. And, you know, even as individuals, it takes time to build up how you use a tool in what you’re who you’re following, etcetera. So why should it be different for an organization? Ok, another question that we got a couple times wass what if we don’t have any fans? What if we don’t have any followers? Like, how long do i use facebook before i stop? You know, how long do i use twitter before i stopped? Because well, you know, we don’t have any fans right now, so what? Why should i post? Why should i log in to facebook today and post something if i only have two fans and i totally understand that the emotional side of that question the like but no one’s listening to me. So why am i going? But again, think about it as if it wasn’t social media. If your organization said okay, we’re going, you know, pilot this new programme, we’re going to create a new service and day two of this new service no one shows up at your clinic. Well, you’re not like sorry. Yes, the service is done. We’re no longer providing, you know, health care checks because no one showed up today. You would you would laugh and think that that’s so silly, you know, if it was an offline thing, you would say we have to commit to it. We have to just say, you know, every day at nine o’clock we opened the clinic doors well, same on social media, obviously not to the same maybe extent, but you still have to say ok, every day we’re going to post something so that if and when people do come it’s it’s a living place it’s not, you know, a ghost town, social profile that’s never been used so and again, creating that consistent content that is valuable lets you share it with people. Let’s, give it, tell other staff, hey, we posted that report, you know, like melanie said, if you have a great new article or some research posted up there, even if you don’t have a lot of followers and friends, and then encourage the people out, the organization partners you work with to share it, but to share it from that social platform instead of just from your website and encourage people to go there and again, it’s, like, you’re going to have a thousand fans overnight, but you’ll get those people who said, oh, you’re oh, that research, you know, it’s really interesting i’m going to like your page or follow you on twitter in case you have more of that. So again, it’s it’s more of the commitment to being consistent and less of the well, no one’s here, so i don’t wantto play in the play room by myself, but is there a point where a new organization should say, you know, we’re just not we’re not getting any traction, maybe our constituents just aren’t interested in facebook or twitter. Yeah, i definitely think so, and that isn’t going to be decided in in a month, you know that comes over time when you know that you have given it a really effort, but it also goes back to things we’ve talked about on the show before about not creating social profiles unless, you know, your community is even using that platform or starting a strategy exactly. Exactly. So we, you know, for example, that one of the events yesterday in burlington someone said, you know, i’m hearing people talk about instagram, should i use instagram? My community is, you know, he described his community and i said, well, it sounds like and i don’t want to be making, you know, extreme generalizations, but it sounds like your community probably is not one that has ah lot of smartphones, you know, it’s, not a bunch of iphone users, and he said, no, probably not. Well, if you don’t, if you don’t a camera phone, you’re not using instagram. It isn’t that they’re not interested in photos as a general medium, but they’re not gonna have that app, so don’t feel obligated to go just create profiles every time you hear of a new application. Follow your community to those platforms so, you know it’s worth being consistent. With content, we gotta take a break. Go away for a couple minutes. Amy sample ward stays with me, and you should, too. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping huntress people be better business people. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Durney go live listener love for bridgeport, connecticut, new york, new york welcome, seoul, south korea. Anya haserot and very glad that things have calmed down a bit on the korean peninsula. I think it was just five weeks ago or so five, six weeks ago. You know what? Saber rattling and i mentioned it as i was doing live. Listen, love, i’m glad things have quelled a bit. They’re very, very, very glad of that. Kawasaki and tokyo, japan, konnichi wa and we have an unknown live listener in japan. You’re masking yourself. Well, we just can’t find you, but konnichi wa of course to the unknown japanese listener. Okay, amy, um, we finished offgrid instagram pretty much, you know, you don’t belong there. Really, if you don’t. If you don’t think your constituents have smartphones because it’s a smart it’s an app, right, right. Ok, what else you got for us? For your from your travels? Well, i have a few more. So one that came up in a in a couple different cities was the question of, you know, unlike the last question, you know, we don’t have anyone no one’s, no one’s liking us on facebook instead. What if we’re getting plenty of likes and they are not the right people? Oh, now, how are we defining the right people? Well, i i asked the same question think they were just like, you know, oh, they’re not the, you know, donors, and we only want donors or that’s what they don’t have a lot of following people follow us, but they don’t just tell us how you know, these were examples of, uh, primarily youth facing organization’s getting some, not pg thirteen appropriate accounts are connecting to them, okay on i and i think this is an interesting one to bring up because for some organization, you know, like they’re just if they’re just following you on twitter, for example, you might not even but you might not go through your followers list because maybe you’re just paid attention if they’re adding you or something, you know, if they’re if they’re replied you directly, then maybe it would get flagged to you, but to chad and melanie’s example of including on your actual website or on your actual blawg page, the follow or like us on facebook, widget, a little button and it and if you do that you can have it show, you know, that other people have have liked the paige, but you’d showing up on your website and they they have that because they wanted people to see that social like, hey, lots of people like us, you know, as soon as you went to the website, but unfortunately, that meant you would go to this website focused on youth services and see a string of inappropriate facebook photos along the top of the website and so their their community manager there, you know, the staff people that were managing those accounts felt like they had to at all times have the home page and facebook open so that they could refresh things frequently throughout the day. And if they saw a new person pop up, they could go into facebook and block them from the page or go into twitter and block them from the twitter if they’re inappropriate. Exactly. And that and and so that’s the whole other side of well, first you’re trying to just get and you know, that idea of i just need to get people to the page, and now you’re thinking, oh my gosh, these horrible people are on my page so, you know, how do you deal with that? And then again, i think it really does not exclusively you’re still going to have to do that physical management of deleting people are blocking people, but it comes back to content if you’re making it very clear that you are there providing services and not necessarily, you know, connecting people with youth, then then again, you’re setting the tone that this space is here to talk about the service they were, they were probably pretty clear about that. I mean, odds are it’s the person who was asking the question with people because these are multiple we got this a few times people who ask these questions, probably their sites are very pure and youth oriented, but they’re still getting inappropriate followers and friends. Well, i think the difference is that it’s it’s connecting facebook and your website, your website may be very clear what you d’oh, but often, organizations wantto have more of the like fundez social content on their facebook page, so that may mean they’re facebook parties is photos, events, etcetera, so on that facebook page, it may not have the same kind. Of institutional feel that the website does okay, so do what you can managing moderate, yeah, exactly, exactly on and then one more for tow highlight for today at the first time, i’ve gotten this question at these kinds of events, you know, normally get this question from people like you, tony, but instead i was getting it from, you know, normal citizens, and they were saying, well, isn’t facebook dead isn’t isn’t twitter just for like young people. Now i write an article that, you know, all these kids left facebook, and now they’re using twitter so all the adults should leave twitter very interesting perspective, that article i ask, such as, i’ve never ask questions like that. Well, you know, i think you’ve probably asked it in a more, you know, theoretical what’s the future. Okay, well, that’s much more insightful, but the undertones of is it a valuable place? Is it worth investing in, you know? And i think for those people they were coming at that question from well, if if this person says it isn’t, it isn’t going to be around for a long time that maybe i wouldn’t have to waste my time today. And i understand that feeling i have the love hate relationship like all the rest of us do with some of these tools, but at the end of the day, until we see that facebook really is dead, or we see that twitter is apparently only for young people like some article that that person read, they are still having huge engagement. There are so many daily active users, monthly active users, even in our own, the report that we do with them in our strategic services, the e non-profit benchmarks report showed that in two thousand twelve the non-profits that that we study and have access to their data for this report had over two hundred percent growth in their twitter fan base or follower base, so that may happen. A facebook could maybe be gone tomorrow, but today it is here and today there are millions of people using that platform, so you could say you don’t want to invest because maybe it could go away. But you have your trying to get people’s email address, and they unsubscribes it’s the same feeling if it if it is the channel that they’re choosing and that they’re there it’s worth engaging in and again, you should have a strategy that isn’t based on facebook. You should have a strategy based on engagement so that you can be nimble. Facebook goes away, you pivot. Go to the tool where the community is an example would thank you for sharing your f excuse for this week’s trips, of course, my pleasure next week, it’s going to be archive edition, but i don’t know which one s o if you have a show in mind that you can’t find, sometimes i get emails. There’s there’s woman on i can’t remember her name. She talked about this, but i searched your site and i can’t find it if it’s something like that. If you have a show in mind, you can find let me know on twitter or linkedin or facebook, and if i replay your suggestion next week using that show, then i will send you a social media roadmap, which amy gave me several of and i have one left, so if i use your show all ah, i’ll send you my last social media road map insert sponsor message over nine thousand leaders, fundraisers and board members of small and midsize charities are listening to the show each week. If you’d like to talk about sponsorship, contact me through the block. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is our line producer, and janice taylor is our assistant producer. Shows social media is by regina walton of organic social media, in the office in the studio, i should say this week, and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. We’re going to be on the road very soon, not too far marriott marquis in times square for nicey fund-raising day, and then in october, will be at bebe con. So that’ll be cem cem road tripping for the remote producer. I hope you will be with me next friday. Wanted to eastern for the archive show at talking alternative broadcasting at talking alternative dot com. I didn’t think you did a good ending. You’re listening to the talking alternate network duitz waiting to get into thinking. Nothing. Cubine hi, i’m donna and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s two one two seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you! You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. Hyre this is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays, one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time for action. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the isaac tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society, politics, business and family. It’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. 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138: A Conversation With Amy Sample Ward, Part Deux – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Amy Sample Ward, co-author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere,” membership director for Nonprofit Technology Network and our monthly social media contributor.

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Zoho welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent i’m your aptly named host feeling a little raw today little tender it’s friday, april nineteenth, and with what happened on monday in boston and then on early wednesday in west texas, the explosion in a fertilizer factory, of course, monday was the marathon bombing and now today, all kinds of craziness in boston, and maybe now, even on a train between boston and new york, we’re not really certain least that’s the latest i’ve heard as of, uh, one o’clock eastern, so yeah, i was goingto ah, i was going to implore you, teo to goto, itunes and ratan review the show, but that just doesn’t seem like it’s. Ah, really has a place today. We’ll deal with that another time. Just give your thoughts. Teo to boston and and watertown, massachusetts. Also a lot of stuff going on was bullets and explosions over in the overnight onda also thinking about west texas? I do hope you’re with me last week because i’d suffer it would hurt if it came to my ken that you had missed followship with alison fine she’s the co author of the network to non-profit and has been thinking lately about opening organizational culture to allow non-profits to be more reactive to the interests and motivations of their followers while still keeping goals in sight she shared her thoughts on followship and social media boundaries are legal contributor jean takagi from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group in san francisco suggested rules for your use of social media it can’t be a free for all for your employees and volunteers and jean had helped to keep you out of trouble this week a conversation with amy sample ward part do she’s our social media contributor and her new book is social change anytime everywhere we pick up where we left off on march fifteenth to talk about your fund-raising plans scheduling testing staffing budgeting and some tips for your website campaign and i’ll be chatting with amy’s dad also between, uh, well, between the half. Ours uh, roughly thirty two minutes into the our tony’s take two my block this week is keep your marketing simple. I’m always pleased to welcome amy sample ward to the studio she’s membership director at non-profit technology network and ten, as i said, her most recent co authored book, social change, anytime everywhere about online multi-channel engagement the forward is by two time guest of this show, craig mark, the founder of craigslist and craigconnects no, sorry work that in there that has been on the show twice, her blogged is amy sample, ward dot or ge and she’s at amy r s ward on twitter welcome back, kayman sample work. Thank you for having me back. It’s. Always a pleasure. Um, i guess my one of my first my first question is on the cover of this book the word’s, any time and everywhere. I’m showing her the cover now to remind her of the are separated. But they are not hyphenated. Why? Why aren’t they hyphenated the way proper english would be any hyphen time? Because they’re in different lines and every hyphen. Where where is the copy editing on this? On this cover? Yep. I don’t think i’m gonna let you just go by with this job. It’s it’s apparently thie design aesthetic. Okay, which you had no control over, i guess. Hyre okay. Okay. I think this should be hyphen. I mean, i think these things are important in a language, all right, but it helps you enunciate the title very well. Any time, every right. Trying to learn how to spell her. You would think that any time was two different words. And and it’s, not it’s, not everywhere is not two different words. It’s. True. Okay. Um let’s. Ah, i like to reflect a little bit. Okay. We talk all the time about online engagement and with what’s been happening this week. If you are engaged online on your charity, does nothing at all related to anything around violence or maybe victim or family support or politics of guns. Your charity has nothing to do with any of that. How do you respond? What do you do online, too? Let people know that you’re conscious of what happens in the world. That’s outside your own. Sure. I think i mean first i would say i understand the argument of, you know, we don’t work on the politics of gun issues, however, you probably work with people and ultimately in any crisis or disaster, people are involved, you know, and reminding your own staff that it’s not just about bombs or terrorism, this is still about people and treating whatever response, whatever communication you have next in that light that there are people involved in this, i think helps you just take the right tone regardless of where you go next, because you’re then being responsive to what if it was you, you know, you would want someone to treat you are your city or your issue like people were involved. Next, it’s a great opportunity to go check any scheduled messages you have any tweets or facebook post that air maybe already scheduled about something else. Also, look at your content calendar. You know where we planning on sending out an email appeal this week? That was, you know, using the story of this great little kid, and now maybe we don’t i want to do that story or maybe not that message it all this week, you know, not that you have to completely shut down. Every organization didn’t stop this week, but trying to be responsive, teo, the fact that, you know, even in your own goals, you’re probably not going to get the analytics or the metrics you wanted, you know, no one’s going to be clicking through that email anyway, if that’s not what’s on their mind. So looking at not just scheduled tweets, but what’s on your what’s scheduled to go up on your block what’s scheduled to go out and email looking at all of that immediately so that you can either put things on hold, readjust change, maybe which story was going to be in a newsletter? You know, there’s things like print ads or direct mail that that that’s already out there, you know? But people also don’t look at the newspaper and think, i can’t believe that this ad ran like because in our minds, we know that that’s not like a real time media, and we know that that’s program six weeks in it, right? Exactly, but when you see something go up on twitter, you know, when you everyone else is just watching twitter for news updates it it really does feel a little bit more. Careless because they know that you let it happen. You know, you could have changed that tweet. We talk a lot about engaging with people online. Not so dissimilar lee from the way we engage with people face to face, you know? And when when i saw you earlier today, we you know, i told you that i was feeling raw and sensitive and you know, that was that was really basically after right after hello. Yeah. So, you know, i’m doing that in it, you know? I’m sure i’ll do that with friends. I meet for dinner tonight. It’s not it’s, not unlike online when you can have a conversation about this or at least share your feelings when it really it just doesn’t deal with your data your day to day world, right? It’s it’s never going toe. I mean, i don’t want to say never as if any statement could ever be, you know, all all encompassing. But for the most part, it’s not going to hurt your organization to say something like, our hearts are going out to the victims and here’s a link to resource is or hears, you know, the the google spreadsheet that was created to help, you know, people say i found this person or this person is missing, you know, like that it doesn’t hurt your brand, it doesn’t hurt your cause, even though you might work on a totally separate mission to say, hey, we know this is happening, and we want to make sure that we’re one more post in your facebook stream that’s pointing to resource is instead of to something else, okay, excellent. Sabat well, we’re going to pick up with where you and i left off last month. It was march fifteenth with the fund-raising plan, we have just met and a half or so before we go away for a couple of a couple minutes, why don’t you just tease a little bit? Share what, what we might be talking about with respect to a fund-raising plan? Sure, i think last time we talked kind about the components of the plan and this time we can get and i think to the nitty gritty, a little bit more like what does a bee testing really look like in a campaign, especially in real time? How do you figure out what’s working and keep kind of iterating as you’re in the middle of the campaign and then also what does that look like for your organization? Who’s involved once the campaign is live, is it just that development director or other staff? You know, playing into that campaign on then even what does it look like on online? What is what is your website need to do to be responsive to the campaign? Okay, maybe testing. Yeah, i don’t i’m not sure that that really qualifies for jargon jail, i’m not really feeling like putting buy-in jargon, and it probably doesn’t even really qualify. But why don’t you just explain what a be testing is? Sure. So for the most part, you could test everything on your website just by saying, well, it’s, their people are clicking on it, they like it, but it’s a little bit more scientifically valid. If you say have two buttons and people when they came to your website, they’re being presented with one of two buttons, and then you can just leave it up for a few days and say, gosh, anyone that saw the blue button clicked three times more than anyone that saw the red button, for example. So, it’s, just changing one component at a time with two versions, so that you can figure out which works better and then start changing the next thing. And you’re directing people to both of them? Yes, simultaneously. Yep, i guess, randomly, exactly. Okay. And you, you have an excellent example in the book about the the clinton bush haiti fund, and we’ll talk a little about that. Ok, we go away for a couple seconds. When we come back. Amy and i will continue this conversation about about her book and and your fund-raising plan. Stay with us talking alternative radio, twenty four hours a day. Are you confused about which died it’s, right for you? Are you tired of being tired? How about improving your energy strength and appearance? Hi, i’m ricky keck, holistic nutrition and wellness consultant. If you have answered yes to any of my questions, contact me now at n y integrated health dot com, or it’s, six for six to eight, five, eight five eight eight initiate change and transform your life. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s. The answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, not too many live listeners today, i’m suspecting that a lot of people are if they’re online, they’re looking at cnn or some other some other news source that they trust. But i will say, live listener love out too. Forest grove, oregon and new bern, north carolina also since shu taiwan ni hao and for korea, we have listeners in seoul and young in korea. Buy-in yo haserot glad that you’re very glad, very glad that you’re with us. Thank you. Um okay, kayman sample word let’s talk about some of these details of of a be testing. What does this look like? Well, you can do it. I mean, even though we used the example before of your website, you can do it on anything. You know, you could do it in an email. Newsletters on little microsite, it’s. Just a page essentially, whatever. Wherever you’re trying to put content out, you could do a be testing. So it could mean different photos, different buttons, that text it could also mean having a photo or no photo. You know? Ah lot of organizations will do a b testing specifically around fund-raising with on that on that donation page, does it have a photo or does it just have the form or, you know, does it show maybe a image of some sort that shows, like, how they’re using the funding, for example, or what the project looks like that they’re asking for money for or again, is it just the form, you know? So and that’s it it’s going to change it’s not going to be the same for every single organization? You know, you have to do that testing because if especially if you’re an organization that’s used a lot of images in your campaign in your appeals that’s, you know, that it’s driving people to remember what, what this is all about maybe having that photo there again, we’ll just keep that emotional tie to the campaign. But if it’s your raising money for something that you haven’t been using, that kind of graphical support for, well, maybe people would get there and say, why do you have this random photo of a child up here? You know, so so you want it to be consistent, but you also want a test to see. What’s going to get the most completion on that form. Okay. And so i just said quickly before the break. But you are you are you randomly? Your technology is randomly assigning people too different a and b version that’s what? They be testing it first of a and b version. Is that right? What happens? So there are all different levels of sophistication, so you may be using a tool. Google has a, uh, baby testing tool. Optimize. Lee is another pretty sophisticated tool to use for that, especially around your website. But with email marketing, you could just say we want to send, you know, half the list, this message and half the list. This message or say you have a thousand people on your email list, send the the first one hundred message a the next one hundred message be and then wait two hours, see which one had more opens and then say, great, we’re going to go with that message to the other eight hundred. Okay, so this could be that instantaneous. We’re just a couple of hours. Exactly. Okay. Okay. Now, an email, a popular thing to test is a subject line, right? You could be having different versions of a subject line, right? Everything else would be the same. Exactly. The message inside is the same. But having, you know, a call to action versus you know anyone, regardless of which side you support anyone that’s on a political list. You’ve seen them testing those subject lines. You see messages coming almost every day during campaign season. Sometimes it just has one word. You know, sometimes it has your name in it sometimes it’s a really long call to action and that’s just those campaigns testing out what’s getting the most people to open this on the on the fund-raising landing page side, you have the example of the clinton bush haiti fund. They changed something so subtle, just the words within the button that you click right. The red, they have a red button and i have i’ve read that red is a very powerful colors. Red is supposed to be a very good button color for donate now for donation buttons or buy buttons. So they changed it from submit that the word in the button was submit to support haiti, and they got a fifteen percent increase in dollars per page view just something so subtle is that exactly and part of that, you know, some organizations think, well, we don’t want to write submit because normally, you know what we want them to do is donate or whatever their word choice, maybe, but if you have all throughout your website, if you keep using the word support, support us through your donations, support us by taking this action, and then someone gets to a page where there’s a button that says donate well, it feels really weird because you’ve already been consistently using this it’s other word, so that consistency is important, you know? And again, if if you go look on your website now and you see that on your your donate paige it’s the only place you say the word donate but the rest of the time you really are talking about, support us financially. That’s an opportunity to do some testing because maybe donate works for your organization, and you should change those other places where it says support or the other way around. Okay, excellent example, right of potential testing. Another thing they did there. There’s. This little geo trust verified icon. I guess that it’s a trustworthy site, right? Forgiving? Is that what that is right? And there are all different kinds of those, you know, whether it’s charity navigator, geo trust like all those different things that say, basically, we’re not goingto take your money and do something else with it, i guess again, there’s different levels of what these other certification sites mean to, but some places have found, you know, some organizations found that by putting those kinds of seals of approval, i guess you would say on the donation for more on the button, they saw a big increase, but others have found like they did. You know, when you when you take it away, you actually haven’t they well, they decode, they had to do when they when they took that away, they lost five percent revenue right per page view. Exactly. There’s a trusted icon similar to papal, verified on the commercial side. Exactly. So people have gotten really used to even if people don’t necessarily know what geo trust is or they don’t know what you know, charity navigator is they don’t know what they are, but the fact that it says it’s verified, you know, someone’s looked into these people, give some amount of trust, some of the things that you suggest it could be changed on dh tested form fields, how many form fields you have the donation amounts that air suggested those little radio buttons that you click ten, twenty five, fifty hundred and that’s a really big into change especially, you know, certain campaigns have found easy ways to to mix that up because if they had a number involved in the campaign, you know, if if the campaign was around ah, holiday and it was on the thirteenth or it was a military campaign and they wanted to use the six as there number, and so then you just have increments of six, and you, maybe you say sixty is the default. Whenever organizations test that out, often they find people that the hyre number really does get donated because they’ve just mixed it up a little, you know, they didn’t defaulted to ten, you know, they put it up there a bit because people will still put it down if they want to have a smaller number, you know, but showing kind of the idea with where that preset radio button. Selection is is basically trying to say this is the average gift. This is the normal donation. So it’s not, you know, we’re expecting you to do this, but, hey, most people are doing this one. Thats why its preset on sixty. You know, eso it just encourages people. Tio not think oh, this is just a ten dollar or that’s. Just the twenty five dollar normal donation, you know, so putting different numbers in there that are, like, thirty three and, you know, throws people a little. We have. We have tim sample on the line, tim samples called, and this is amy’s. Dad, he called in last month. Tim. Tim sample. How are you doing in oregon? I’m doing good. Doing good and plays it’s it’s already done, or or a gun or gone where? There’s no evil or we’ll help you. Oregon. All right, there you go. You go. Oregon. Are it’s not gone? There’s? No e at the end. Oh, thank you. Alright, oregon, but i’m right in the middle of work right now, but i’ve had an opportunity to come down on my desk and lock the doors. Nobody bought it. I’m at your disposal. Thank you, tim. You know, i wanted to ask you. I have here with me. You know, this little kind of sort of shrinking kind of wallflower, you know? Never not very engaged. Not very out there. What? What? What is she always like this when she was growing up? Oh, you’re talking about my daughter? Yeah, i know. I know. It’s. Hard to tell. Yeah. Yeah, alright, now, but without the sarcasm has always been a type a personality. Yeah, and always always engaged. Like, was she in? A lot of i could’ve asked her, but it’s more fun to ask you. Was she out there? Like, in activities in elementary school in high school? I mean, she’s, the online engagement, everything poster poster will do you good. Everything she could possibly get involved with. She was involved with her mother, and i tried to give her every opportunity to try every sport, every activity you wanted, you know, you know, as parents, we tried to do that for her can. My god, you’re a good example of amy. I tell this story. He probably doesn’t remember it. But in the second grade, i said anything. You got your homework done? Well, yes. He had two next day’s homework done the whole weeks on. John had read three chapters ahead. It was the last time we ever ask her if she had her homework done. Never had to worry about amy school or anything. Okay. And always self directed, always always getting right with it. And and i feel like he is right now. I know and engaged also always engaged with the public. Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. How did we know that she’d end up a consultant and someone that people look to for advice about online engagement? Did you see this coming? I thought he’d be president united states by now myself? No, no pressure. Thanks, dad, but i didn’t want to go into politics. I amy always had a sense of what was right and wrong, you know, always interacting with other children. You know, she always knew what was right or wrong. She never made bad decisions that i can see. And if she did, she so well, i hit way didn’t know about it. All right, we’re back, but, uh, she has a sphere of alligators. Is that is that you’re doing? Is that is that you’re doing, she has a fear of alligators. Is that you’re doing fear of alligators. You’re not aware of this? Well, we don’t have many alligators over here where we live in oregon, oregon in oregon, oregon. No, i know. I never knew he had any fears at all. It was an example after a trip to florida. And tony will let me live it down if it comes up to you. Okay. Yeah, i have a fear of snakes. Oh, i don’t think i pass that on to her. I don’t know if alligators are reptiles like snakes are alligators may or may not be reptiles. Maybe maybe look together. Alright. Alright. We’re gonna let you go back to work, tim. All right, perfect. Thank you very much for calling the opportunity. We thank you that we don’t know if your daughter by tim sample. Okay. Goodbye. All right. I want to have some fun. Do that that’s fair. Okay. This’s. Tony martignetti non-profit radio. You are in charge of the shop. Future president. I know i the bar’s pretty high now. Yeah, i in fact, when alison find was here last week, i asked her if she thought that a presidential candidate could emerge outside the two major parties from online on. And she felt that it could eventually, but that we would see local, local lance’s first mayor’s maybe governors or senators, you know, but more local than presidential right away. But i was i had you in mind. I had your president cha operations. I don’t i want to. You know, there’s. Another election coming up it’s true only only only few years it’s. Really? Not all that far away. So exactly. Okay, but she felt it was possible. Do you think it’s possible for a for their previous president there emerges online. Yeah, especially. I think around someone from a grassroots campaigning background not political, necessarily, but someone that’s that’s already actively working online to bring people together for other social issues or other co kinds of campaigns. So so someone who’s in it in that way, i think, could easily cross over to say great. Well, now i want to run for for an elected position versus i’m just going to be the organizer that keeps this. Keeps this movement going. Okay. You have anybody in mind? Apparently i need to put myself in the street don’t talk about other candidate. Exactly. Were we stupid? All right, i will go on the record. What’s up today, never mentioning another candidate. All right, um, let’s oh, there was one more thing. I want to point out that matching gif ts is another possible, maybe another another possible testing. So oh, exactly the existence of or how big a match might be, right? Especially, you know, something to think about with phrasing of matching gifts is there’s the version of, you know, if we get to this number, we get that same total matched or every ten dollars gets matched. So then people think, well, my ten dollars isn’t going to mean much to this really big pot. We have to get two of twenty thousand, but if instead you say the matches, you know, dollar for dollar, whatever you khun give, how does that affect your community? Because some communities may really get behind the idea of, like, having to get to that really big number together and other communities want to feel like they’re five dollars, was still matched and still meant ten dollars, for the organization. So think about the way you use the match in your campaign, and several weeks ago, we had a university professor on from university of chicago. John list talked about scientific research around matching gift does. Does a three to one match necessarily pulled more than a one to one match, right and where and on dh, also, in the phraseology of the match, what you’re describing and that will show was on february eighth of this year. If you want to hear discussion about the scientific research specifically around matching gift excellent, we’re going. T take more of a break, another break, and when we come back, we’ll talk more about who gets involved in the campaign, some budgeting, maybe some calendar ring and things like that, and also tony’s take, too, of course, comes before all that. Stay with me. Good evening, dick, dick, tooting, getting dick, dick, dick, dick, you’re listening to the talking alternative network waiting to get in. Nothing. Good. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m ostomel role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re going invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. Dafs you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll lively conversation. Top trends and sound advice. That’s. Tony martignetti non-profit radio. And i’m janna agger’s, senior vice president, products and marketing from blackbaud. Durney welcome back, live live listener love for berlin, germany joined us good noggin on dh time now for tony’s take to my block this week is keep your marketing simple i’m going to try to adhere to that right now concise, informative, jargon free, i think it’s not easy to do, but i do think it’s worth striving for it just makes your communications so much simpler on the receiving end, whatever, whichever way’s you’re communicating, achieve least shoot for simplicity. My blog’s is that tony martignetti dot com, and that is tony’s take two for friday, the twenty sixth ono were who wrote this friday, the nineteenth of april, and that is the sixteenth show of the year. Amy who’s, who should be involved in this work and how are we going toe? I estimate the time that’s going to be involved in our online campaign? Sure, i think fund-raising campaigns just like any other campaigns organization, maybe running advocacy list building, you know, community engagement, etcetera can’t be thought of as something that’s completely contained within the fund-raising department, because ultimately there are e mails and there’s this a b testing on the website and all of those other components require all different staff from different departments, so it’s an opportunity to to create, i think, processes we suggest in the book where you will have regular opportunities for staff across departments, not necessarily like on all staff meeting, but staff across departments that are ultimately all creating the success of that campaign to come together, whether that’s like every week or however your organization wants to do it, to have a meeting where you’re all in the room at the same time, or all on video chat or whatever you want to do so that everyone’s talking about it. So as soon as you break that campaign down into the people that are in charge of the email never talked to the people that were in charge of actually counting how many people are coming through the form, then you’ve already said, well, we’re not even going to have the best conversation we can have with this campaign staff aren’t talking to each other, so creative process first, so that everyone involved is coming together regularly to talk about kosh. We saw that this button language was the best. Well, the email better have that same button. Language, you know, any maybe testing that you’re doing anything you’re learning about what’s working with the campaign should then be immediately reflected in all the other components. So how you either evaluate ahead of time staff time or recognize all those different pieces are maybe serving the rest of the organization. So thinking of of people in communications is not just communications staff that all they do is communicate, but they also served fund-raising and they also serve advocacy, and they also served programs. So what does that mean as far as your staff plan? And what does that mean for your value evaluation of staff? You know, those communications staff in this example couldn’t just say, well, my job is to send e mail and i sent them, but how, you know, how was your function in this organization, reflective of our success in our fundraising campaign were reflective of the success in our advocacy campaign so that it’s showing that that person isn’t just responsible for hitting send on thousands of emails but showing them even in their own evaluation, that they’re part of the whole organization success, which i think is critical for having all of you dafs buy-in toe working towards your mission. You know as soon as you say, well, your job is just the website. What their job is the web site because it’s serving the mission of helping people understand you know what your your cause is all about and so did did they lead the baby testing that help figure out that that button actually could have, you know, in increased by fifteen percent the donations that’s huge that’s, not just the fund-raising team that’s also that person who’s managing the website. What about the smaller shop? Just a two or three person arts group? I mean, how are we gonna build even ah, modest campaign into what we’re trying to. We’re struggling to keep get getting done day in, day out, right? I think, for smaller organizations, but really, the same lesson applies to everyone. Ah lot of of the components of the campaign are actually developed way in advanced. If you’re collecting stories actively as you are working with your community year and you’re keeping those stories not just on a piece of paper in your desk, but, you know, kind of like a story bank you have you have ah, bank. You could draw from of all these different stories then in that moment when you need to create a campaign, maybe it’s a response of campaign because some horrible event has happened and you want to make sure people are aware of your services. You know, for example, you have that content. You don’t have to then spend a week developing. Okay, who’s, who from our community do we want to talk to? You know, where could we get a story about our services in action? You’ve already created that content in advance. So especially when you only have two people, the more you can do to just kind of be librarians, you know, tio, cart, chronicle and archive all that you have all the time so that you can really easily just say that’s, you know the book i want that’s the story i want off that shelf and let’s put it into this email. And then again, a be testing is so, i think, critical for really small shops, because if you really can just say we’re going to send this e mail to one hundred people each and then know that the one that got more opens is what we’re going to send, even though it took you maybe an extra five minutes to go back and say, okay, now, send this list. That was a really great five minutes, because it means you’re getting that many more people opening that message let’s, look it. Ah, um, budgeting our campaign may involve some adwords. Facebook, facebook, yeah, how are we going toe? How do we figure out what what we should be spending money on is beyond the time. That also is an indirect, indirect cost, right? First, obviously, you know, you have to have the caveat of it all depends what’s your campaign about where is your community? Ah lot of people have have realized that you’re not necessarily just going to make all of your money from your fund-raising campaign on facebook, but a lot of those people that are participating as donors, maybe on your facebook page. So thinking about how you budget for promotion of the campaign versus budget, for the call to action, you know, you may want to just invest in having ads showing the efficacy of your work so that when people are then emailed a call to donate, they’re like, oh, yeah, you guys do really great stuff. I do want to donate via email because that’s, my, you know, i’ll just click don’t and go to your website, but maybe it’s different for your organ community. Maybe your community doesn’t really know, and they just need to be told, like there was a disaster and donate, you know, it depends a lot in the circumstances, i think it’s also, especially with things like facebook, where they’re changing the algorithm like every five hours you have to do so. May be testing, you have to invest in that a be testing. So you know which of these ads are working better? Do we do promoted posts, or do we do ads? So some of it is just having a reserve of that advertising budget to test with and you don’t have to spend a lot of money, you know, like facebook ads or not expensive, right? For probably fifty dollars or so you could oh, exactly, you attest? Oh, for sure, yeah, and the problem or the great opportunity that could become a new obstacle for organizations, is that when you get in there to do a facebook at our, you know, promoted post, you’re you’re presented with the opportunity to pick like which gender location, background so many details that it can either be overwhelming and you just say, well, i just want to go to everyone, and then you’re going to run out of that fifty dollars budget instantly, you know, or you get so narrow and who you want this ad to go, too, but it never really goes to anyone, so i think there’s a little bit of opportunity, teo play even just with that. That scale of who do you really want to promote this to? Who is your donor and what do you know about them? Which goes back to what we talked about months ago, about how, you know, investing and knowing who your community is first, so that you can say the right things on the right channels, and i appreciate that your advice always is. What are the goals of the campaign right now, and not only to raise the money that that? Well, actually, the campaign may not be about even about money, but may not only be the explicit purpose of the campaign, but also to grow engagement in the long term, bring some new people to the cause may not even buy-in respond to your call to action, but now they’ve joined your community exactly, exactly, and for them this you know, your campaign that maybe their friend donated to was the first time they had heard aboutyou, but they’re now hearing about you in a really trusted way, because they heard that a friend not only supported your work but gave money to your work, and now they just wanted follow along, and eventually you can. You know, encourage them up that ladder of engagement to become a donor as well. And in that respect, not everything in your campaign has to be about the call to action, right? I mean, i know i guess you want the called action to be frequent, but there can be things that are informative beyond the call to action. Exactly. I think a lot of organizations were shook about a fundraising campaign, i think. Okay, first and foremost, they are donating to this campaign. They’re going to donate to this campaign. They really get that out there, and then people donate and then there’s nothing else, you know. So people feel like, well, i did the thing, but there has to be more aiken dio so recognizing that there is always more they khun dio having that thank you, paige pushed them to the very next step. What’s, the next step for you is that great. Thanks for donating here’s the button to share on facebook that you just donated, you know, or is the email confirmation encouraging them to share their story about why they donated so that now you have one more story and your story bank? You know, so think about what people can do to still feel like they’re contributing to this forward motion because they already donated, which is huge, so don’t take someone who’s willing to take a really big action and then just dropped them off, keep them, you know, sustained that engagement and keep them engaged so that you can ask them to donate again, you know, if they haven’t heard from you, and now you’re asking again for them to donate, will they feel like don’t you remember that i already donated? But if you’ve said, you know, hey, share this on facebook? Hey, give us your story, etcetera, and then you say thank you for donating. Please help some more. They feel like yes, of course we are trying to get there together. What is ah, home page hijack for-profit it’s called many things, but basically i’m sure most people have experiences when you go to a website and you just, you know, landed on the website haven’t clicked on anything, and then something pops up. Even the new york times does this you you think you’re going to go? Read an article from the new york times that your friend just tweeted that and there’s a thing that pops up that says, don’t you want to pay for new york times content? Why don’t you subscribe? That’s that’s ah, home page pre-tax, for example, it’s basically a light box that pops up and says, whatever you thought you were here to read. This is what we want you to read and it’s great for people that if they really are just hitting your home page because maybe they were, you know, searching online for something and came to your website, they don’t know or you have directed people back to website, and it can pop up and say, this is what’s happening here is the called action here’s, that big red button that says support haiti or whatever, and obviously they could close out of the box or lorts like autumn, it etcetera, but the fact that it makes it super front and center left, literally front and center on the website helps direct that traffic into the call to action where you could maybe instead of them seeing your home page that’s, you know, normally fairly generic has lots of navigation, et cetera and drives them to a page that’s just about the campaign, you know, really focused. They can see the donate form they khun see whatever helps funnel people just to the campaign instead of accidentally clicking unlike, oh, what is this organization about? And what do you do and what’s? This other thing? I see a photo of, you know, it just helps funnel people in where you want them to go. You have advice about how frequently someone may see that home page hijack, so maybe it shouldn’t be more than once a week person and the technology will support that our exam twice a week per person or whatever you think exactly, yeah, i mean, it’ll where people out if every time they go to any page of your website, they’re getting this pop up essentially, you know, but if you can say yeah, once a week or the first time someone comes to the website because maybe outside of a fundraising campaign, you could use that for many things you could have it say, join our email list, you know, subscribe to our news, whatever you want that pop up to be so if you see that every time well, gosh i signed up a week ago, and i’m seeing it every day, you know, so just may be the first time that i p address hits the web site, you know? We’re going to take a break in about a minute. We want to have some print possibly to be in support of our campaign. I want to just open that topical bit. We’ll talk more about it shortly. Sure, i think print is actually a great medium, especially for fund-raising still one of the main drivers of fund-raising effort so looking again at that piece as a way to frame all of the content that’s going to come later because you’re going to be ableto change up at the very last minute, what you tweet and what you put in an e mail, etcetera. But if that print piece supports that overall called to action, the overall message and maybe has just won fairly general story that you can then really dig into that story of what that person’s you know, experience was or what those services mean to the community. It’s a great way to frame things as a oh, yeah, i remember this, you know, every time. They didn’t get an e mail from you. Alright, we’ll talk more about this and the fund-raising plan in general. When we return with amy, sample ward. Stay with us. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping hunters. People be better business people. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Dahna hi there again and welcome back. Uh, anything more than you want to say about print in support of this, i would i would add that prince should certainly be needs to be in this fund-raising calendar with a campaign calendar that we talked about last month and it’s something that we’ve talked about in the past, i forget what episode number, but we talked about competition and how teo, you know, if if you were doing a phone bank, for example, of donations and you and you mentioned the research shows, at least if you were to mention, you know, the previous collar don’t thisyou know people are more inclined to say, well, i’m going to do that if someone else did print is a really easy way to do that as well, because you clearly know where they live, you are mailing something to them. So say, on average, people in your neighborhood donated this last year to our campaign. Oh, my gosh, now they like now i’m going to look in on my neighbor’s like which ones of you donated one hundred dollars? Now i feel guilty, i’m going to donate a hundred dollars, you know? So so keep those same principles that you use online with making it be a riel story, having it connected to something directly when your mission have a very clear call to action. But then take advantage of that local competition that peer pressure of this is this is really, really in your neighborhood. But also this is how people are actually helping us. So you should too. We can also have competition in telemarketing right in our telephone call once just remind i think this may have been last month, but in the way that callers are greeted and encouraged or thanked for their past giving, there could be some competitiveness. Exactly. Exactly. So i’m not just saying like, oh, thanks you want to donate, but also, you know oh, you have reviews caller exactly. The previous collar donated this. And if you can, if you can hear sometimes, you know it’s it’s hard to just make a judgment. But if you could hear that it was a male calling and you could say, oh, well, the man before you donated this if you if you have that opportunity too, to be gender specific, the results or even hyre from studies that say, you know, once i’m told the previous collar was a woman and she don’t even more than me well, man, i want to donate as much as her, so all right, let’s, let’s wrap up our campaign with the thank you’s yes, thank you’s are critical and thank you don’t have to be at the end of the campaign. Thank you should be every time someone’s done something, so when they sign up for that email lists, you know, thank them if they donated, thank them, but also do that thinking in public when you can, you know, you’ll see people in the campaign putting on facebook that they, you know, because they got to the thank you page, the confirmation page, and they tweeted or they posted to facebook that they just donated, well, that’s a great place if the organization is then liking that post you, you know, privacy settings are such that you can see their post or on twitter, the organization is retweeting them to them that’s huge validation the organization noticed that i just tweeted out, you know, that i donated and i’m i got retweeted or i got thanked publicly and that certainly doesn’t take, you know, a lot of effort. You’re not creating any new content. You’re just saying thank you very much. But it can mean a lot publicly for the community to see those individual voices being thanked. How do you feel about the mailing of small small tokens? Oh, yeah, of gratitude. Oh, i think i think a hand written note, even if all it says is, you know, tony, thanks so much for your donation. Amy. It was a hand written note. It had to go through the mail. You know, it means a lot. Exactly. Could be something online, maybe maybe a little gift certificate or a discount to a site or something. Exactly how else can we say the small ways of saying thank you, right? And there are lots of ways where you know it. And ten we can say thank you by saying, you know, to thank you for what you’ve done here is a free webinar, for example, you know, web in our past. But for other organizations, it can also be an opportunity to say, because you donated, you’re now invited to this event that’s only for our donors. You know, so you’re also providing access to something that is otherwise exclusive, and you can use that as a way to say, hey, all of our donors are going to be joining us at this, you know, a local place that everyone knows is really fun or, you know, historic or whatever come join us in this, and it doesn’t have to be, you know, because he’ll be a national campaign, but you could say if you’re a donor, you’ll get the link to the live stream and you get to be there for this interview with our founder or whatever, and even if people don’t want to go it’s still saying, we know tony, you donated, and we want you as part of this conversation, just the act of inviting exact is very, very it is very gracious, exactly in larger organizations that i that i work with, well, often invite people on the other side of the country to a luncheon that we’re hosting in new york city to to say thank you right way don’t expect them to come. We know the observers are tiny that they will, but the act of the invitation what if they were going to be in town for other business where they were going to be in town meeting with someone, and now they can say, oh, while i’m there, i’m also going to go to this luncheon because i donated and that’s really cool, you know, i’ve never asked you this. You’ve been on many times. What is it that you love about the work that you do, this whole body of work that you that you’re involved with? What is it you love? I i love the people like i love that we are in a position to get to support not just one person that we’ve met, you know, and, like, help them do whatever, but we can help hold communities that’s really exciting, you know, or that you can help all of those people in the community know that they’re in a community. I mean, i think that’s the really exciting power of the internet is that people thought i’m the only person that has x y and z here on the only person it’s experienced this, and now they go online like, oh my gosh, i’m not special at all there’s a million people who’ve had this and so part of it is that that feeling of like, i’m not special, but i’m not special because there are so many of these other special people you know, and getting to find them and create community with each other, even when you can’t all be physically in the same room. Her latest book is social change. Anytime everywhere you’ll find amy’s blawg at amy, sample ward, dot or ge once again, a pleasure. Thank you for having me. Be sure and thank him for calling it. I will it’s dad, dad to you? Yes, next week policy versus paper clips a conversation with eugene fram he’s, professor emeritus at rochester institute of technology. Dr fran is author of the book policy versus paper clips introducing non-profits to a corporate model of board governance to cut out the minutia from your agendas so that the board can focus where it should on policy and planning. We’re all over the social web. One example twitter can use the hashtag non-profit radio to talk back after the show. Tell us how we’re doing. You could tell me how we’re doing. I’m at tony martignetti you can follow amy sample ward she’s at amy rs board. We know that the army’s for rene handup, our creative producers, claire meyerhoff, sam liebowitz is our line producer and assistant producer is janice taylor. Shows social media is by regina walton of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Oh, i hope you’ll be with me next week. I’d hate to contract a chronic or acute disease. In the meantime, that’ll be one to two p m eastern on talking alternative broadcasting at talking alternative dot com. Hyre oppcoll are you going to do? You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, waiting to get in. Nothing. Upleaf hi, i’m donna and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at w w w dot double diamond wellness dot com we look forward to serving you. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time. Join me. Larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society politics, business it’s, provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. Very sharp. Your neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s ivory tower radio dot com everytime was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Dahna hyre

133: A Conversation With Amy Sample Ward – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guest this week:

Amy Sample Ward, author of “Social Change Anytime Everywhere,” membership director for Nonprofit Technology Network and our monthly social media contributor.

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Dahna hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host and it’s friday, march sixteenth. Oh, i hope you were with me last week. It would hurt me deeply if it came to my attention that you had missed integrate communications and marketing that’s integrate g r e a t communications and marketing. Diane lansing, president of lansing associates, had ideas for getting your communications and marketing in sync. She wants you to apply analytics so you’ll know what works and what doesn’t in the short and long terms sounds simple, but are you doing it? Diane had advice for getting you started and p r i programme related investments are prospect research contributor and the prospect finder maria simple was with me to explain why foundations don’t only make grants, some offer loans, loan guarantees, equity investments and other pr ise how do you find those foundations? That’s what we talked about last week with maria she also had info on conferences that you’ll want to pay attention to this week. A conversation with amy sample ward, our social media scientists and monthly contributor, has a new co authored book social change any time everywhere how to implement online multi-channel strategies to spark advocacy, raise money and engage your community the book is shorter than its title. We’ll talk about how your non-profit can raise money in fact, find advocates and move the needle on engagement in our any time everywhere world. Amy sample ward is going to be joining us, but she’s not here yet, so we’re going to start with tony’s take two instead of doing that later in the show, and then we go to a break and we’ll hope that amy’s here the time that that break is over. Tony steak to my block this week is number one podcast and two in the top five i want to give many, many thanks to blogger cheryl mccormick she’s, the principal of ascend non-profit consulting, and she named her top five non-profit podcasts and this show to show that you are listening to right this moment was number one, tony martignetti non-profit radio and cheryl, thank you very much for that fund-raising fundamentals, which is my monthly podcast that i host for the chronicle of philanthropy was number three. Cheryl, thank you very much. Again for that on this show number one show, in case i hadn’t mentioned that she likes jargon jail, she likes my jog in jail, and she likes live listener love that i send out, and i like those things too, and i think they are. I think both podcasts are highly rated by blogger cheryl mccormick, but also doing very well outside that because they’re fund-raising to do, um, i just love the opportunity to meet people that i would not have met otherwise and not only meet them, but pick their brains today, it’s going to be amy sample ward for an hour if she ever gets here, but all the other people, all the other guests, you know, i get to talk to them for twenty five, thirty minutes or so. Ah, that is just a riel joy, knowing that you’re learning from them as i’m picking their brains and we’re all learning, we’re both learning. I’m learning as well and as you fund-raising fundamentals, that’s a shorter one that said that’s, a monthly podcast, it’s only ten minutes and it’s devoted to fund-raising, but again picking the brains of experts for the benefit of listeners that is a real pleasure. The fund-raising fundamentals you can hear on the chronicle of philanthropy website and it’s, also on itunes, cheryl’s only negative for the for each of the two podcasts was that there’s not enough of them, she what she wishes i did them more frequently, and that was very gracious of her. Cheryl mccormick. Thank you much very much again. Her company is ascend non-profits and you’ll find cheryl mccormick at ascend non-profits dot com, and she has a very cool logo. The check out the logo for their company, very nicely done, very smart, very clever there’s, more on my blogged at tony martignetti dot com, and that is tony’s take two little extended version for friday, the fifteenth of march, the eleventh show of the year. We’re going to take a break, hoping amy sample ward gets here by the time that’s over on while we take this break, i’ll be putting together some live listener love and thinking about what we’re going to talk about. If amy doesn’t get here in time, stay with me talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you confused about which died it’s, right for you? Are you tired of being tired? How about improving your energy strength and appearance? Hi, i’m ricky keck, holistic nutrition and wellness consultant. If you have answered yes to any of my questions, contact me now at n y integrated health dot com, or it’s, six for six to eight, five, eight five eight eight initiate change and transform your life. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s. The answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com lively conversation, top trends and sound advice. That’s, tony martignetti non-profit radio and i’m janna agger’s, senior vice president, products and marketing from blackbaud oh! Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent i’ve got live listener love forest grove, oregon welcome forest grove you haven’t been here before. Welcome. Lincoln, nebraska, brooklyn, new york and woodside, new york welcome live listener love out to all of you let’s. See in aa. Tokyo, japan. Osaka, japan, and fukuoka, japan. Konichiwa, welcome live love tto live listen to love teo each live listener amy’s not here yet, so we’re going do a little a little preview of her book, a little browse through her book. The first thing that i want to point out is that i wish it had more pictures when i’m when i’m picking books. I i flipped through looking for pictures and i probably would not have bought her book. It didn’t have enough pictures for me. I like pictures like more graphic, so it has graphics and has some screen shots. It’s very good that way, but i would like more. I would like more pictures in amy’s book. Aside from that, any simple word has just joined us. Well, i’m sure you did. All right. Pick moment. Take a moment. Impose yourself if we figured you were in the subway, i was just saying, i wish your book had more pictures. Oh, yeah. Pictures of what? Just it doesn’t really matter. I don’t know. A cute dogs, landscapes, landscapes. Yeah, i just look, i look for pictures as i’m i’m browsing through the book section. The books, it was meant more for reading than browsing, but okay, take another breath. Yes. You knew you knew that we were waiting for you, and yeah, i was going to be fine, but welcome. Thank you. Have you for the full hour? Yeah, exactly. I’m happy to be here for as much of the subway would let me to be our best majority. I did. Tony’s take two in advance. So? So when i’m i’ll have that time together. Congratulations on your book. Thank you. Its code written by allison. Is it keeping kapin kapin much? Tell us about alison she’s, the founder of radcampaign and the tele summit and network women who tech she’s based in d c uh, she’s. Pretty cool. Yeah, i met her because i was at your book launch. Oh, that’s right book launch that you did at the at planned parenthood parenthood federation. Yeah, yeah, that was very good to about forty people. If you got to meet your husband, max? Yes, very nice. Often left alone as your traveling throughout the country. Yes. That’s the that’s the first time he’s ever seen me speak in any capacity in public? Yes. He said that i didn’t talk to him. You know, first time i know. Lovely. Um okay, we’re in. Why do you let’s make this clear? Where? Ok, i need any time everywhere, what’s, what’s our anytime, everywhere world that you are trying to help people make social change in. Well, the anytime everywhere is really focused on the people, not the organization. So all of your constituents, donors, supporters, whatever you want to call them, they are, you know, living their lives basically around the clock, their life. And they are thinking about okay, if i want to talk to this person, i’m going to do it here. Or if i want to talk about this topic, i’m going to do it here. You just interact with your community, however you do as an individual, it might mean a friend calls you and then after you hang up, maybe you go look at facebook and interact with another friend there and then maybe send your mom and email, you know, but you’re not thinking okay, well, i only talked to sam on the phone, and i only talk to my friend barb in email, you know, you as people, we don’t treat our communications and our networks in that way, so organization shouldn’t be saying, ok, well, we only send you emails or we only let you talk about our campaign on facebook. We need to think about the way we communicate and allow our communities to engage with us as as a way that crosses all those channels as well, okay? We’re not segmenting our lives and write our community, our conversations, right? Stilted, like communications are conversations, right? I see somebody on foursquare check in, and i’ll make a snarky comment or something that i have seen one of those geever andi didn’t answer it as i recall, um, in fact, you were recently traveling, you were in south by southwest. I wass that’s ah, what i think of it is just a big music and party and drink fest. Is that what many people think of it that way as well? I’ve never been there at the beauty of being me is that i can know nothing about something and still be an expert in it. Yes, of course. Oh, i think i’m very well acquainted with south by southwest. Even though i’ve never been there. Why don’t you tell us what the rial tell people like me who think that everything that they know nothing about but it’s a very comfortable place to be. Actually i what is south by southwest? Well, it it are very originally was a music festival, but now has three components music interactive, which is really all kinds of technology, not just social media, including gaming and all kinds of interfaces hardware, software, etcetera and film. So film and interactive take place the same week. Concurrently on then the following week is all music. Were you there in your capacity as membership director of non-profit technology network? I waas so there’s a non-profit lounge there lounges of all different types sponsored by different people. So there’s, a blogger lounge meant for bloggers to find each other, etcetera. So the non-profit lounge is sponsored each year by beaconfire ah, long time, you know, and ten member organization sponsor, etcetera, and they opened it up for others to get to be in the space with them so and ten had a presence. We had a couple couches, if you will, and i was also working with them to manage the content each day so that people that were started in the lounge, what kind of concert we had was that we had a different topic each day. So we had one day was focused on measurement and metrics. One day was focused on engaging millennials. One day was focused on technology, staffing and the capacity around technology. Um, there were a couple more, and we so we highlighted little, you know, not not trivia because they’re real. But, you know, just little tidbits from our research each day based on that topic. So you come in the room and learn different things. And then at lunchtime we had panels on that topic so people that we knew were going to be either at south by southwest. Are actually based in austin that we could bring in to talk that day, just with whoever wanted to be there and engage with them. And then night times that was the drink fest in well, for some, i think drinking started as early is, like eleven, because i guess technically it’s noon on the east coast. Yes, yes, all right, anything. Did you learn a couple of one or two little things that that you didn’t know or maybe reinforce something that what was your was your take home from from south by the has to be something? Yeah, i think you know, they’re always different applications or tools that get launched itself myself west. So people, you know, waiting, teo, unveil some new application, and so there was a bit of that as well, but i think this year, the feeling that i got from a lot of the non-profit and social impact crowd at the conference was that people are really starting to get to a place where they feel really proud about some of the things they’ve done in their non-profit and they they wish, you know hey, what? Why don’t we get all the attention? You know, just because that really big organization, you know, that has tons of marketing budget and had tried and tried many things and then succeeded with something, you know, we’re a tiny organization, and we did that to, you know, they want a platform for their voices to but, you know, south by is always kind of mixing up the content and have had different tracks and and things like that over the years. So it’s not to say that there will never be a platform for them. But i think this year, there are a lot of organizations there, you know, looking for a place where they could stand on their soapbox and then get to share with everyone what they’ve worked on. All right and excellent that they got that exactly like to see that small, especially small and midsize shops getting attention. Craig newmark wrote the forward to your book. Craig is the founder of craig craig’s list, of course. And quick connect. He’s. Been our guest on the show twice. I think that was a trivia question once. How many times you been on the show? Oh, did we do that? Oh, i think we did i think for a giveaway and weigh just you were my guest for the hundredth show and we’re giving away? Yes, but the answer’s two way long ago gave away a lot of intense swag for us to give away. Yes, and he says in the forward that social media and good customer service or big deals you think we were going, you and i talk every month about social media, we know that that’s a big deal goodcompany mers service what? Why? Why is he talking about that with respect to the social engagement social change? Well, i think it doesn’t matter if you’re for-profit aura non-profit if you do true direct service or not, ah lot of the most basic day to day interactions that you could be having with your community take the form of customer service, even if you know, in a non-profit we normally don’t call them, but answering people’s questions or just being able to be present on social media, where you see people asking a question, even if it’s not about you being the organization that can answer the question for them and really playing a service role builds community in such a small kind of passive way, but that israel and you’re creating value with them, that it is a matter you know, if you are comcast and you want to use twitter to answer customer service questions or, you know you’re the humane society and you want to use twitter to make sure people know how to get help with their animals and and, you know, i like your just broad definition of what’s customer service. I mean, it may just be interacting on a day to day, right? You may not think of it as a service to the customer just having, you know, we’re just engaged in a conversation there on the engagement ladder and what exactly were just, you know, talking to them right, exactly and helping helping your supporters take advantage of all that they could do with you is customer service, you know, someone calling and saying, i want to volunteer, but i don’t know how and you pointing them in the direct in the right direction that is still a customer service function in your organization. We’ve got some live listener love we’re talking about texas austin, texas, where itself by was but we have san antonio on the line, santa or on the web? You know antonio, texas live listeners love welcome, welcome to the show and the conversation let’s, talk, talk a fair amount, i think about fund-raising and then how will we even, you know, engagement and advocacy get, you know, getting talking toa advocates and motivating advocates, and you spent some time talking about the different motivations to give why white people are giving on dh there certainly have been articles and books on this right by the the traditional, i guess fund-raising prose that are out there, you you spent a little time with emotions, emotions versus statistics, right? What would you like to say there? Well, obviously, we are humans, we are driven by emotion. Um, and i think that a lot of online tools facilitate that really well, you know, how many times have we seen a tweet or gotten an email where they say, you know, this many million people in this country are dealing with this issue and it’s like, okay, well, i don’t actually know a billion people, so i can’t conceptualize that very well, you know, but having a story that directly connects with you and is someone that’s already been served by that organization helps you understand the kind of person that is may be dealing with that issue and the way that the organization helps them because that’s really what we need thio conceive as the person who’s going to take action. Isn’t that what does it really mean for a billion people to be dealing with this issue? But what does it look like to help a person with dealing with that issue? If i can conceptualize what changing the fate is, then i can understand how i can help it and be a part of it. But if it’s just the raw data, it’s really hard to see what the action is in that, and social media really helps with storytelling because you can have, you know, people interacting people sharing their own story in response to that story, it really facilitates that, but the other part of emotion is our natural competitiveness and, you know, not really wanting to say, oh, yeah, my friend karen gave a lot more to that organization that i did. Who says that? Who says, oh, i gave the least of my friends. You know, and and tapping into that natural competitiveness, you know, using peer pressure for good is actually very successful. One of the research reports that we sight in the book was in pledges, so so, like a pledge drive over the phone, but still you could do this on social media, but when the collar you know, talking to the donor said that the previous caller had given more than they were about to pledge they then up to their pledge, and they upped it even more when the color sad. Oh, actually, the woman before you, if it was a woman collar and once they knew it was the same gender is them. They gave even more so just by presenting the opportunity to be outdone by someone else, people wanted to beat them. We’re going to talk that’s, outstanding. We had a guest i had guessed professor gen shang from the university of indiana, and she had done research with this was telephone based also with public radio and bloomington, indiana. When when? When certain whether she had five key words and when they were used to thank the person you’re or to describe the person as as a donor, so you’re very kind of you to give or it’s very compassionate of you to give that it increased the the donations right for that call. And actually i think that we’re doing it. I’m being a little inarticulate, but where they were doing it was i want to thank you for your kind donations in the past or your compassionate or your thoughtful donations in the past, and we hope that you’ll you’ll help us today. Yeah, those using there were five different adjective she had and they could trigger they would trigger hyre giving than someone who who was just thanked. Thank you for your past giving, right. So this is this is really interesting when it’s gender and when there’s a comparison to the previous calling out, how were they, you know, like with the language they were using? Because you don’t be snarky about, right? Right? Do you remember? I know they were introducing that it’s now the top of my head, it was something like, you know, similar like, thanks so much for your desire to give the woman before you donated fifty how much would you like to donate? So you’re just kind of using it as a context setting statement and then giving them the chance to say like, well, darn it, i’m given sixty five, you know? Yeah, excellent. Okay, um going back to your point about big numbers versus a face, i found a quote, i’m going to quote mother teresa, i found a quote that that’s pertinent to this, i think she said, never worry about numbers, help one person at a time and always start with the person nearest you social media can make a story come alive, it could be a person near you, it could be pictures on instagram. It could be video youtube video on your blogged you can you can put a face to the the homelessness or the hunger that affects a billion people right, and show people how their gift will will impact that that story right? And i like the part of the quote that says start with the person nearest to because that’s too, what we’ve talked about many times in the show don’t go out there and try and find these new people. You already have a community of people that you work with, that you’ve served. Start with their stories and then other people will come out of the woodwork. You know that identify with that story or that have also been served, but maybe i hadn’t talked to you before, so start with the stories you already have and just show them out to the to the rest of the community. Ok, so some peer pressure, yes, about suffering a little point about about suffering can be a valuable, motivated give yeah, it’s kind of a weird nuance on competition. It’s it’s part of why things like walkathon tze and challenges of you know, if i if someone donates five thousand dollars, i’ll shave my head because we actually really liketo watch each other have to deal with something that we don’t have to deal with. And so it’s it’s part of why we can say great, you know, if you pledge, i’ll have to run this many miles. Terrific. I would like to see my friend have to run that many miles yeah, and again, doing that in a place where all those people, you know, in a like a thon process where all those people are competing for donations gives you both layers. Of the captain’s competing against each other for the most pledges, but then also all of their friends saying, oh, yeah, i want my friend to have tto shave his head back in the dark days before, before i knew you as well as i do, those were the dark days they were well, they were more your doctor darker for you if you’re going there were darker for you before you knew me then and then before i knew you, um, i was used to now, so you’ve even like you, really? You haven’t liked me because i used to pay more attention to vanity metrics, then you and i have talked about vanity tricks, and i’m going to give the quintessential example of it in a second. I pay less attention to those things now more involved in the more thinking about the engagement, and i was paying at that time very close attention to the number of facebook like likes, likes of the show’s facebook page, and this was a couple of years ago, and i wanted to get to three hundred and i don’t remember where we started, right? But i with some high school friends. Of mine, who were willing tto co chair the campaign. I issued the blue pedicure challenge and i said that i would get a blue pedicure if friends from anywhere but the two friends from high school with cochair radcampaign if we would get to three hundred lakes and of course we did get the three hundred likes within a certain time is like two weeks or so. We’ve got three hundred and and i went across the street from the studio here there’s this clip on the second floor there’s a salon and i got a blue pedicure and i had video it’s sons on the youtube channel. It was great fun. Yeah, and people said, you know, a soon as we got the three hundred are weighted the blue pedicure. Yeah, it’s tony gonna make good on the way we want to see the photo so i had video of me making my appointment, which was won. And then i picked my color. Nice. Different shades of blue, of course. Of course. I picked my blue color. And then i went back a week later for my appointment, and i upgraded to the powerful max. Also i got the paraphernalia. I don’t even know what that means, but well, they put your feet in warm wax. Oh, interesting wax. Okay, yeah, i don’t know what i’m supposed to soften. I think too interesting. That was my first and last boedecker left so many questions now, so well, they’re all answered on the video there i’ll go to the video i block i met blogged it too. I know it’s on the but certainly it’s on youtube blue pedicure challenge you took a multi-channel approach to this pedicure experience. I did that’s true because we campaign was in multi-channel and then the impact in the outcome were were probably blawg and certainly facebook and youtube e did take multi-channel provoc any other and plenty of engagement. Lots of engagement it was great fun. Yeah, it was good. So pie in the face you use the pie in the face example in the back. There’s. A picture of someone one of the few pictures in the book has someone getting those lots of graphs and good pictures. Has someone getting a pie in the face and there’s a picture of alison’s dog in the book leah leah lida lida lida. Like peter, with a now. Okay, why is why is there dog picture? Because they adopted her. And so there’s ah, case study in there about an adoption campaign. Okay, so there you go, there’s a picture and it’s a cute i didn’t say there were no pictures. I said it’s not enough to suit me. We’re coming out in the fall with color book edition, a graphic novel way have just about a minute before break let’s talk about the last area of motivation sharing impact you and i talked about this before, but let’s just remind listeners how important that is. Yeah, and it doesn’t have to be, you know, i think a lot of organizations, when they think sharing impact, they think, okay, well, you know where the campaign’s over will send an email that says, we got all of the money and now we’re going to do the thing. There we go, that’s the report, but but there’s versions of sharing impact that are kind of like evergreen content, you know, the putting, putting some of your expenditures or big, successful things in the footer of your email. So anytime someone goes in the photo of your website. Anytime someone goes your website, they see this is how much money is being devoted two programs, and this is what those programs have created, or whatever. There’s also reached the research that shows on donation forms, where you actually show the impact of the money, people donate more so, again, just just keeping it really clear, clear and present all the time as an opportunity, right? Wait, go away for a couple minutes, and when we come back, of course, amy stays with me, and i hope that you do, too. Co-branding think dick tooting getting ding, ding, ding, ding. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, get him. E-giving good. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m ostomel role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re going invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Welcome back big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent there’s a bunch of you on facebook, there’s a bunch of you on twitter and join the conversation with those already there on twitter, use the hashtag non-profit radio thanks for joining us multi-channel let’s see what you bring in-kind caroline, caroline, caroline xero eyes are san antonio is that i believe shut up, san antonio. Um okay, so we’re all about multi-channel we should have a plan for our multi-channel now engagement strategy turns out we are too, right? Yeah, you want to have goals? You and i have talked about some of this before, but right, putting it all together now and you’ve put it together in a book. So it’s ah it’s worth it’s worth revisiting the stop? Yes, because they are important. R r multi-channel plan goals. But how are we going to figure out where we want to be? Well, especially for fund-raising you know, goals have to be really specific. It’s hard to say we’re going to do this year and campaign because we would like to raise some money and you know where we’re soup kitchen, we do things that are important. Although important, not compelling has a goal for your staff to even create a campaign out of, but also for your donors to want to support. But if you can say if we raise this much money, it will actually give us this many meals in this much time, you know, three hundred meals over the course of the month. If we can raise this much money, people then can imagine both you know what their actual, like hundred dollar donation means as faras how much is served, but it also sets you up to do more than your asking, you know, if you say we’re we’re shooting for ten thousand dollars and that gives us three hundred meals for the month of january as soon as you get close to the goal. It’s really easy to say terrific. Now, if we get ten thousand more, we can feed everyone for february two instead of those campaigns that you see where they’ve done a really great job, they’ve activated their community, and once it starts, they actually start raising a lot of money and then they get to the end and they think terrific close down shop, you know, the thermometer reached the top instead, you’re setting yourself up to go is much, you know, raise as much as you can in the time that you’re planning to run the campaign and you also set yourself up. If in case you don’t reach your number, you’re still able to report back in a successful way of saying, you know, we had high hopes of raising ten thousand and we didn’t get there, but we’re still have enough to do two hundred bills this month, and this is how you could help us, you know, after the holidays to serve those last hundred or whatever. So giving yourself a really clear goal lets you iterated kind of as the campaign goes and respond to how it how it’s doing important, do you think tio, have a time limit to your your fund-raising goal? Definitely ah lot, whether you have one week or a one month or however long that the time is, you’re going to see an initial tick and then a big drop in the valley and then as it gets closer, you know, everyone starts donating again, so it doesn’t really i mean, technically, it matters you don’t want to say this is a yearlong donation campaign, but whatever the duration, is it’s really clear or it’s really important to be clear about when the end date is so that people know ok? It’s coming, oh, my gosh, i better donate now and and they actually respond to that e mail instead of just saying, oh, well, i could do it next time i remember or next time i have my wallet. In-kind now we’re gonna have to figure out how to message message just campaign, so that should be a part of our our plan also, exactly, and a lot of organizations, you know, when when starting to think about a campaign fund-raising or otherwise get really excited in that staff meeting when you start brainstorming like the catchphrase of the campaign, you know, and that can be fun and enjoyable, but very rarely are the witty catchphrase is actually the things that include the action and the ask, so don’t spend too much time thinking of like balloons for ur or whatever like crazy thing that maybe is related to the campaign is because you want to make sure whatever very simple phrasing you use and then build your campaign off of includes the aschen, the action so what, you know, give or do this thing for, you know, this many meals in this time? And then once you have that core message, ain you khun start planning out of communications calendar that’s reflective of all those channels you want to use remembering, of course, offline or direct mail and not just e mail, etcetera. The other part about messaging that i see organizations forget about is is they concentrate on how they’re going to launch the campaign, and their communications calendar will say, you know, here’s, the first email that goes out and here’s, how we’re going to decorate our facebook page and rebranded there’s no date in that planet’s launch plan and then exactly exactly for exaggeration plan. Sometimes organizations say, well, you know, we want to be responsive, we want a wait and see how it goes. Well, that’s totally fine, but you could still say our plan is to send a second email day three of the campaign, and we’ll be able to say what you contribute exactly. You need to have planned out when you’re going to message so that you can say great if day three, we’re going to send it on update email let’s, make sure later that afternoon facebook has an update as well, and not just another you know, status report or something, so it helps you maintain a good flow across your channel so it’s not always responsive and you’re you know, twitter isn’t just thanks, thanks, thanks, but also has things to share out, you know, that match your other communications you meant now you mentioned offline also. So this is that we’re not just talking about online social social networks, but the offline strategies should be coordinated, if that’s the way that you’re right, typically engaging with people right? And some organizations may plan an offline launch event the day that the campaign is launching. So of course, you know there’s a lot to do there, but it’s also a good reminder to to capture content from that launch event that you can use throughout the campaign. If you have a bunch of people in one place, make sure summer your staff have their phones or flip cameras or something to take some videos, and then you have maybe half a dozen videos you can use during the course of the campaign that again, just bring up on individual story, give you some divers content, etcetera, you know, whatever kinds of content you could pull from that live event but it’s also a good reminder that many organizations, even while running a campaign, have other work that you’re doing. And so maybe you have a press event about some of your other work use that as an opportunity. Once the press component of that piece is over, you know you’re done talking about that policy change, you have a room full of people, then say, great, you know, this is all done i had now want to talk to you about this campaign we’re running, and we’re on day five and it’s going really well and here’s the story take advantage of all those offline opportunities to engage people kayman sample ward is a cz membership director of and ten, which you’ll find it, and ten dot or ge and the book that we’re talking about whether that she co authored is social change anytime. Everywhere you khun follow amy on twitter she’s at amy r s ward at which we know stands for rene the artist for rene and her block is amy sample ward, dot or ge? Get some more live listener love madison, wisconsin, tustin, california. Salem, oregon welcome, salem. Welcome you’re in. So you were in salem several months ago. You were in somewhere in oregon. Weren’t portland, portland not very far away. Okay, italy, we don’t know what city in italy we just have a vague reference to italy. Buy-in giorno, chou. Welcome live listener love also tio sudbury in ontario, canada. And barnaby burnaby. Pardon me, burnaby in british columbia, canada two provinces welcome canada he’s offline strategies. Amy um, could also be so for aside from events direct mail if you usually using that channel telephone. Yeah, right. This these could all be coordinated in your three day or one week or one month campaign. Yeah, especially if you have stories that you know you’re going to use ahead of time in your campaign. You know, things that you’ve collected in the past, because if you khun send a direct mail piece, especially just something simple, like, ah, postcard or, you know, an invitation to participate in the campaign that is from that person or telling that person story has their photo, and then, two days later, you can send them an email that says, great. Now, the campaign’s open, and it has that same story. People then can say, yes, i know that story. I ready to kim. You know, i’m ready to join or actually remember that they’ve signed up with your organization at all, and that they should be engaging in this campaign. And that direct mail piece wasn’t a like a mistake in their mailbox in their apartment building. What do we know about how donors give across multi-channel versus more traditional the off, strictly off line? Well, that data is changing every year is we actually get more and more data at all have more people that we can ask survey, etcetera and and organizations are also becoming more sophisticated with being able to track there donors with they came from online or not, and then just able to report that data so it’s getting more it’s getting clearer every year, but really, we know that people that are online aren’t just saying because i found you online, i want to give to online or because i found you offline. I want to give to offline there’s actually a lot of back and forth that happens. And for most people, even if they are millennials, where people think for some reason, you know, young people only ever look at facebook even if they found you on social media, they still come to your website tto learn about your work and figure out if they want to donate to you so that relationship, maybe on facebook, that relationship may be off line at events they attend, but they still want to go to your website where they can kind of take control of what they’re looking at on your website and learn about your work? So it’s still really important that you have information on your website, but also that you provide that donation? Ask an opportunity button, what have you on your website so that once they go there and learn about you, they could take that action? We also know that activists are seven times more likely to be donors, so we can’t treat people like, well, this is my activist list in this database and over here is my donor list because those activists are totally primed to now give you money, they just put their name on a bunch of work for you, they might as well, you know, give you ten dollars, so it isn’t just about allowing them to come to you wherever you are, but also making sure you’re giving everyone the opportunity teo to engage in donation or fund-raising asks excellent keeping with our multi-channel a c said you could join us on twitter using hashtag non-profit radio there’s some folks on the facebook page and we have a phone call. We have tim. Tim, welcome to the show. Oh, thank you very much. Hi, dad. Ah, that’s. Adorable. Dad called yes. That’s to sweden. Where you where you calling from? Amy sample wards. Dad. Well, i work important oregon, but amy was raised, and we live out in the country outside of portland. Okay. And, uh, of course, her mother knew first and called me and said, oh, my god, going to computer your daughter’s on the radio. I just had to get on here listen and tell everybody i see how proud i am with us. Oh, thank you, dad. I love you. Now i hope you’re gonna listen. Other shows to tim, you know. Oh, i will now want you to be a regular water in there. Yeah. Do you have? Do you have a question? You really want to ask amy? Yeah. When’s. He coming home. This’s too sweet. I love this. I’ll see you on saturday. You will at a girl. All right. Find adal. Proud of you, amy. Thank you, dad. Nice to meet you to let me on it’s. A pleasure to meet you, tim. If you want to, if you want to ask. A question of amy. You can call eight seven seven for eight xero for one, two, zero, eight, seven, seven for eight xero for one to zero. Or you can also treat us. We’re monitoring the hashtag and the facebook page. That’s. A very nice way of saying you’re stalking social media in case people ask questions. Here in the studio, i’m busy talking now, theo control. We want to engage people in our messages, whether they’re online offline and you talk about the hooks we have just a little we have a minute before a break, what just once you just tease the idea of of the hook a little bit? Sure, i mean, different people have different ideas of messaging hooks and what you can do, but i think for people really thinking about multi-channel campaigns, the important idea of a hook is that that’s, the consistent piece you’re going to throw in so that whether you’re maybe sharing a photo and a story of someone on facebook that day or you’re sharing a big infographic about, you know, all this work that’s going into the campaign or maybe it’s just tweets about simple actions people can take you use a consistent hooked to bring them back into the campaign. So when isn’t just like this photo or share this info graf or, you know, retweet this step, but there’s an additional hook that always connects it backto larger campaign so people don’t think, oh, the campaign must be over, and now they’re just sharing info graphics. But but that there’s always some peace hooking. It all together, so it, you know, you want to break the campaign and into individual stories, individual images and smaller actions, but they have to be connected. Otherwise, people don’t get why am i doing this today? And i did this other thing yesterday. We’re going to go away for a couple minutes when we come back, amy, and i’ll keep talking about your your multi-channel plan and what should be in it, including the goals and the messages in the hook that we’re talking about. Stay with me. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Duitz are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping hunters. People be better business people. Dahna have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Durney welcome back. I’ve got more live. Listen, love asia so well represented in john china sold. I’m sorry. Inchon, korea in john career where the airport is. Everybody knows that on john korea. Seoul, korea. Welcome, manu haserot. If you shout china, shanghai, china taipei, taiwan ni hao. Amy, did you know all these languages? No, i have been to korea, but i don’t remember much more than hello. Were you at the airport in inchon? No, you don’t know. You went to the floor. Different airport. I flew into seoul and then hopped over. Teo, you know we’re other places. Okay, um, the these these little hooks you you have some ideas about matches the hook in as part of your your message plan might be that you have a campaign match which could be which could be motivating to people to give. I thought you meant matches like to ignite striking matches. Right, that’s. Why? I could see the look on your face. Keep talking until you come back till it’s. In my reality, we need to show some reality. Um, yes, matches are a great way. As you know, in a fund-raising like retirement today campaign especially. When you know that money is already guaranteed, you don’t necessarily have to just recruit a matching sponsor, you could say, well, the sponsors giving us ten thousand dollars anyway, let’s give this sponsor more visibility, give them more value as a sponsor, but also leverage that to get more individual donations. So saying, you know, this sponsor is goingto give for every one of your dollars, and we want to get up to ten thousand just like, you know, they will match more to say, you know, every time you do this action, they will donate so that way you can, you know, maybe you don’t necessarily have a fundraising campaign that’s pure fund-raising but you want people thio maybe donate, you have this sponsor that’s going to donate the bulk of the funds, but you really want to get some behavior change in your community. So the diabetes hands foundation did a great campaign. We’re actually fall diabetes hands, foundation spend, you know, they’re they’re focused on people with diabetes and really making behavioral change so that they have healthier lives and are healthier people. So they had a campaign where there was a matching sponsor, so they were going to donate every time people exercise for thirty minutes and then took did their test so that they were being able to see from their own results that when they took a test than exercise for thirty minutes and then took another test, how much better their results were blood a butcher on, and then you report that. So so go onto the website or goto instagram and share a photo of view exercising and to prove that exercising for thirty minutes doesn’t mean you drive all the way to the gym. You change your clothes, you know, you do the thing, whatever it could just mean taking your dog for a walk that’s twice as long as normal. So you actually get to thirty minutes instead of maybe, you know, ten or fifteen around the block and realizing you don’t have to go out of your way to be exercising every day and still see those positive results in yourself. So every time you posted that you did the testing and you exercise into the test again, then the sponsor was going to donate. So of course you have all these people that for one month no. Every time i do this thing that i should do anywhere, you know, they’re going to donate money and then because you’ve done it for an entire month, and even if you only did it once a week, that was already for five times that you’ve taken this positive action and seen how easy it is, and you’re that much more likely to continue that behavior outstanding. I love how it’s so closely tied to exactly what they’re what they’re mission exactly, exactly improvement of health, of people with diabetes. Exactly. So now, if we have these messages now, we need to identify who they’re going to go out, too and where where they’re gonna go out? What? Which way said you and i are always saying, you want to go to people where they are exactly, but it’s also not the same message, every single place i mean, we have all experienced those campaigns where an organization sends you an email and then post on facebook like the exact same two paragraphs that they just set you in an email and then you don’t hear from them for the entire month, and they’re just waiting for the response to come in, so recognizing that you’re going to have some consistent messages throughout the campaign, like we talked about with the campaign communications calendar, but also that they’re going to be slightly different and nuance so new macy on facebook people not really catching the campaign, not really engaging, and yet you see people on twitter going crazy and sharing that information, so you’re going to have to address the facebook community, maybe with less information about the campaign, maybe that community is just saying we’re not really interested, so don’t be posting every single day because otherwise they’re definitely going to tune out, whereas you could start engaging twitter more cause people are really responding there. So it’s it’s also recognizing where to pull back and not just okay? Well, we’re going to send the ask everywhere another channel that you and i haven’t talked about it, we just have about a minute left. So is mobile. Yet for people who have given you permission, yeah, say little about mobile mobile is great for engaging people, especially in the middle of the campaign where you could send a text that says, hey, reminder, tomorrow is going to be the last day. So today, when you get home, you should donate or even include in the text the link so that they could go from there, you know, text message on their smartphone over to the to the web and donate their so long as you’ve actually optimized your website. So from a phone, the for the forum doesn’t look like this weird gobbledygook. Amy sample ward she’s, co author of social change anytime everywhere i’m very grateful that she’s, our regular social media contributor thank you. I really enjoyed having you on. Do you have so much banter with others? I want to believe that i give you the hardest time. Okay, well, i want then i in that case, i want you to continue believing that the book is social change any time everywhere get the book. We just talked about a small part of it. We talked about the fund-raising part, but it’s all about engagement and increasing advocacy. Moving the needle on engagement get this book it’s ah it’s on you’ll find it on amazon social change anytime everywhere amy’s blogger is amy sample ward, dot or ge? And on twitter she’s at amy rs ward amy, thanks so much. Thank you, real pleasure. Every time i got some more live listener love a story in new york, that’s, queens, welcome historia milton, ontario, canada, ontario. It checked in before we have had sudbury. Now we have milton welcome milton, and we’ll have to hold off on the rest of the live. Listen up until next week, so we’ll see who the live listeners are next week and next week, it’s going to be all lawyers. They’re going to stay in line, or i throw their ass is in jargon jail, it’s that simple, who writes this copy, i what i need is an intern, so i could blame for this shabby copy. If anybody knows an intern who wants that crummy job, please on twitter or facebook, let me know next week it is all lawyers first we’re starting with irs sale in aisle four o three b i’m going to say that word again because i’m pleased with that irs sale in aisle four o three b evan giller is a founding member of the law firm of giller and calhoun and he’s going to explain the irs is fifty percent off the penalty sale for four o three b retirement plans that are not in compliance. Trust me, i will keep him out of jargon jail and he’s he’s an interesting and very good natured guy, not your average lawyer. We’re gonna talk about the common mistakes in four o three b plans and what to do competition? Clarity are regular legal contributors jean takagi and emily chan of the non-profit and exempt organizations law group. They’re going to talk about the issues around proper compensation of your execs and others, there’s a lot to talk about there, and we’re going to a board role play also, we’re all over the social web. Amy amy sample word name a social network just name one lincoln, we’re not on lengthen. Yes, you know we are linked, and of course, we’re on the length. In group you go linked in group, you can ask the what we do there is, you can ask the asked a guest even more questions. Yes, the linked in group, our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is our line producer and assistant producer is janice taylor. Shows social media is by regina walton of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Oh, i hope you’ll be with me next friday, one to two p, m eastern on talking alternative broadcasting, but talking alternative dot com. I didn’t think that dude is a good ending. You’re listening to the talking alternate network. E-giving cubine hi, i’m donna and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s two one two seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you! You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. 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