459: 5-Minute Planned Giving Marketing & What’s Fair Game? – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

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This week: 

5-Minute Planned Giving Marketing
The best person to reveal my wildly simple Planned Giving promotion tips is me. (Originally aired 8/18/17)

What’s Fair Game?
Info you find on LinkedIn about a potential donor belongs in your report on the person. What about Facebook and Instagram? What if the tidbit is embarrassing or compromising, but valuable to your org? Should you friend prospects to learn more? Maria Semple walks us through the ethical conundrums. She’s our prospect research contributor and The Prospect Finder. (Also from the 8/18/17 show) 

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com 

436: Strategic Knowledge Management & Ethics In Your Prospect Research – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

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This week

Strategic Knowledge Management
Documents. Data. Projects. Governance. Training. They’re all components of knowledge management and our panel from 19NTC explains how to manage properly. Both returning, they’re Dar Veverka from Urban Teachers and Janice Chan at Shift and Scaffold.

Ethics In Your Prospect Research
There’s a lot of personal and private info available on your donors, volunteers and prospects. Your researcher’s job is to find it. Where are the boundaries? How do you protect it? Maria Semple takes on these and other potential landmines. She’s our prospect research contributor and The Prospect Finder.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com 

373: New Tax Law & Your 2018 Plan – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guest this week:

Gene Takagi, our legal contributor and principal of NEO, the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations law group. 

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

362: Disaster Relief & Your Event Pipeline – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Gene Takagi, our legal contributor and principal of NEO, the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations law group.

Also, Pat Clemency, president and CEO of Make-A-Wish Metro New York and Western New York.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

349: Look Good To Creditors & What Boards Get Wrong – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Paula Park, senior vice president at BankUnited.

Also, Gene Takagi, our legal contributor and principal of NEO, the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations Law Group.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

170: Brandraise To Fundraise & Safeguard Your Donor Data – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Sarah Durham, principal & founder of Big Duck and author of “Brandraising.”

Scott Koegler, editor of Nonprofit Technology News.

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent i’m your aptly named host feels so good to be back in the studio after our thanksgiving break. I hope you loved your thanksgiving and i hope you were with me two weeks ago. I’d be forced to endure ketoacidosis if i came to learn that you had missed empower your volunteers. Karen brewster is executive director of wreaths across america. They have grown their volunteer support enormously, and she explained how that was recorded at bebe khan twenty thirteen this past october and what’s their style. Maria simple returned she’s, the prospect finder and our prospect research contributor. We talked about the disk assessment tool to figure out whether your potential donors are dominant, influencing steady or cautious. Plus she had her sixty seconds style stop this week brandraise to fundraise. Sarah durham is principal and founder of big duck communications consultants for non-profits people need to know you before you can ask them for money. What is brandraise ing and how does it pave the road to fund-raising that was recorded at fund-raising day in june and safeguard your donordigital now. That you have donors, how do you best preserve and protect their information? Scott koegler is our tech contributor and the editor of non-profit technology news between the guests tony’s take to create a culture of philanthropy throughout your non-profit it’s a panel discussion that i hosted were supported by rally bound peer-to-peer fund-raising for runs, walks and rides, and by t b r c cost recovery. Getting you money back from phone bill errors and asians here is brandraise to fundraise welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of fund-raising day two thousand thirteen, we’re in midtown manhattan in times square at the marriott marquis hotel, and my guest now is sarah durham. She is principal and founder of big duck, and her seminar topic is brandraise to fundraise, build your house before you throw a party. Sorry, europe. Welcome. Hey, thanks, tony. Thanks for having me. My pleasure. Tell me about the big duck agency. So i started big deck in nineteen ninety four and so were nineteen years old. We work exclusively with non-profits to help them communicate more effectively. I love the conciseness. Thank you. Thank you. What is brandraise ing brandraise thing is a model. We’ve developed over many, many years of working with non-profits to help wth, um, rebrand largely in order to be more effective at communicating with donors, clients and other key constituents, and it’s, a model that integrates, um, best practices from the for-profit world with some non-profit reality’s like, where should the board be involved in branding, or how does your vision mission of values integrate into the work? So we do recognize that there are lessons to be learned from the corporate side there definitely are, although i would say that many a non-profit i don’t think you can be too black and white about that. I think there are lots of great lessons to learn from the for-profit world, but what works in the for-profit world does not always work in the nonprofit world, and so, you know, that’s the challenge for sure, yeah, all right, how do we get started with identifying our brand and starting this process? Well, a lot of organizations usually back into thinking about their brand because there’s another challenge that has forced them to deal with it. So for instance, they want over how their website and their thinking before we overhaul. That web site we should really sort out, you know, the problems. We have their name or the challenge with our logo, and so they kind of end up, you know, sort of through the side door getting into branding. But we’re big advocates for rethinking your brand any time you go through a significant change after strategic planning. So strategic planning should come first. But then, if your strategic plan mandates a shift in communications, that’s a really good time to revisit the brands are now brand is much deeper than just logo and name and tagline, right? Absolutely. Help us understand how how what death is. Yeah. It’s. A great question. And i would argue that your brand begins with a clear strategy that everybody in the organization is aligned with what’s. The big idea you want to communicate? We call that positioning there’s a strategic plan it’s for grows right out of your strategic plan. And then also, what is the personality of the organization? What? How does it, what tone and style does it want to use to communicate? For instance, an organization like pita has a very different communications personality than the cia. Right on. Dh that personality can influence not only communications but programs themselves. Okay, the other piece i would say about a brand is that it’s not just what the organization produces it’s also, how you’re perceived externally and your reputations so there’s a very fluid wall between what happens inside and what happens outside. But how do we find out this, how we’re perceived outside, you really have to do some research, and sometimes that research is done in a very on the flaw, i’ve seen organizations to great kind of on the fly, a qualitative research, they just talked to their clients, talk to their donors really kind of have a feeling for how they’re perceived other organizations it’s done through market research, you know, focus groups, surveys that kind of stuff, okay, so it doesn’t have to be a formal process now with a lot of money and expensive, not at all and that’s. One of the reasons i wrote the book brandraise ing is that none of this is rocket science. It’s it’s pretty easy to do the hardest part is knowing what to do and facilitating process, particularly with non-profits that have the right people involved and has buy-in at key junctures, so but doing research is pretty easy to do on your own. In fact, um, i talk about in the book, and i years ago recorded a podcast about how to do your own research. Okay, well, let’s, take one of the time i was going to give you a shout out for the book at the end. You go ahead. You mentioned it. So, what is the name of your book? The book is called brandraise ing and, uh, yeah, it came out in twenty ten. Published by josie bass. Okay, on dh your podcast. What was that called? The podcast is kind of. You can find it on itunes and other places, but we don’t keep it up to date is called the non-profit jungle. And we did want about doing your own research, which is about how you create a facilitators guide and facilitate informal focus groups. You can also just use two is like serving gizmo and surveymonkey to do some interesting research. If you have a list to send it to. Oh, interesting. I say a little more about that. How can we use these free tools? Well, so for instance, if you’ve got let’s, say you’ve got a donor database of a few thousand people who give to you in a mid level, and those people also get your e news, you might embed a survey and your e news and ask them just two or three questions that might help, you know, help get a sense of of what they think about your organization or why they’re connected, and and that often informs the branding work you do. But but oftentimes with branding it’s also really useful to go back to that group and to test so if, for instance, we’re re branding in non-profit we might create two different brochures and then informally walk into a programme space and grab a couple clients and say here’s two different brochures, does one speak to you more than the other? Or is there anything that you would find inappropriate or offensive about this content? You can do that with donors, tio, but, you know, that kind of field testing is often a great former research, okay, excellent and this’s all about having people well, having people understand and having a consistent message about what you do, how you do it what the outcomes are absolutely, i often remind people in the nonprofit sector that if you look at big for-profit companies like coca cola or target or starbucks, they have much more money and a much deeper bench of staff than most non-profits due to communicate, but yet you don’t see them change their color change the logo. I had a conversation with somebody here earlier about wanting to create an anniversary your logo, which i was advising her not to do because you want every type of communication you put out there to reinforce the essence of who your organization is, and i would rather that all ladder up to the core rather than being fractured. If tiffany every few years said, you know what, let’s make the box pink this year, they would lose the equity of that blue box, which is, you know, a court of their brand, but we do that all the time in the nonprofit world. It’s a bad habit it is okay, so what is the effect of how would you define an effective brand and effective brand is one where the people internally feel connected to it representative of it and ambassadors of it where everybody in the organization, whether their staff, person aboard person, maybe even a volunteer, could speak in some way about the work and its value, and that it’s perceived externally by its core audiences is valuable to so it’s, both internal and external, and i actually think it has a lot to do with the culture and the values of the organization being, you know, authentic and alive and and the visual identity or the messaging is really just an expression of that, and i could see how this would certainly helped fund-raising you can articulate it better than i can. So, yeah, let’s, just make that connection well, it does. It does have a lot of impact on fund-raising and one of the one of the most significant impacts we’re seeing more most recently is around social media and the idea that if you’re going to push out a fund-raising message, we’re going to do a multi channel campaign, which more and more organizations they’re doing. Those people are not just going to get your email or your direct mail, but they’re going to visit your website. They’re going to be on facebook, they’re going to go to twitter. And we want all of those messages to really ladder up and reinforce the the essence of what the organization’s about what the campaign is about. So, so that’s. A lot of what i’m talking about here. It fund-raising day talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Do you need a business plan that can guide your company’s growth? Seven and seven will help bring the changes you need. Wear small business consultants and we pay attention to the details. You may miss our culture and consultant services a guaranteed to lead toe. Right, groat. For your business, call us at nine one seven eight three, three, four, eight, six zero foreign, no obligation free consultation. Check out our website of ww dot covenant seven dot com oppcoll are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow no more it’s time for the truth. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower. We’ll discuss what you’re born you society, politics, business and family it’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to know what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. Very sharp, your neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s. Ivory tower radio dot com e every time i was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education. Listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com by the way, for those around the video, the background just shook there’s, not an earthquake in times square. Somebody on the other side, i’m sure got very exuberant about whatever, whatever any, whatever their business is on the other side, and i was shaking, so no earthquake in times square dahna this is, i guess, another way of saying this is all effective communications absolute, and it needs to be resident throughout the organization you mentioned, even even down to the level of volunteers, and you’re not talking about key volunteers, but but occasional volunteer no, i mean, i think if an organization uses volunteers and they recruit them effectively, and those volunteers have a great experience, the first thing they do is go on and tell their friends about it. So they become brand ambassadors that’s not to say we should train them on the brand, per se, but it is that we should make sure they haven’t experienced that is really aware of that and and use that to our advantage. I used in my workshop this morning an example from an organization called american jewish world service that has a program for rabbinical students and when you look at how they communicate this programme on their website, they actually tell you that if you go on this program, you’re goingto be asked when you come back to do some fund-raising on behalf of it and on the program, you’re getting sort of trained to do that work, and then when you come back, they give you the tools to do that work. So that’s a great example of an organisation using a programs audience and kind of turning them into a brand new master. You have a very vivid example before of pita versus american humane society and different messaging. How does an organization find its niche within all the organizations that are doing work within that same mission? Right? Well, again, that starts with research, and one of the things that i think is very important to do is to do a competitive landscape scans so you have to know who else is out there. George in jail on twenty martignetti non-profit radio? Yes, first we’re competitive. Landscape scan. Yeah. What are we doing? What with what we’re doing is we’re identifying our peers are partners people? I’m with you too, in fact, in fact. Way every year we do like a jargon jargon article on our block, and we have words to avoid for each year, but so, you know, so for instance, if you’re in the animal rights space, who else is in that space? What are their websites? How do they communicate? What? What are the key messages they’re using? What are the colors they’re using? What? How are they describing how their unique and i think it’s really important to always be monitoring that? Always be aware of how other organizations in your space we’re communicating that’s not to say that if they use blue, you’re going to use pink or that it’s, that kind of direct. But it is to say that it’s important to remember that people on the outside might be looking at those things a donor who wants to support animal rights might look a lots of different animal rights organizations, websites, and you need to be clear how you stand out in that space. It also again goes back to strategic planning, right cause hopefully in the strategic planning process, you’ve also had a conversation about what really makes our organization unique. And what should we? Be focusing on programmatically. Is this something that a small and midsize shop could do on their own? Absolutely. You don’t feel that there’s a need for expertise to do these kinds of competitive landscape analysis. There are other things. I mean, the difference between the smaller guys and the bigger guys comes down basically to two things. The bigger guys can afford to hire experts who take him through a process. And that’s certainly is nice. But what the small guys have that the big guy’s lack is agility. And i’ve seen some smaller organizations with staff people or with volunteers go through some really exciting, you know, strategic planning and branding processes on their own. Sometimes it takes longer and there’s more learning that has to happen on the way. Really needs a champion. It needs somebody who’s, you know, able to kind of take the work, run with it, make it their own and keep it alive. But it could be done really well. Okay. Could that person be the executive director? Absolutely. Is that you? In fact, i was i was in florida a couple of years ago, and i was giving a workshop and i met a woman who had was an executive director, one man band, no staff, just her and she she had been able to recruit volunteers, developed an incredible visual identity and messaging platform for organization she’s producing all this stuff to promote it. It was great what she was doing looked better than what a lot of large organizations i see do, and it was really about her vision. It was that she understood what effective communication should be, and she wasn’t letting herself off the hook by saying, i’m just one person she garnered these resource is she needs to make it happen. It was amazing. We’re talking about personality, right? I mean, isn’t that just another way of encapsulating everything we’re talking about? Definitely found she found the personality and was expressing her, and she knew howto she knew how to enforce it. And i mean, there are organizations that really get that executive directors who really get that who appreciate the value of great creative on dh then i think one of the reasons it doesn’t happen most often is that there are a lot of organizations where the programmatic work is so important as it’s founded. And everybody’s just putting every every effort that they have into getting those program’s up and running that the name the logo, the tagline, how we talk about the work, etcetera becomes an afterthought and and oftentimes it’s on ly five years, ten years, twenty five years in that the organization starts to say, wait, these things are actually holding us back. We need teo, you know, re prioritize you mentioned something that i want to explore a little more than enforcement. We’ve been through this process. Now we’ve found our niche and where expressing it, how do we keep it in fourth? Yeah, i mean, the old model is brand policing so that’s appointing a person who really, you know is somewhat of a bully about keeping things consistence and on track the person who would write style guide, for instance, it might be it might be bigger, but these days i what i really prefer and what i would really encourage organizations to do because i think it’s much more relevant is to cultivate everybody to be a brand ambassador, right? I mean, if if a staff person, any staff person can’t go to the gala or to a block party or to whatever is going on and talk effectively about the organization that’s a problem, right? So everybody needs to be able to be an ambassador for the organization in whatever way they can. And in order to make that work, it has to be very communications have to be very, very simple, and they have to be very accessible to everybody on staff. So you mentioned a style guide style. Guides are getting more and more common in the nonprofit sector. A stock historically has been a rule book for how to use the visual identity. I actually prefer brand guide, which talks more about the communications strategy for the organization and the messaging like here’s. How you abbreviate our name. Don’t use the acronym, you know to go back to juergen instead of in the workshop i gave this morning, there was one woman whose organization goes by a i x y abila long acronym. And when she unpacks that its association you know exactly what they do with the name so it’s. A cumbersome name. But i’d rather she call it the association if she has two short handed at least there’s a clue. Who they are okay? And this trickles down to i think you’ve made you’ve made the point already everybody in the organization doesn’t your function, maybe very ministerial down to maintenance, perhaps, but you still you need to be speaking with that same organizational voice, absolutely. And if the maintenance person is on facebook and might be posting something about an event that’s going on that they were involved in helping, then you want them to feel empowered to beyond message what else? What did i not ask you that you’d like to share with small and midsize shops about about this process grand raising how it helps supports fund-raising well, i would say, you know, one one one theme we’ve touched on, but i wanted to say again is don’t give up hope just because you’re small and you can’t afford to hire an agency or whatever, that doesn’t mean you can’t do a great job. When i wrote my book, i was trying very hard to write it from a point of view of could somebody who doesn’t do this stuff every day take this and use it, and i’m hearing back from people that they can, but i’m also seeing more and more examples of organizations just really coming up with fresh, creative ways to do it. We built this scorecard that we have on our website where you can go in and sort of answer a series of questions, and it reflects back to you how your organization is doing managing its communications on one of the interesting findings we we have uncovered from that is that this small guys do it, justus well, as the big guys, that that the the having staff people or money for communications does not necessarily make you a better communicator. Excellent website is picked up dot com it’s, big duck. Nice dot com okay, don’t you ignore what i said? First big duck and dot com sarah door. Um, you want to leave one last one last tip. Come to fund-raising days. Great show. I want to see you all here next year. You’ll be back. I’ll be back. I love it here. Yeah. Sarah durham is thanks durney principle. My pleasure. Thank you very much. Principal and founder of big duck leary in n y c her book is brandraise ing and i want to thank you very much for joining me, sara and listeners viewers thank you for joining my coverage of fund-raising day two thousand thirteen marriott marquis hotel. Thanks very much. Thanks. Yes, my thanks to everyone at fund-raising day and sarah durham. To bring this show, we need some help. And i want you to know about the two companies that are helping us bradrick rally bound is a sponsor. They make simple, reliable peer-to-peer fund-raising software. This is software for runs, walks and rides it’s friends asking friends to give to your cause. You get a discount as a non pas provoc radio listener. Get that claim that discount you can go to rally bound dot com or just call them up on talk to joe mcgee and he will answer your questions and help you build your campaign. And, of course, explain how rally bound khun do that for you. They’re at rally bound dot com or triple eight seven six seven nine zero seven six and we are also supported by t b r c cost recovery yourselfer benowitz runs t brc. He will go over your past phone bills looking for errors when he finds them, which he does ninety. Percent of the time phone cos it turns out, are not so good about billing correctly. Then he picks up the phone when he finds these errors and he fights the phone company to get you money back. These are not only errors in billing, but also services that you didn’t order or you’re getting the wrong pricing, not what, not what you were supposed to be charged for, a service and also he can fight well above market pricing when he finds that, um, i had mentioned a couple weeks ago that recently he saved a non-profit almost twelve thousand dollars after finding errors in their phone bill that went back three years and you only pay ti brc if they actually get money back from the phone company, they can also save you money looking far word, because if you’ve, um, if there have been mistakes in the past, then there’s savings to be accrued going ahead as well. Trc cost recovery yussef rabinowitz i’ve known him for almost ten years. He’s at tbe rc dot com or two. One, two six double four nine. Triple xero ask for yosef twenty steak too. I hosted a panel discussion. For the new york ilsen chapter of a f p about two months ago or so that’s, the association of fund-raising professionals, the discussion was about creating a culture of philanthropy throughout your non-profit very similar to what sarah duram was talking about in having everyone be a brand ambassador from the receptionist to your ceo. There were three very smart people with me. They were terry, billy, matt bregman and brian saber. It was informative conversation, and i love the topic because it does come up a lot. How do you encourage everyone in your non-profit two treat the people they come in contact with as potential donors. It was informative, and we had some fun as well. There’s a link to the video on my block at tony martignetti dot com and that is tony’s take two for friday, the sixth of december forty seventh show of the year. Scott koegler is with me, you know him he’s, our monthly tech contributor. He’s, the editor of non-profit technology news, which you’ll find it n p tech news. Dot com and on twitter he’s at scott koegler. Scott, how are you? I’m doing well, tony, how you terrific lee. Thank you very much. You have a good thanksgiving. I did way too much turkey. But, you know that’s to be expected. Alright, good. You had fun. He did. We’re talking about safeguarding your donordigital. What are the, uh what of the potential risks here if donordigital is compromised? Well, there’s a lot of risks. You actually tony and what’s probably the biggest one is that not just the the data is stolen, but the information about your donors is compromised and that’s something that has made a whole lot of headlines recently well, over the last few years actually, um about, you know, different different companies having having their data breached, having there credit card information stolen and now people losing, losing the privacy of the credit information identity theft by another word. So there are implications that are certainly public relations you don’t want to be, you know, it may not be a headline if you’re a smaller midsize shop, but you can have a public relations problem among your donors and volunteers without it being in the headlines. There’s legal implications and you couldn’t even have, like some financial problems mean if people if it comes to the point of people suing you? Are you having to pay for damages? Definitely. Definitely. You know that i moved to south carolina recently, and last year i think that was earlier this year. Actually, the the the state governments website was breached. And supposedly all of the information that that anyone who has filed tax returns in the state oh, my goodness is stolen. So, you know, i mean that’s bad enough. I haven’t actually heard of anyone who was, you know, was affected by having their identities going. But what happened was that the state, aside from the, you know, the political and and other kinds of just general discussion about how things were handled badly, they had to offer a free subscription service to an identity theft, monitoring service to literally everyone in the state. Oh, my and a couple people. And so on, top of on top of having to rebuild their infrastructure, you know, tighten down their security, you know, they have that financial burden, you know, just added things. So yeah, financial consequences definitely did this stuff the car during the five days when governor mark sanford was off with his girlfriend in in argentina is that when that happened, it could have i don’t know, i you know, it could have been an argentinean internet connection get part of the story his reputation has since been rehabilitated because he was he was elected. Tio what the house of representatives, i think for for south carolina? I think so. Although i have to have two admit that i haven’t really followed much of the south carolinian political situation, even though i should have. Okay, well, you’re you’re new resident. Well, i am your break now. Good vote. So, i guess it’s good. What part of the problem with identity theft, though, is that people the bad people don’t use the data right away because they know that everybody who’s data was compromised is on the lookout, but they’ll wait. I mean, they’ll wait three for five years and use the data then when your date of birth and social security number haven’t changed and maybe even your address hasn’t changed. And and by then people are not on the lookout for the for the theft. Because it’s been so many years since it occurred. Exactly exactly. And then it’s also hard to track down. Where that breach came from because if it wass, for instance, a small provider, small company or a small non-profit that got that breached, uh, may not have been reported, right? Not everybody owns up to it, and actually not everybody actually knows that they’ve been breached. Right rights, it’s not in the hacker’s best interest to notify anyone that had that data. Yeah, yeah, now it gets it gets discovered by some audit. Or maybe the hackers will sloppy or something like that, but yeah, i’m sure there are lot of instances where organization don’t even know that it’s happened. All right, so if we’re going to protect our donordigital what we need to be thinking about first? Well, the first thing is pretty obvious stuff is that, you know, if you don’t need the information, don’t keep it, don’t collect it, don’t get it one of the pieces of information, of course, that non-profits do. On whose credit card information, uh, and some sites you know, amazon in particular, and pretty much any e commerce site collect credit card information and then there’s a convenience to the chopper. We’ll store that information? Yes. And, you know it’s convenient. And in a situation like amazon, people may go back there and by things you know, almost daily, and so in that case, it really is a convenience, so you don’t want to. I don’t want to keep entering my my credit card information every time i buy something for a non-profit that that frequency is probably significantly less than what amazon gets and we would certainly hope with it it’s more frequent, but reality is they’re probably talking about a few times a year at the most. Yes, so in those cases allow the credit card information to the energy. Be sure that it’s over a secure line and that’s here’s a jug and peace for https that’s uh uh that’s the secure website connections that links the website that someone beat feeling to the with the back end server some reason, scott, i know that http is hypertext transfer protocol, right? And then i believe that as few yeses for secure okay, sorry, sorry. Nobody cares about nobody cares. Um, so and that part right there just means that someone monitoring are tapping into the line isn’t just catching the data while it’s streaming by them on dh collecting it that way. That’s the first line of security, but the second, you know, use the information, make the transaction, get the get the donation into the bank account, and then just don’t record the critical information, right? Just by doing that i could probably solve. I’m going to say at least fifty percent of the of the problems that a data breach can cause for constituents for donors. There’s other information that would fall into those to that category, i’m thinking, like date of birth, social security number, even even address? Yeah, address an email. I mean, you don’t want those to be compromised. Yeah, here’s an interesting piece of the security information. Did you know if you have a person’s first name your date of birth and their zip code, you can find out through there first name, date of birth and zip code that’s enough to identify? Yeah, yeah, that makes sense way, wouldn’t you? Yeah, when you say it, it makes sense, but somebody wouldn’t think that those if you’re not, if you’re not in a security role, you wouldn’t realize that those three things can be really damaging and you could find everything about those so i mean, date of birth, i mean, probably non-profits don’t have to save date of birth, right? Date of birth, you know? Krauz they probably do need address information in order to send maybe a ten, ninety nine, you know, donation form at the end of the right, right? But certainly so security number is not necessary. I don’t. I don’t think that’s required for a ten, ninety nine. Well, non-profits aren’t sending ten, ninety nine’s. They’re just sending the just sending acknowledgement letters. Okay, so, yeah, ten. Ninety nine’s that’s for contractors. So so wouldn’t you wouldn’t need it. You wouldn’t need you would not need it for donors. All right, but so there’s there’s information that we should save, but we should look scrupulously at what we are actually preserving is the point. Okay, what we need and don’t even ask for what you don’t need and those things that you do need, you know, on a on a short term basis, like credit card information. Just really okay. Okay. There’s still information that you need and there’s information that you want to keep. You want to keep the name, you know, the donation history, maybe. Their activities, you may want to keep their their their address, and they want it. Particularly if you do send out snail mail. Kind of, uh, information. You know, newsletters do still go by on paper. And so there is information that you want and here’s one of the ways that south carolina system was breached. No, if they could have avoided the entire disaster with the effects of the disaster. Maybe not for a public relations standpoint, but from the effect on its citizens. By encrypting the data they have. So wait, he talked about, you know, using a secure internet connection tps. And that applies and encryption to all of the information going across the internet wire. But once it reaches the program of stories that data, um, you know, that data is stored in a database and the database is usually, um, pretty transparent. In other words, you can open the database. Look at the information and it’s you know, it’s in english. It’s in what’s, commonly called clear text. So it’s, you know, you can look at it with a human being can read it and understand it. And i know it’s easy and it’s the way that things are stored most of time. What south carolina did not do on. Actually, a couple of others didn’t dio notable ones are adobe and link them okay. Not small names of people that you would think would know better. Um, they did not encrypt the contents of their database. So what that means is if the data is not encrypted, hacker gets in, they download the database and they can use it’s all visible in clear text. Okay. Okay. All right. So so the data that we do store, we should consider encryption, right? Absolutely. Absolutely their encryptions pretty easy. Most databases have it as a non option. You could just, you know, take a box and bingo. It’s all encrypted. So we have to also consider where this data is safe, right? It’s lots of different places and including portables buy-in night. Um, sure, cellphones get lost, laptops gets stolen, all those kind of things happen. I don’t know that. There’s an additional answer there. I mean, certainly you can password protect cell phones and laptops for typically people don’t do that. Yeah, well, we’re going to get to policies that they should be doing so. But they’re also the data is on servers. In your and hopefully your server closet is secure. I’ve seen a lot of servers that including businesses, small businesses where, you know it’s in a like a ah whole janitorial closet or something up on a shelf, not secure it all, but data can also be in the cloud. Uh, exactly that it could be in the cloud and it’s kind of a counterintuitive. I’ll just give you my personal take on this. I think on i believe that the data that’s stored in a no properly created cloud environment it was much more secure than something that’s residing in your server. Have your office. Okay, why don’t i tell you why? First of all, servers in officers are managed fly, but people in those officers typically and except for, you know, very large non-profits most of those people are not, um, it’s, not a full time job to manage the security of the service right there doing other things. They have a full time job for a part time job and a piece of a part of a tiny portion of that time maybe to make a backup of the server, on the other hand, cloud based systems it is their business, it’s, the only business, and not only are the, uh, typically bound by terms and conditions of the contract with that you have with them to protect your data, if if they’re breached, uh, they stand to lose their entire business just from the bad p r so it’s in their best interest to keep their, you know their customers, clients, data secure, you know, they those kinds of environments, too, support the https secure connections they do typically encrypt the data. I’m not saying you don’t need to check those things, but i do believe that it’s, no overall, safer environment, leave it in the hands of the professionals. Okay, way. Have to go away for a couple minutes when we come back. Scott. Now, keep talking about safeguarding your donordigital. We’ll get into some of the policies that you should have. Stay with us. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. I’m dana ostomel, ceo of deposit, a gift. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. All right, scott, we know what data we’ve got and what we need to save and not save way we know where the data is stored, what kind of policies should we have in place? Yeah, well, as you mentioned, it’s it’s a good thing to have a policy that says, you know, you need to secure your devices with a password so that every time you go to use that needs to be logged in, um, in my experience that that may work in corporate environments where the shop has the ability to actually manage the devices that were used by their weather employees, but in an environment that says generally as loose as a non-profit think becomes pretty difficult to enforce. For one thing, you know, you’re your volunteers may all that they have bones that are being managed by their brother employers. So you get a conflict in that in that area, i’m still it’s a good thing to do. Certainly you want to be sure that the staff isn’t writing things down on pieces of paper, so if they are recording things, they are being recorded in a digital format in a secure format so that whatever protections are being enforced in the inn that digital connection are being used, they may not be one hundred percent, but it’s better than nothing for sure. We should also have policy around who has access to different pieces of data, absolutely, and that has to do with the, uh, the applications that you use in historian information some of the more simplistic application, for instance, locally, you know, homemade databases, spreadsheets, things like that have very limited security options, right? Most of the most of the non-profit applications that are available commercially have what they call multi level rules so you can define a roll of manager out of the data entry clerk, you know, hosting volunteer and different kinds of rules like that, and each one of those can have different levels of access to information. So somebody who’s carrying around a tablet that in the event registering people for the event, they only have access to the data entry function for that piece, it certainly would not have access two historical e-giving and other other information has already been recorded when i go teo cem, clients on i’m using their database there’s data that i can’t see? Social security number. For instance, i i can see that it’s preserved, but all i see in that field is a bunch of stars. Date of birth, i think is another one. Or maybe i see the year, but not the day in the month. Something like that. So there there are there are data, ways of preserving and i log on to that database so it knows who i am and what level of access i have. Exactly. When i was, that reminds me of when i was in the air force, i had i had top secret clearance. And then beyond top secret, there was something called psyop. Yes, i which was it was his top secret. T s psyop was the single integrated operating plan. And then, yes, i was for extra sensitive information. So you could have t s and then you could go beyond that, and then beyond that. And then there’s, you know, obviously there people bled levels of security clearance beyond me. But i had top secret c i a p ece anyway, so so just exactly as you told me that tony means you have to kill me right now. There. Are other reasons i need to kill you. Is that another doing? Just revealed. Okay. All right. So the software can help us. All right. So this is part of our policies is who who has access to what? On a need to know basis, right? That’s, basically, what do you need to know? To do your job? Exactly. And there’s one two things i’ll bring up here one is that, you know most well, most a lot of instances of breach come from, uh, not getting rid of logging access. That is not necessary any longer. So someone leaves the organization. The very first thing that should be done is that log in should be deactivated. Deleted whatever. Yes, at the very least. Password changed. But there are lots of lots of instances where that wasn’t done immediately. And the data, you know, goes away and let’s face it. You know, it’s it’s, not just a friendly departure. That person is more likely to take action immediately than they are, you know, a month down the road. So quick action is is really, uh, you know the right thing to do. Let’s, talk a little about insurance. There’s there’s. Cyber insurance there is dahna and, you know, i haven’t really looked at the prices for those, but i’m sure that there is based on the amount of information, the value of your database, all those kind of things, but i would say that most of the large insurance company i’m looking at the hartford and shove, for instance, they offer what’s called a data breach insurance, which is exactly what we’re talking about here, its protection against loss, its protection against lawsuits from some problems occurring based on the loss, liability, all those nothing i would say it’s definitely something we’re looking into. And of course, you know, hindsight will always tell you that you should have done it. Yeah, but, you know, pryce will make that determination for you, okay? We’re not holding you to the standards of of an insurance broker, so you don’t need to know the price, but but important for people to know that it exists and and as you suggested, you know, if you have a bad person, maybe they left on bad terms or maybe they’re still working for you, and they just have some bad intentions. No policy is going to prevent them from getting what they want if they’re if they’re industrious enough like and an interesting statistic. Seventy five percent of a raw data theft and i’m talking well, i guess it could be called hacking, but they left. This use of data happens internally of that seventy five percent, fifty percent of it is from physical, just physically copying the data onto a thumb drive. Or, you know, some other cd or something like that. So it really, you know, most of what’s gonna happen is really gonna happen within the organization and that’s for anything. And this heartening, unfortunately true. You’re a former ceo, right? Chief information officer, chief technology officer on the corporate side. Um what? What more do you want to impart? I haven’t asked you about, uh, you know, lock the doors. That’s, that’s probably the biggest and most difficult thing that we had to contend with was making sure that the facility is secure. Now, those when i was doing that, cloud computing was really not a big issue. So locking the doors, you know, for a cloud environment doesn’t really does it really work. That said, there are still, uh, there’s still paper records that your store in camp, almost any organization and locking the doors were locking the file cabinets or some other way, securing access against the paper records. Still it’s still the right thing to do, and we’ll we’ll avoid some of the day. The fact that we’re talking about yes, excellent. We’ve been talking about digitised data, but there’s still lots of paper records and just simple locks on a file cabinet on blocks on doors, andan that server door that you know that those hallway closet server that i see where it’s the maintenance you know, it’s it’s above the slop sink that’s crazy frank, right it is and have one one other issue that we talked about and that is what’s called social engineering and has nothing to do with data. Uh, it’s it’s really old fashioned and involved. Usually telephone, but it could be personal. Personal face-to-face okay, you know, we talked about the three pieces of information that will lead to someone really knowing who you are like that, uh, your first name, date of birth and your zip code. You may not say all those things to the same person at the same. Time, but, uh, social engineering involves people making phone calls into an organization, talking to different people and pulling different pieces of information from those different people and then assemble in those outside so they’re pretty easy to, you know, called secretary and they, you know, i’m trying to get the three owners birthday gift, you know, what? They were on dh, you know, by the way, you know, at another person calls in to another person in the organization and says, you know what? Town today with them? I mean, no, there you go right there. Three piece of information, yes. Wow. That’s okay, those air bad there’s a bad actors, but but if somebody want that they can, they can put it together over time. And andi, even if even a small organization, even if there aren’t that many people, if they can call they could do it over time, they can have a have ah, accomplice maybe helping. So one time it’s a man a couple weeks later, it’s a woman asking different things. Your office isn’t going to protect against that exactly. Then we’re not as people, we’re not wired to think, you know, in that. Kind of devious way to protect ourselves. Okay. All right. All the more reason for thinking about this thing about cyber insurance, i think. Exactly. Exactly. All right, we have just a couple of minutes left. Scott, i’m going to put you on the scott on the i’m going to put you on the scott. I’m going to put you on the spot for a holiday wine recommendation as part of your as your sixty second style stop. Whoa, what wine do you loving? In the month of december? A month of december, we actually we found one that we absolutely love. It’s it’s the two thousand ten it’s called immortal it’s zampa dollars. You might expect it’s just it’s, you know, luxurious it’s. Wonderful. And it’s. Got that typical in-kind of sweetness and smooth with a lot of food. Uh, that fifty bucks and i, you know, been enjoying that one. Okay. That’s a that’s, a red zinfandel or white red’s. Okay, two thousand ten immortals in scott koegler sixty second style. Stop, scott. Always a pleasure. Enjoy your holidays. Thank you very much. Good to talk to you. Thanks so much for your help, scott koegler on twitter. He’s at scott koegler konigstein are and he’s, the editor of non-profit technology news, which is that n p tech news. Dot com next week, the millennials study derek feldman will be with me. I’m pretty sure he’ll be in the studio. He’s, co author of that report also amy sample, ward she’s, our social media contributor and ceo of non-profit technology network and ten she returns next week. Remember our supporters rally bound dot com and tb rc dot com. I’m very grateful for their support. They’re good people. Please check them out. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is at the board, as our line producer shows. Social media is by deborah askanase of community organizer two point oh, and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. This excellent music is by scott stein. Oh, i hope to be with me next week that’ll be friday, december thirteenth. The, uh i don’t know which friday of the year it is, but it’ll be at one to two eastern at talking alternative dot com. You didn’t think that shooting getting thinking. You’re listening to the talking alternative network duitz get in. E-giving cubine are you a female entrepreneur ready to break through? Join us at sexy body sassy sol, where women are empowered to ask one received what they truly want in love, life and business. Tune in thursday, said noon eastern time to learn timpson juicy secrets from inspiring women and men who, there to define their success, get inspired, stay motivated and defying your version of giant success with sexy body sake. Sold every thursday ad. 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117: As You Help The Next Generation Of Social Changers & Public Info On Private Companies – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Jonathan Lewis, founder of iOnPoverty

Maria Semple, The Prospect Finder and author of “Panning For Gold: Find Your Best Donor Prospects Now!”

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent it’s your aptly named host i want to welcome new listeners we have a bunch of new listeners who i believe came over from my chronicle of philanthropy podcast it’s the number seems so big that i don’t want to say it because i’m not positive that i’m reading the stats correctly. It’s, it’s more than seven, and next week, when i get some technical advice, um interpreting the stats for me, the downloads that’s i’ll have a better read on how many new listeners have come over, but i mentioned the show on last month’s chronicle of philanthropy podcast, and last month in october, there was a huge, huge spike in aa in transfers, the data transfer of the this audio podcast file on i’ll have more on that next week, but welcome to all those new listeners and also a shout out to ah, professor gen shang she was a guest on my show on may eighteenth of this year, she’s, a philanthropic psychologist, and the segment was five words to better fund-raising and she’s profiled in today’s new york times e-giving section, by the way, today’s november ninth and it’s a profile on her on dh what it’s like to be what it is to be a philanthropic psychologist, so i discovered her the times picked her up on dh. Now she won’t take my calls she’s famous i hope you’re with me last week. Oh, how i hope you were with me last week. I’d be devastated if i learned that you had missed grow your grateful patient program. Bill mcginley, president and ceo of the association for healthcare philanthropy and nancy johnson, senior consultant that target analytics, sat with me at the bb con conference earlier this year to talk about health care, grateful patient fund-raising why these prospects are critical and very generous, the privacy concerns and how to start your relationship with grateful patients. Also, disaster relief charities want to help hurricane sandy victims in the rush to help you can’t ignore the rules around private benefit and needs assessment and documentation. Our monthly legal contributors jean takagi and emily chan from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group explained the rules this week as you help the next generation of social changers jonathan lewis he’s the founder of ion poverty produces career advice, video interviews with leaders in non-profit social change, his videos air free and short and valuable as you lied and mentor twentysomethings who want to make a difference in the world, we’re gonna listen to a couple of clips from mentoring for dummies and shut the hell up. Also public info on private companies maria simple, the prospect finder on our monthly prospect research contributor is back, and this time she has free and lo fi ways to get information on your prospects, privately held companies. The company’s may be small, and the relationships may be as important as the data between the guests on tony’s take to my block this week is researcher bias in the stelter planned giving report. I’m concerned about some misleading advice in this report around planned e-giving prospecting, and i’ll talk about it on tony’s take two if you’re on twitter while you’re listening, use hashtag non-profit radio to join the conversation right now we used to take a break ordinarily, that would be a break right now, but we’ve eliminated this break. We’ve heard your feedback, we’ve eliminated a commercial break and there is not. Going to be a break right now, i am going to go right to my first guest, we’re going to talk about his videos and how i think that they’re valuable, and he agrees i’m certain that could be helpful to you as your as your leading young people in social change. Jonathan lewis is a founder of ion poverty he’s also founder and board chair of micro credit enterprises, which is a social venture that leverages private capital to capital to make tiny business loans to deeply impoverished people in developing countries. He’s, a lecturer at the bluhm center for developing economies at uc berkeley and he blocks for the huffington post. I’m very glad that his work at ion poverty brings jonathan lewis to the show. Jonathan welcome, thank you it’s a pleasure to have you with us let’s, talk a little about obviously why i on poverty? Why? Why did you create this what’s the need of the need overwhelming? Uh, you sure where that they’re over a news and young people and and i didn’t say, beloved and there idealistic there’s smart, they’re intuitively global citizens, and they want to make a difference in the world. And they’re thinking, in terms of of career with meaning, how to be a donor zoho peer-to-peer jonathan, jonathan, i’m gonna i’m gonna stop you for a minute. The connection is pretty poor and you’re sort of cutting out. I’m going to ask you to call back the same number, same number, same ok, and i’ll talk a little about ion poverty not as eloquently as you will please call right back, okay, and i on poverty. The reason i invited jonathan lewis to be a guest is because the career videos that he produces are short and to the point, he’s interviewing people called that he calls pathfinders and these air like three minute videos, these air people that are leading social change and we’ll talk about who some of those are on dh. When i saw his videos, when i watch them on the ion poverty site, which is that i on i the letter i on poverty dot tv, i recognized that for for my listeners who are leading brand new employees or even maybe just junior level employees, these value these videos could be valuable to you. They impart some lessons that maybe it’s a little. Tough to say right to the person’s face and they might help you video wass jonathan, welcome back. How are you? Okay. You sound much better. You feel much better if i was a rejuvenating break? Why don’t you confront you called about taking a little hang up. Take a nap and you called back in fifteen minutes. I’m a big fan of naps. You’ll feel even more rejuvenated. Okay? Why don’t we say again? It was it was a little choppy. What’s the importance of of the iron poverty video work. Well, let’s start with the basics from the perspective of a non-profit leader or for-profit leader. But who who are social change agent? The employees of tomorrow are today’s millennial generation. They’re idealistic, they’re natural global citizens. They get issues, they want to make a change in the world. They’re wicked smart and they’re struggling with how did they get started? In the social change space and through all the wonderful university programs we have been, the conference is your size. We still reach the relatively small percentage of the million delusional generation and people in the united states of love. So the idea was let’s get a beginner let’s provide him with the video informational interviews that were last to give every day uh, with the concrete nitty gritty information that they’re asking us about how they get started. And so we’ve tried tried that we’ve produced one hundred videos, and we’re getting great response, and it feels like we’re removing the needle. You call your your guests pathfinders and i i mean it all i have on my show, his guests, i feel i feel so pedestrian just having guests. I’m sorry, you’re just a guest here. Jonathan, do you want to continue your not a pathfinder here? Because your i’m sorry you’re always what yours, but you would be a terrible i have. I have great guests, but i don’t have pet fund. I feel like i need like a cub scout badge or something with pathfinder’s. Why? Why were your why your guests called pathfinders called pathfinders way knowledge that it’s a little nudity in a way, but they are really setting the path they have had followed the path they took them, uh, some forty percent circuitous route, two conditions and jobs that are changing the world. They’re not celebrity, not opening price. Winner. They’re not people of great wealth. Their average vote to do, uh, beyond after work, to make the world a better place and their life stories, or the kind of role model that a lot of people, young people begin their own co-branding all, too, to figure out which way they want to go. And, uh, so what were they thinking? Sticking people with what’s called a realistic. And so we called pathfinders. Okay, fine for listeners, i know that the call is not a great quality. I know sam’s working on here in the studio were very well aware that’s not great quality, but we’re going, we’re going toe pursue i because i liken understand what johnson saying, it’s just i know it’s ah it’s, not great quality and also on twitter, read stockman. I see you on twitter there if anybody else is is listening and you’re on twitter, use the hash tag non-profit radio you could meet, read stockman read. I’m going to say it varies sometimes we get a few people tweeting, live tweeting and sometimes none but so read, stockman says. Is anybody there? I’m here read i’m listening to you and if you want to shoot us anything, read, we’re monitoring that hashtag here in the studio. So read stockman on twitter, you are not alone. What kind of feedback if you’ve been getting from young people? Jonathan about the videos, that boat for italy and also, uh in in america has been fantastic. We’ve already had over people wear hoping, of course, jonathan interruption again, try speaking a little bit louder. Please maybe even, you know, like a public seminar type speaking voice, not a phone voice got it alright, is that better? Yes, speak louder, it’s just you know tony is long, but it isn’t getting a feedback loop on the cult, so talking louder, strange, but i am going forward! I understand after is editorially we’re getting terrific feedback from young people. Their writing is really heartfelt emails that really bring a tear to your eye with the reasonable one young lady from austin, texas, rodeo and said i hadn’t had no idea than anyone else felt the way i did about social change and making the world a better place. I’m on a journey for justice, and so we’re getting terrific feedback on it in the day today, email, traffic. But beyond that, we’ve already had over fifty thousand dahna website viewers come to the website in just three months it’s growing dramatically, and we’re very excited about it. Excellent, because it gives you a middle aged guy and you’re talking to twentysomethings but it’s a crime in my dhoti. All right, well, yeah, better you say it than i do. But it’s it’s working it’s working it is. It turns out that the a little counterintuitive and maybe something that your listeners will be interested in the notion of a sixty year old, you know, bearded guy doing these interviews seems odd because you would think that having millennials do the interviews would make more sense. But as it turns out, because i followed this path myself, i’ve got an instinct and standing to ask some of the tougher, more gritty questions that that really millennials want to ask, but often sometimes a little hesitant to put out there, okay? And it seemed to work. All right, i tell you, i’m not tryingto cycle analyze it, but it worked and that’s consistent with why i invited you on the show because i think the video’s say some things to young people that their supervisors in charities might not be comfortable saying. Face-to-face jonathan, we gotta take a break, and when we return, of course you’ll stay with me and we’ll listen to a couple of clips. Great. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre. Awareness for exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city in compton plains, new jersey. Greg brayden will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Greg brayden, november ninth and tenth, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot order or a h a n j dot net. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stopped by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s the answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back and i have live listener love, fresno, california, san francisco, california, dallas, texas, new bern, north carolina rest in virginia live listener loved all those place is all those listeners, and i have got to send out podcast listeners love cause i know fargo, north dakota is going to be listening. Bye podcast and i the reason i know that is that they invited one of my past guests, dr robert penna, to be a speaker to goto north dakota fargo specifically and speak to charities there, and he was he was a guest on august thirty first, two thousand eleven. You may remember he’s, the author of the non-profit outcomes toolbox. Um, and they contacted him because they heard him on one of these podcast. So podcast listeners love to fargo, north dakota. I love north korea’s got a couple air force bases and i used to be in the air force. My not and grand forks air force bases. Jonathan lewis, let’s let’s set up a clip. Well, i want to listen, teo. Mentoring for dummies with kaya wind would why don’t you tell listeners who she is? Kai winn would is a trainer of non-profit. Leader, he for rock would institute is based in the bay around there. Francisco, oakland, california. She has experience in the field. He’s better of the tough conversations that we all need to have some time. Alright, this video is called mentoring for dummies. We’re just gonna listen to that clip you enjoy mentoring it’s night meant her all the time. But but what’s lacking in that, will you mentor me is here’s what i will bring to the table, right? Ideally, i’m gonna learn from things and you’re going to learn some things. And it’s, not just a one sided. I provide you with something and then you go off. We provide each other with something and that’s part of the exchange. I love the astute questioning their jonathan very, very good what’s ah, what’s behind her advice. Well, which is really, uh, benchmarking is the fact that this generation, more than any other generation before time, wants to be considered and treated as co equals in the conversation, although they also have the same insecurities about realizing they don’t have all the answers. And so the new mentoring mentee relationship is much more transactional. It here i have things i can teach you, but tell me what you could bring to the table that you, khun teach me whatever that might be now obviously always going to be a slightly unequal, maybe sometimes enormously unequal trade relationship there, but it is a relationship and it’s, not a one off. I’m going to teach you from behind a podium, what you need to know, and then you go off and okay, and i could see where it could be fairly balanced. I mean, not in career advice, but the young people bring enormous knowledge of stuff that those of us in our forties, fifties and sixties don’t have. Absolutely and the core of the entire project, the aisle poverty tv project and what we’re thirsty from all of the people were interviewing is the core skillsets for both employer and employee is good listener ship the ability to be patient, listen to what the other person has to offer, bring it out in them and it’s the skill that young people need tto learn in their first job. Absolutely. Would you just say e can have? I don’t know it’s, just my stand up comedy let’s, listen to another. Clip john an er, who’s who’s john andr john andr is the chief executive officer of the east meets west foundation, which is probably the most distinguished elearning the liver of services throughout southeast asia, particularly in vietnam. Rum what types of services are they providing in vietnam? What types of services are they providing? Health care, clean water, education, dollar ships? Ah, whole array of services and he is a really okay here’s a segment from the video with john andr shut the hell up! If you’re early in your career, there’s a couple of really important things to do the first one is just to shut the hell up and don’t talk for about five years and worked really, really hard. Theo on li wei, you’re gonna be given maur difficult things to do is by solving the ones you already given, and if you’re somebody who’s always complaining or wants to be promoted above where they really are, you can’t learn enough to start to take on a greater pool of responsibilities. The second thing is to really pay attention to the personal values during that stage of your career, so these are self discipline, integrity, honesty. Empathy and there’s a whole range of things, but it takes disciplined, coherent effort to really reveal those things in yourself. The first thing i want to say is your theme music is not as cool as mine i actually agree with. We have ways i know it’s. You can’t it’s well, you can’t. I’m not even gonna tell you my name. Your well, you’ll come up hyre in search engines now, okay? So he’s, talking about honesty, integrity, the’s air these air crucial, and i’m not sure that non-profit leaders air having these kinds of conversations with their entry level and junior employees. I think that the core point here is not so much the particulars, but that we are very good because we’re in the nonprofit sector and we’ve been into the whole time we tend to think that because we’re doing good work, they were doing it in a good, impactful way, and those that line gets blurred a lot. And i think what dawn and sprint say is that for the early and b level social worker, they need to be taught both. What is the program? What is the project but it’s the mission what? Are the goals, but also the process of personal character skills that would carry them from one job to another. We know that people in our sector will be changing jobs a lot over many, many career paths, including maybe stopping out of social change work. Latto working more traditional jobs, where they can possibly make a little bit more money, support a family, take care of their personal financial needs. But throughout all those career step character. What are some of the things that you you’re learning from your pathfinders and from the feedback that you’re getting from young people that air some shortcomings in in leadership of new employer while entry level on dh junior employees? Well, i think two things one, one area that clearly needs to be dahna worked on is the recruitment process. Every other industrial sector has root routine, a recruitment, the pipelines go to university and there’s a job fair and you’ll see thanks and major consulting firms and health companies and all kinds of recruiters going to get the best and brightest of our graduating student. The social sector doesn’t have any equivalent like that, and typically the people the non-profits who show up university based job fairs are local organizations, which, almost by definition, more limited budgets and more fewer positions for students. So that’s a big structural problem, and then at the board the street level, we’re not communicating very well two young people that their skills development can occur in a lot of different platforms. And let me say that in simple english, one of the most poignant interviews we did was a woman talking about who is now the ceo of a major global pompel social change investment fund, and we’re talking to her about now she needs to be able to talk to people at the very deepest levels of poverty in developing countries around the world and also extremely wealthy, high net worth individuals here in the u s and what she finally said wass i learned to be a good listener by volunteering in high school and a hospital, hector, where i just had to sit and listen to people who are dying, we just wanted to sort of recount their life stories, and that empathetic listening skill has actually been the central lynchpin of her successful social change career. We don’t really talk very much about the more effective side of skills development. Jonathan what’s, the what’s that pathfinders name and what’s the name of that video, the finders name is steven she’s seo bamboo in-kind and actually for your listeners just to remind them all our videos are free and you can use them. You can download them you can embed them on your own website used for training program where they wish to do it. We appreciate it if you let us know, but there’s no obligation to do that, and you can either do that at our web site, where you could just go to our future channel. Okay? And your website of courses i the letter i on poverty dot tv um, this site also add mulesoft search engines so you can search for them by topic. Bonem and we always appreciate everyone’s feedback because we’re new, and we’re learning how to do this now. Jonathan, i got to tell you now, a search engine that’s pretty standard stuff. You don’t that’s like that’s like pointing out today that a car has fuel injection. Yeah, theo, corporations have gone the search engines air common, you know that people are gonna expect that your i had a guest a couple weeks go call me a troubled ight because i didn’t know that flash mob. I wasn’t sure the flash mob that everybody knew what a flash mob is, but he was he insisted, edited. So i got a truck. It was like one of the well, yeah, yeah, but it’s suggests that you know, you’re living in the wrong age and i’m not saying that you’re living in the wrong age. I’m just saying search engines or common that’s all it is. I don’t think that’s a leading. I don’t know. I guess i don’t think that’s a leading feature for your sight that you have a search engine. I think the leading features you have over one hundred of these videos right? Then you say that. Okay, cool. Um, let’s. See, we have just a few minutes left, and i want to talk a little on the it’s on the non ion poverty dot tv side. You and your son are big fans of hot dogs. And you list on your site a place that i know extraordinarily well. I’m going to know more about this place than you do. And i’ll tell you why in a minute ruts hut in clifton, new jersey so so mentioned just explain that we have a couple minutes, so don’t go on at length because i have other things i wanna talk to you about. But so you and you, you and your son love hot dogs. Your rating. Hot dog stands. What is it about ruts hut in clifton, new jersey that you love is one of our top five. In the country, they do a written something called a ripper, where they deep fat, fried the hot dog until the skin rips apart. They have their own secret special relish sauce and it’s right on the edge of a freeway. So you get the entire hot dog eating experience. Yes. Heart attack, great taste and a really bad you and it’s known it’s, known by truck drivers. Because it’s on the intersection of route three and i think it’s twenty one and what i know about it. Shoot only two minutes left. When when, when i was young, we used to go to the dentist in rutherford, new jersey. And when i had a good report from the dentist, which i always did, by the way, fifty years old have no cavities. Not a single today. No one can know. But when i got a good report, which i always did, my parents would take me to right side and i would get the deep, fat fried hot dog. Absolutely. And this blood. Your radio well lead to my afro sclerosis and high ldl. No high ldl concentrations. What actually lead to. But you think you could get american? Cardiology underwrite your i need more medical professionals listening. Actually, we have a one minute left. Tell me why you love this work. What is it about eye on poverty that just makes you wake up every morning? But out? What i care about most deeply is economic just and with three billion people living on two dollars, today around the world, we’re not getting his problems solved until we mobilize, and it gave a much larger dahna political and energised constituency. I don’t mean political and sense of political activity, but people who are engaged in a civic public square and i just have a very, very hopeful about this generation. I think they embody terrific used their naturally collaborative. They don’t think of the world in terms of traditional national boundaries, they’re they’re mostly color blind that they see people for who they are. They don’t put up with any inauthentic conversation, the real and the raw, and they’re full of energy and they want to make a difference, and i just find that very hopeful. And at my age in life, i know i’m not gonna live to see the end of non-profit i’m not going to see the dawn of an economic just in our time, but i believe that this generation will take us there. Jonathan louis, thank you so much for being a guest. My pleasure. Right now, we take a break when we come back. It’s, tony’s, take two, and then maria simple, the prospect. Find her public info on private companies. Stay with me, e-giving anything tooting, getting ding, ding, ding, ding. You’re listening to the talking alternative network, waiting to get a drink. E-giving cubine hi, i’m donna and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life will answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s two one two seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you! You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Durney i’m chuck longfield of blackbaud. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. More live listener love, ridgewood, new york, traverse city, michigan and abroad vaki, india. Beijing, china taipei, taiwan. Tokyo, japan. Fukuoka, japan. And nanjing, china all listening welcome live listener love after all those cities and countries. Tony stick to my block this week is researcher bias in the stelter planned e-giving report stelter is a company that does more helps charities do ah marketing and communications around planned e-giving and a lot of what they offer is website development for planned giving printed direct mail pieces, email campaigns and this new plan giving report that they have out suggests that there are there’s a broader pool of plan giving prospects than we’ve traditionally thought, and they’re encouraging the conclusions in this report encourage charities to reach out to people in their forties about planned e-giving typically and traditionally we’ve been doing plan giving research, starting our outreach starting around age fifty five and over. Um, and my concern is that there’s a bias because a bigger press, a bigger prospect pool around planned e-giving means more potential business for this delta company because plan giving outreach is what a lot of their businesses, their conclusions may be correct, i’m not i’m not saying that reaching out to forty somethings around plan giving is wrong. Their conclusions may be completely correct. My point is, and you’ll read this in the post that we can’t be sure that their conclusions are correct because there’s a bias in their study and that is on my block at tony martignetti dot com the posters called researcher bias in stealth airplane giving import and that is tony’s take two for friday, november ninth, the forty seventh show of the year you all know maria simple she’s, the prospect finder she’s, a trainer and speaker on prospect research. Her website is the prospect finder dot com and her book is panning for gold. Find your best donor prospects now exclamation mark! You can follow maria on twitter she’s at maria simple and i’m very pleased to welcome her back to the show. Maria hello. Welcome. Hi, tony. How are you today? I’m doing. Terrific. Welcome back. Thank you. Were talking about information that you can find on private companies. Why is private company information valuable to charities? Well, you know, i think so many boards and even, you know, non-profit executives themselves seemed to focus. On a lot of the larger corporations in their communities, in terms of outreach for support, and i think they’re they’re missing a tremendous opportunity with the business owners who are perhaps of the entrepreneurs in the community, very community minded, by the way, and have an opportunity to really reach out to those businesses that might be flying under the radar, so to speak. So finding the information on the the private companies does take a little bit more digging, but it’s not altogether impossible, so i thought we might just focus on that a little bit today. Okay? Eso these air, you’re you’re focused really is on smaller, privately held companies. We’re not talking about a billion dollars, like private equity equity funds or something that a privately held that’s correct. We’re talking about the small commit size businesses on dh, you know, everybody kind of defined that a little bit differently, really, when you’re talking about cos somebody might say, oh, well, small business might be something with, you know, under five hundred thousand dollars in sales in another person’s eyes small business might be no one to five million dollars the point here being that most of them are privately held, and, uh, when you were doing the research on the company’s, very often, that leads to us doing research similar to what we would do for a major gift prospect as an individual, because very often we’re getting two family owned companies, companies that have bin, you know, where the founder is, eyes currently still with the company, or perhaps it is passed to the next generation, and so we’re you know, we’re looking at them as as a company, but also as who are those individuals behind those companies? Okay, i’m going to w the doi n of dirt cheap resource is and free resource is because, you know, that’s? Absolutely, because you always come with low cost or free resource is for doing prospect research, which i love and perfect for our for our listeners. So let’s get started. What? What are some sites? Summary sources. Okay, well, one of the favorites that i like to use i actually access right through a database that i have accessible through my local library. So very often a great starting point is for you to check out what’s available through your local libraries very often. You might have to go to more of a county library altum um, but if you chief you go to the website of your libraries, you’ll see that they’ll have a certain amount of online databases some you need to go to the library to actually use, but some you can use off site. One of those databases is called reference yusa some people might know it is info usa, i do believe they’re the same company. Um and so this is available through libraries for free, for research, so i wouldn’t recommend as a small to midsize non-profit that you go directly to reference usa because it is available through so many libraries, and when you can do is if you know the name of a company, surely you can put in the name of the company or the name of the executive and do some research. We’ll give you some sales. Ah, number of employees, what line of work there in some executive names, but you can also come up with, and we’ve talked about this before proactive research, so coming up with perhaps lists of prospective companies that you might want to reach out to so let’s say it’s an example. You are a charity that serves somewhere in the health care maybe your health center, local health center. And you would like to find out who the other companies are in the community that also make medical devices are, or in pharmaceuticals things of that nature, anything related to the medical profession you can actually do with search by county, by state, by city, um and put in what is called an s i c code. Now don’t throw me into jail yet. Okay. First of all, it’s called jargon jail it’s not just jail, it’s not just this is not ordinary jail. This is joking. You’ll explain what an s i c code is happening. Industrial class. I knew that, by the way, but okay. So that’s a code of just what? What type business? Somebody’s somebody’s in writing there’s thousands of different codes. That’s, right? So you can actually search by code and find out and, you know, of course it’ll he’ll give you the code you put in the type of company you’re looking for. I’ll give you the code. So, you know reference librarians are ready to help you and doing this. Type of research. So really, they can be your best friends in trying to figure out how to use reference yusa and you can come up with a wonderful list of prospects and some, you know, very good basic information on the companies. Maria, what we’re going to find if we just go to reference, use a dotcom, you have to pay for it there if you go directly yourself, you know, i’ve never tried it, but i do think it is all i think it’s all right? Yeah. Okay. But of course is you said, you know, it’s free and libraries. All right, so i would i would just check out safe. Your library has that because, again, you can probably access it from your own death. Top simply by using the bar code on your library card latto log into your library. Interesting. You’ll find out at your library. Okay. Very interesting. Uh, what else you got? Well, another good source of information is really local news sources on dh, sometimes specifically sources that covered the business sector. So, for example, in new york, you’ve got crane’s, new york here in new jersey, we have a publication called nj biz what about fargo, north dakota? Yeah, i mean, you could. What you should do is find out what the business publication is that covers your state. Sometimes it would be a regional publication. I know there’s like a philadelphia business journal, that type of thing. So you would want to look again here. A reference by burning could be very useful to you. And just finding out what are the business publications or business newspapers for our state. And they’ll be able to point point, you’re right in the right direction. I want to make sure we take care of our fargo north dakota podcast listeners? Absolutely. Absolutely. So, you know, what you would want to look for is those stories that are very often even in a down economy. These types of publications will be covering those successful business owners, right? So they’re trying to, you know, seldman good news as well. So when a business owner is being interviewed by a newspaper executives covering the business industry, they will very often open up about the history of the company. Maybe give you some ideas about where the company is going sometimes. It’s hard to find sales. Information on a company and during an interview process they may say, well, you know, last year our company did ten million in sales were projected to do twelve million in sales this year things of that nature, yeah, so you can find out some good bits of information from them. And also these business publications for the state have, um, books of lists, for example, that they’ll put together. I know that as a subscriber to nj is i get on annual compiling called book of lists, so they do cover both private and public companies in these lists and it’s done by sector, so they’ll have, you know, the top accounting firms, top pharmaceuticals, etcetera, so those lists can be very useful because they will give you a ll that general benchmark information that you’re looking for on a business, sales employees, you know how well they’re doing and that sort of thing the’s air, excellent resource is that i don’t think people are thinking about for prospect research, and you and i have talked about going to a library in previous shows what i’m i’m just going, oh, i got to send live listen love to seoul. Korea maur ah, man, we’re really getting the asian, um continent is is really doing very well. Seoul, korea live listener love, welcome. I’m just gonna ask what? What else? What else you got? Doi n well, i think that the, uh, state at the state level itself, okay, now we’re not talking about newspapers, but the states themselves very often will have business filings, so you can add usually access that information through going to your particular state itself. What i’ll do is after the show, tony, all post on your lengthen and facebook page, a resource that will give you a compilation of the secretary of state databases where they can access for their particular state. So are being just a way for them to just jump off into the state that they’re interested in researching, but very often you’ll have the various business filing. So while it’s not going to give you most of the time, it’s not going to give you sales figures and so forth for the state, if you have somebody that you’re researching and you suspect they may have some sort of company, some sort of interests in private companies elsie’s, etcetera, you could just look up their name in your state registration directories and find out again, and those are all online, and most of the time, they’re also free. Sometimes you’ve to pay for full report, but you can get a lot of basic information for free. We’re gonna take our break now, and when we return, of course would be a simple. We’ll still be with me, and we’ll keep talking about public info on private companies. Stay with us. Yeah, you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Treyz are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Oppcoll maria, i’m thinking that since these are local companies, that building personal relationships is going to be important, yes, very important. So when once you’ve you’ve been able to compile some lists of companies in your community, i think the best thing that you can do is actually have those circulated with key staff members involved in fund-raising especially, but also with your board and your board, particularly if you do have a board fund-raising or development committee in place, why not circulate the list because of what they might be able to do is make some introductions for you get you in the door? Maybe you’ve got gallons or our golf outings that you’re planning, so that would be an opportunity to reach out to some of these companies and seek sponsorship dollars that might be your way in the door to developing the relationship further, right? And we’ve had other other segments what one specifically i’m thinking of what about building that corporate relationship on about how it’s it’s start? It could start with sponsorships, but there’s all kinds of other possibilities volunteering, having having people from the company come and volunteer with the organization staffing for events, you know, a corporate relationship could be very diverse. Yeah, you’re absolutely right, tony. And, you know, again, here it goes back to who’s behind the company. How long have they been around? Is it a family run company? And so very often you’re going to find that they’re very community minded and it’s going to be much easier. Macon approach to these companies and develop relationships then though really large corporations in your communities that are going to require a much more sophisticated process in making your approach. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So generally the advice is don’t don’t forget the local guys. Oh, absolutely. I don’t know if you remember that book that was around that was written quite a number of years ago. Now it’s seems the millionaire next door. Yeah, sure. Right. And they talked about the people who are in those, you know, dull or or a normal type of businesses with stamp dealers, the coin dealers that the paving contractors, the plumbers, electricians and so forth and very often these are the people who are quietly building wealth in the community. They’re not flashy, right? That was the one thing they really covered. A lot in that book is that these people are are not living flashy lives. They might be living in a very modest home, but they’re building well and, you know, you do plan giving. I mean, you talk about, you know, that type of a person could be perfect in terms of a plan giving prospect there at the right age. Do you remember that book? But your reading comprehension is much better than mine? Oh, i think i talked about that book a lot. Get royalties from it is i mean, you know, it wasn’t written. The book was not really written for the nonprofit sector or fundraisers, but there’s certainly a lot to be cleaned. It was really written as a how to manual to becoming wealthy caesar. What wealthy people do so really goes into a lot of detail about profiling wealthy people. What other ideas do you have for finding out some some information before you start to talk to the these local? Well, well, you know, we can’t keep bringing this up in so many of your shows, but lengthen is a really good source. So again, here, if you are looking to connect with that person behind the company check out check out. They’re linked in profile. Very often the companies themselves will have a separate linked in business page that you would want to check out and see what’s going on. Um, another good resource that i recently came across is called glass door dot com. Okay, and so i was playing around with that one, and they give some basic information about the companies. But what kind of an interesting is they give reviews so it looks like maybe employees are very recent. Former employees give reviews about the company there’s sametz salary level information. So if you happen to know what particular title somebody holds within a company, you might be able to find information there. So they seem to cover quite a range of types of companies, a lot of public and private. But that might be an interesting resource for people to bookmark for themselves. Plus, you might find out some things about your prospects that maybe you’re not sure you want to know if if employees are putting, you know, putting their own comments about the company. Um, yeah, this is glass door, and you’d probably do it. In such a way where? I mean, they don’t give the name of the person they just kind of gives, you know, their former title x y z, you know, and then it’s the location of the company is glass door a pay site? Or is that free? It appears to be free from what i have, you know, all the things that i’ve been trying to do within her free. Okay, excellent glassdoor dot com we have just about two minutes left or so what? What you like, like there’s facebook possibilities do, right? Yeah, yeah, definitely more and more companies, especially small to midsize companies, are getting in on the social media revolution, if you will, by putting up facebook business pages. So certainly, but i would say that you should check out social media sites right before meeting with the company. So if you finally do get that appointment and get your foot in the door, check out what’s going on on social media that’s a really quick and easy way for them to make updates tow what’s going on, uh and there’s some great news that they want to share about their company, etcetera and it might just provide you with a fantastic talking point, something else? Maybe they share a great tip. Maybe you’re approaching an accounting firm and they provided some tips for year and tax planning. I don’t know, um, you know, you could just say, hey, i happen to notice on your facebook page that you have these great ten tips for pre-tax planning, i’m going to share it with my colleagues back at the office, you know, just the fact that you’ve demonstrated that you i looked into them, you’ve researched them enough, i think that’s going to flatter them or even just the latest vacation pictures. Yeah, well, i don’t know that companies are posting that. Oh, that’s true. We’re talking about the company’s facebook pages, okay? Yeah, because here we’re talking about the company that paid well, you could go to this. Could trust a friend. Somebody personal, right? What about the right now? We just have about thirty seconds left. But this interesting. What about looking at the persons in the person’s personal facebook page? Well, you can try and do that. It really all depends on how they have their private. They’re setting exactly be able to be very much at all. Okay, but yeah, i mean, this is, you know, this is an area of some controversy, if you will, within the prospect research community should we be looking at, you know, people facebook pages? Um but if they are set in such a way that they are public, if you will, they haven’t tightened up their privacy settings. You know, you get again if you can see the information again. If you see information, your gleaning is going to be valuable and cultivating and soliciting. So we’re not here to just gather random pieces of information. They have to be useful to fund-raising maria simple is the prospect. Find her you’ll find her at the prospect finder. Dot com and she’s, our monthly prospect research contributor maria, thanks so much. Thank you. Have a great day. My pleasure. Thank you. Next week, andrea nierenberg returns. She had so many good ideas on the october fifth show talking about new friends from events that i wanted her back. And she said yes. I was surprised, actually. But since you know she’s, not a pathfinder here’s, just a guest. But she said yes, and we’re going to talk next week about her thirty for things to know about people and i’m i’m wondering for some people one or two things made just be quite enough, it’s, but we’ll talk about the people who you want to know more more about. And also amy sample ward, our monthly social media contributor she’s, our social media scientist she’s going to be back she’s, the membership director of non-profit technology network and ten but her principal responsibility, of course, is to tony martignetti non-profit radio. We’re all over the social networks run linked in we’re in the facebook page, and then maria said she’ll post that list of st contacts on both and both those places you could follow me on twitter. You can use the hashtag non-profit radio you can listen to non-profit radio live or archive the archive you’ll find on itunes at non-profit radio dot net. I’m on foursquare. We can connect there wishing you good luck the way performers do around the world were still in sweden, where they lightly kick performers in the bud before they go onstage. No hands, please, and they say brita at ben britt at, then break a bone you could break any bone, maybe just a small one, maybe just like a risk bonem latto bone, those att least those toe bones they usually heal without without a cast. So hopefully it’s a small bone you’re breaking, and i’m wishing you for the week. Brit at ben new listeners again, welcome. I hope to have a bead on how many of people have joined us in the month of october. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is our line producer, and this shows social media is by regina walton of organic social media, the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. I hope you’ll be with me next week, either podcast or live at talking alternative dot com. Next friday, one to two p, m eastern. Dahna. You didn’t think to do good ending. You’re listening to the talking. Alternate network duitz getting anything. Take it cubine hi, i’m donna and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s two one two seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com we look forward to serving you. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you fed up with talking points? Rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time for action. Join me. Larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the isaac tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society, politics, business and family. It’s provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on? What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me. Very sharp. Your neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s ivory tower radio dot com everytime was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education listening. Tuesday nights, nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Talking dot com. Hyre

111: The Law Of Attraction & Private Benefits: Not Dirty, But Bad – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Melanie Schnoll Begun, managing director of Morgan Stanley Private Wealth Management

Emily Chan, attorney at the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations Law Group

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Dahna hi there, it’s. Tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on september twenty eighth twenty twelve i’m your aptly named host. I do hope you were with me last week. Yes, i do. It was a bonanza alliances remember we had the true italian roseanna imbriano principle of our eye consulting encouraged you to secure strategic alliances that expand your marketing and save your marketing budget because they cost you nothing and claire’s cliches. Claire meyerhoff returned she’s, principal of the planned e-giving agency creative director of this very show, we talked about cliches for you to avoid and simpler words to replace them with. I didn’t have the heart to put her in jargon jail because she created it this way. The law of attraction to attract a major gift prospects and potential board members, you have to put your best foot forward to get what you are seeking. Melanie schnoll begun is managing director at morgan stanley private wealth management. She helps her ultra high net worth clients make charitable gif ts and get on boards, but she also has practical and valuable experience and advice that applies to any charity soliciting. A major gift or recruiting a boardmember and this interview with melanie was originally aired on april twentieth, two thousand twelve. Show also private benefits not dirty, but bad rules against private in your mint i like that word in your mint. Yeah, private in your mint xs benefit transactions and private benefit we’re not thinking friends with benefits private benefits these things keep your charity operating for the public good. Emily chan from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group is our monthly legal contributor, and she will explain the rules between the guests on tony’s take two my block this week one more week still seven tips for small shop planned e-giving because i think it’s important and i’ll talk about one of those tips are you on twitter while you’re listening? You could be if you open up another window, don’t don’t close the window you’re listening on now because you’ll lose me, but if you want open up another browser window on twitter, you can join the conversation there using the hashtag non-profit radio we’re about to take a break and then we’re going to go right into my interview with melanie schnoll begun, but first i gotta send live listener love to takashi in japan. Takashi, japan, newport, rhode island, and minneapolis, minnesota. Live, listener love going out to all of you. Stay with me after this break, it’s. The law of attraction, co-branding think dick tooting getting stinking thing. You’re listening to the talking alternative network e-giving. Nothing. Cubine joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre. Awareness for two exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city. In pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller emotional freedom, and greg brayden will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve, save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot order, or h a n j dot net. Hi, i’m donna, and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family, court, co, parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more. Dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever. Join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten am on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Schnoll durney welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on tony martignetti non-profit radio with me now is melanie schnoll begun. She is a managing director and head of morgan stanley private wealth, management’s philanthropic services. She serves as a philanthropic advisor to families, foundations and family offices, working with the firm’s, ultra high net worth clients. She’s, the incoming board president of the juvenile diabetes research foundation of new york and bored treasure of the partnership for philanthropic planning. My show has been a sponsor at there. National conference on philanthropic planning the past two years. I’m very pleased that her work and her expertise brings her to the show. Melanie schnoll begun welcome. Thank you so much, tony. Just one correct that’s why i’m the current oh, you’re the could hurt the president of the board of juvenile diabetes research funding. I have to say that because the topic today that we’re gonna be talking about if i didn’t correct you about my party particular officer position on a board, i wouldn’t be selling the reason why i said or or why i think it’s so important to serve for constance he believe in so this is why i need an intern we’ve built you and i would both blame the intern, and it wouldn’t have reflected on you badly at all. What is your work around with ultra high net worth individuals? What are you doing with them? Well, i think that my work is providing meaning in their life. Many of our clients come to us because they’re in the middle of a transition. Perhaps they’ve sold their business, maybe there’s some interesting event that’s happened in their life, perhaps even a very sad event. That’s happened their life, and we help them identify how to be very strategic, purposeful and planned in there, giving for many clients when they think about making a contribution, even a large contribution, they don’t put a tremendous amount of thought into it. It might be a cause that they’ve heard about maybe one that they’re associated with, but they’re not doing a deep dive into the background and the backdrop of what’s really going on in that non-profit organization or what else there might be out there in the world, so we try and provide that professionalism, and then along the way, make our clients professionals. Themselves. What? What? What do you find motivates ultra high net worth and shortly, i’m gonna ask you, what is ultra high net worth? But we’ll work our way to that. But what do you think motivates their giving? Well for some clients, it’s because someone sick in their family for other clients, it’s because they’re say little more about that someone sick where the e-giving in memory of the person soon will be a memory will hopefully to find a cure. Hopefully the final work usually clients witness a major keynes in their attitude. What they used to buy with their wealth no longer becomes important and that’s because the second that someone has a diagnosis in their family of someone who’s ill the only thing they’re thinking about is identifying better treatment and perhaps secure. So we find often that we come to the philanthropic table with someone who has just been given that diagnosis scammer and is looking for the solution where so many of us just our resource is we go to the web and we learn as much as we can, but when we’re talking about people with extraordinarily extraordinary wealth that can actually invested. In a possible cure that’s what they want to buy it, they want to buy the cure. I think what’s shocking and disappointing in many instances is that clients, no matter how wealthy they are, find out that they can’t necessarily buy everything. So it is that deep investment for the long term, perhaps not even for the benefit of their family member who might be ill but for others to find a cure better treatment. Better resource is that might bring some of our clients to the table. Others are just deeply invested in their community. They want better cultural organizations. They want better education for their kids. Certainly in new york, that’s a very big issue about private school, public school. And as your children are going through that educational problem situation, where are there enough of fine schools in new york to send our kids to? In many instances, they find that they that there’s not so. Our clients are interested in identifying. How can they be the solution to the educational drama issue? We have just a couple minutes before break. What? What what’s the definition of ultra high net worth. What is how much money? Are we talking about, well, a lot more money than i have? I’ve always said that i really hope to one day be able to be my own client, but for us, ultra high net worth is really defined as clients who have a net worth of twenty five million and more. The reality is that it’s a very open span for those clients, though, with twenty five million and mohr, they usually have a significant out a significant amount of money that they could do something incredibly impactful with their philantech, um, on how much i’m wondering, how much does somebody who has that kind of wealth walk around within their wallet, like, like i have typically, like thirty or forty dollars in my wallet, but so i would probably not be confused for ultrahigh worth of net worth. If someone stole my wallet, i probably wouldn’t i probably couldn’t get away with that, but, you know, like, how much do you think they have just on an average day in the well, how much do you think that carry around? Probably probably no cash. I think that i think that most about very wealthy people typically put most their stuff on cards today. So you know what? Actually, i would go after your wallet if i knew that you were on the street. So just watch thirty or forty bucks, so i was ready. I was ready to go, like, three or four hundred in my wallet, and then it almost be worth it to lose that much if i could get two muggers to think that i’m ultra high net worth. Yeah, yeah. Now they would share the story of the ultra high net worth guy, you know, among their prison friends. And i could, you know, get known that way. But i’m going about it the wrong way. You got to go down so well, no cash. Now, we need to talk about prison reform as faras labbate. Right? So so how can you make sure that those who come out of prison then are better off than when they went in and are telling the story of twenty martignetti being ultra? Yeah, absolutely. We have to take a break when we return. Of course melanie schnoll begun stays with me, and we’ll continue talking about the law of attraction. So i hope you stay with us talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology, no reality, in fact, its ideology over intellect, no more it’s time, join me, larry shop, a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what’s important to you society, politics, business, it’s, provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to know what’s, really going on. What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me, larry. Sure you’re neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s, ivory tower radio, dot com e every time i was a great place to visit both entertainment and education listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven. It will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back to tony martignetti non-profit radio. My guest is melanie schnoll begun, and melanie let’s talk about it. When charity’s air trying to solicit gif ts you have your clients who are ultra high net worth, but you have, i think, very valuable advice for any charity that’s trying to solicit any major gift, which maybe five hundred dollars or thousand dollars for some charities. What what’s your you see sort of faulty proposals a lot, don’t you? Yeah, i think that non-profits believe they understand who the donor is, and they prepare something in advance. That’s a critical error, you never know who that donor is, the famous saying. If you’ve met one philanthropist, you’ve met one philanthropist, so we try and tiki non-profits to perform a radical listening, and that means spending the time to really understand why a donor may want to be a donor to their organization. The time will be incredibly valuable both for the non-profit but even more importantly, for the donor, when a donor has the opportunity to talk about what they care about, why they care about the organization’s mission, you hear things you really hear things inside of that conversation inside the conversation in the donor’s hat so radical listening is a skill that we teach non-profits to practice. And that skill is something that serves both board members. It serves the staff of non-profit organizations, and at the end, you’re really giving a service to a donor. I think that most of my clients find that no one listens to them well enough. Yeah, but but a charity that’s that’s soliciting a major gift. However they define that might feel that they’re not going to get another meeting with this person. They go one shot. We finally got the meeting. We got forty five minutes. Way better. We’ve got to lay it all out because we may never get a second meeting that’s, right? So you walk into every meeting with the idea that if i really listen to this donor, i’m going to get the second meeting. If you walk in with a proposal thinking that you know who this person is and what they want to offer your organization, you’re probably guaranteeing yourself that you’re not going to see that donor again. So does it always work? It may not always work if you begin practicing it. Well, if you spend so much time performing discovery on that donor both in the dance of the meeting and then, while you’re sitting at that meeting, i think over time you’ll find that your practice as a fundraiser will dramatically improve. So you’re suggesting that if you can move the donor while while radically listening, then you’ll get a follow-up meeting brightstep my suggestion is, if you are performing radical listening, you will move the donor, okay, okay, even without introducing your mission and your work in the first in the first meeting, right? Because you’re going to hear from the donor what the donor wants to dio instead of telling the donor with a non-profit wants the donor and you do know there’s a threshold interest, otherwise you wouldn’t have gotten the first meeting would have gotten the meeting would have gotten the meeting. So it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s an important skill it’s something that has been written about andi, i think that we can’t live in that fear fundraisers can’t live in that fear that this is joan, or will not be interested in talking to me again. In fact, most of the conversation is not a conversation most of the conversation is letting that ultra high network don’t talk to you, and you’re just there. To listen or again, it could be any level donor, and i’ve had where we have a regular prospect. Research contributor maria simple is on, and she and i have talked about the value of the face to face meetings, and she’s a professional prospect researcher who knows all the web webb resource is, you know, but she still recognizes that the greatest prospect research comes from a good, good conversation, absolutely and and and and he’s absolutely right face-to-face looking the donor in their eyes. In many instances, i think being on the donor’s being in the donor’s territory so a place where they’re comfortable, where it’s an environment either their office, they’re home, maybe somewhere where they’ve recommended that they like to go for coffee. Usually i recommend going for a glass of wine because, you know, does it doesn’t hurt, but her loosen up? Yeah, exactly. I’ve tried to get sam lee boards to have wine here, but he’s not doing it now you’re not really radical listening, right? I just radically demand thanks, you know, but i’m not a charity, so i think i’m exactly only have third example, everything was but you only have thirty. Dollars you’re while you are charity ticket, you can’t get a decent bottle of wine for thirty bucks. So then the careful listening radical listening is goingto inform your valuable proposal when that when it’s the right time, that’s, right meds and the valuable proposal some hints that we give to non-profits as they’re preparing that that proposal brief three points know what are the key issues that you’ve heard? The donor has said to you, the areas where they’re really interested in supporting on ly talk about those areas, right? Putting in a proposal for stuff that you haven’t heard because the organization needs it, but the donor doesn’t want it what’s the likelihood of that getting funded so three typically are the most that we suggested a proposal going backto a donor that you know what they’re interested in, you’re going to get a much better response. Bilich other tips for the for the proposal itself for the written document, you brief couple pages, right? A couple of pages in fact, most of our clients today, they don’t want to read stuff, right? And they fear that if the non-profit is spending so much time and resource is preparing proposals, then they may not be spending the money that i’m giving to the organization i’m doing. The work so in many instances, it’s brief short. In fact, non-profit should ask the donor. How would you like me to prevent to present a proposal? Is it isn’t even something that you want in writing? Or should we just have another conversation? I would welcome that second conversation so that now the second meeting, the donors prepared to do their own radical listening, right? Is there a problem? Sometimes when a donor gets sort of passed off from somebody who knows the work very well to the fund-raising professional who’s goingto the closer it’s like it’s, like in a in a car dealership going to which i have very bad memories of a child. Buying my first car was awful, but at a car dealership going from the salesmen to the finance manager exactly going that office and the door gets closer, you know, but being passed from the maybe the executive director or someone who knows the work well to the closer, the fundraiser doesn’t something get lost there sometimes. Yeah. What? What gets lost is the gift. So no one wants to be handed off everyone in that non-profit organization, both from voluntary leadership to professional. Staff should be able to talk about programming if the executive director is the one who has contact with that donor. If it’s a boardmember who has the contact with that donor, or if it is the professional fundraiser that has the contact with that donor, the conversation could be between those two people bringing others include others in the conversation. But don’t hand a donor. Roth. I have ah ah, client situation that happened with a large university hospital. Incredible organization doing tremendous work. And this client’s unfortunately this this medical institution was not able to save the life of our client’s husband. But he wanted to honor him. She wants to memorialize him. And the doctor who was treating her husband was the individual that he wanted to leave a contribution for. So that he could continue doing the great work that he began with her clothes with her with her husband. Many of the conversations happened between her and the doctor. It was intimate. She could see clearly what she wanted to accomplish. And then when it came down to the clothes, she was handed to a development director. Ah, fine development director. Someone who’s spent years. In the business. But it was so disconnected and she felt that were there. Were you there for the meeting? So i was there after the fact also, i came in to help save the gift. Okay? And we this this donor-centric working with us after he felt that brush off from the doctor and it was completely unintentional. So totally unintentional. It’s just protocol just about innocuous handing off. But it’s, the way things are done, he wasn’t supposed to close that’s someone else’s responsibility. So what? I teach both boards as well as professional staff, it’s, everyone’s, responsibility clothes. If you’re the one who has the relationship, you need to be confident enough to make the ask. And you need to be prepared enough too close. And if it’s, i guess if it’s a really technical gift which it could be a large dollar amounts, then at least include the in your case, the doctor but generally the program the work expert in the conversations don’t leave him or her out in the hall while now the professional closer, you know, goes through his is her stick that’s, right? And you know it. The attorneys thie accountants all the financial advisor’s. All of those professionals need to play a role in the process if the donor wants him to be included in the conversations about the specifics of the gift that’s great, but there’s the technical aspects of giving and then there’s the emotional aspects of giving and what i see getting lost. It’s, it’s, it’s never technique, right? You could draft a perfect trust. It could be absolutely accurate. The document itself could get an a plus plus in any fine law school. But if the donor is not connected emotionally to the gift, it doesn’t matter what the document says. Melanie schnoll begun is managing director, head of morgan stanley, private wealth, management’s philanthropic services and we’re talking about the law of attraction basically had a look good when you’re either soliciting a gift or soliciting someone for boardmember ship, which is what i’d like tio transition to now, okay, appealing to a board appealing to a potential boardmember. Since you’re working with ultra high net worth people, i’m going to guess that sometimes there approached because they’re very wealthy. And how do they feel about that? Yeah, so in the law of attraction, it’s it’s rarely because they’re really good looking now. Many of them might be hot tonight, but it’s usually because they’re wealthy so similar to the idea of marriage. Right? So when i got married, i married for love. I married for looks there’s, you know there’s a little bit of money to that’s all so that’s, always wonderful when you think that before you can say sex on the show is this the part where you were thinking of coming? It’s coming, it’s coming, it’s coming sex is you have to have a little foreplay before sex. So it’s getting there russia you’re right. That’s been my problem. You’re russian it you’re as well among others, but let’s keep it let’s. Keep it focused on alt-right network from latto let’s. Take this conversation on the bed here. Right? Right, right. So the opportunity of creating a marriage between a potential boardmember and an organization it’s incredibly important. So the the reason donors believe that? Serving a non-profit is an appropriate step for them is because they’ve been courted well, it’s, because they find the organization incredibly attractive and good looking it’s because they want to spend a lot of time with that organization because they want to see that organization grow and really achieve incredible impact very similar to marriage alive know the problem with marriage is is half the men in divorce, so the same is true with non-profit port service, you’re excited at the beginning, right? You can’t wait for that next kiss can’t wait for the next date and then quickly within the first year, if the non-profit doesn’t really know how to work well, play well, dine the donor well doesn’t understand where they like to go to how they like to vacation. If the non-profit doesn’t know how to use the donor to his or her maximum capacity, they get bored, they get disenchanted and the worst thing is donors cheats like just like what happens in many families that fall apart, they begin looking at other opportunities that really do want them thinking that it’s better on the other side there feeling remorse about having joined this board. Everything was great in the beginning that right? The honeymoon stage, but about exactly right, exactly right? So spend your time non-profit should spend their time thinking about whether or not this is a person they want to marry. Is this a person that will bring value to this relation? Can we grow together? And what do we each bring to the relationship? It has to be more than just money again, just like many families, right? If all you’re going after is the wealth than a marriage for many, many years will fall apart, you know the boardmember potential boardmember wants to know that they’re going to be used effectively. That’s right? You’ve utilized way. Don’t use board members. We usually large numbers. Okay. Okay. Um, taking over the show? No. She, um let’s. See, so but a lot of times, board charities need an expertise. We need an accountant or we feel we need an attorney. And in some specialty real estate, maybe or something. So they’re seeking that profession. But that is contrary to what you’re recommending. Right? So i think what boardmember sze need to be on? What boards need to do to get the right. People on their team is they have to look for people different than themselves. What happens with most non-profit boards is you look around the board table and everyone’s the same right, because it’s, a friend introducing another friend. They come from similar backgrounds, specially smaller charity it’s, a friend of the executive director of the founder, absolutely especially small non-profits and specifically, when they’re getting off the ground, right. So it’s, the founder, it’s, the founders best friend, its founder, sister, and perhaps someone who worked for them at one point time or an intern. So non-profits really need to think about how can we bring true diversity to our board? Professionalizing aboard must include accountants, financial advisors, lawyers, but you can’t just look at them as a lawyer, you need to look at them as a lawyer that has a mission that there interest must be tethered, if not tied to the nonprofit organization, that they’re a lawyer that’s their skill set. But ultimately we know that even if they weren’t a lawyer, that they really support the work of that organization. I wantto have you bring something out that we had talked about that very wealthy people are not un interested in working for smaller midsize working among being utilized by small and midsize charities. Is that right? Absolutely. I think that many very wealthy clients believe that they can be better utilised in a small nonprofit organization. In fact, that’s where most of their money came from. So the majority of our client base started their own closely held businesses. And they realise what it means to rule up their sleeves to get dirty. They love that kind of opportunity and nonprofit organizations. So when you come into these large non-profit organizations very bureaucratic, very political. So many individuals that look like them. So it is even mohr attractive for wealthy people to see that you know, my gift. We’ll make a significant difference here, but my time may even be more valuable. Tulani schnoll begun is a managing director and head of morgan stanley. Private wealth, management’s philanthropic services. Melanie, thanks very much for being in the studio. Being a guest, tony. Thanks for having me. It’s. Been a pleasure. Got more live listener love tokyo. Welcome. Seoul, south. Korea. Welcome and chandler, arizona, also, and from minneapolis, my thoughts are with you, the very tragic shooting just yesterday. Very sad thinking about you in minneapolis, minnesota. Now we take a break, and when we return, tony’s take to stay with me. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre. Awareness for two exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city. In pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller, emotional freedom, and greg brady will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot order or a nj dot net. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three that’s to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Duitz no. Schnoll hi, i’m kate piela, executive director of dance, new amsterdam. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Time now for tony’s, take two and then after that, it will be emily chan. We’ll be talking about private benefits not dirty, but bad on tony’s take two for my blogged this week is what i mean to be saying i kept up seven tips for small shop planned giving an extra week because i think small shops need encouragement and it’s important. And one of the one of the seven that i’ll talk about this week is just start simple. I had made the point last week that there is great opportunity for small shops and that you shouldn’t be intimidated by planned e-giving the best place to start is very simple gif ts charitable bequests in people’s will and everybody needs a will. Everybody understands what a will is on dh for some small, real small charities that might be the place to stop you might that might be your whole plan’s e-giving program encouraging bequests in a will. If you want to go a little further, you can encourage people to name you as a beneficiary of life insurance policies or their ira or pension. These are all those those air, very simple, being named as a beneficiary. You just encourage your, um your prospects to fill out a change of beneficiary form that they get from the company that administers there, ira or pension, whatever it is it’s very, very simple to do so. One of the seven tips that’s on my block is start simple and my blog’s is that tony martignetti dot com that is tony’s take two for friday, the twenty eighth of september and the forty first show of the year before. Before i bring in emily chan, i gotta send live listener love to my hometown. Well, my current town, new york, new york. Thank you. Finally, we don’t get too many listeners from new york. Where is everybody? Emily chan is a attorney and she is an attorney at neo-sage non-profit and exempt organizations law group, which is in san francisco. She’s, also a principal contributor to the non-profit law blawg she’s, the american bar association’s twenty twelve outstanding young non-profit lawyer i’m anxious to see what she’s going to do in twenty thirteen. You can follow her on twitter at emily chan and i’m very glad that she is one of the regular contributors to the show emily welcome. How are you? I’m doing great. Gene is not going to be with us this week right now. He’s in baltimore right now, working with one of our clients. Okay, so i have ah, costello, but no abbott that’s. All right. Um, we’re talking about private benefits in a moment, but first we want to wrap up a little bit about fiscal sponsorships. There’s a little more. You wanted to leave listeners with from from last month? Yeah, just to wrap it up, i think there’s maybe three things that i want to remind listeners about with physical sponsorship. We were able to talk about it in that short amount of time, but it is a very complicated concept, and more often than not, we see people doing it wrong as opposed to write. So if i have three tips for non-profits, that would be one. Definitely. Do your homework. You get that other one. Give me the cold in book on six weeks to do it right. I read about it. Talk to people to make sure that your organization has a process for oversight. That’s a big area where we see organizations dropping the ball. They just practically speaking can’t do it. And then finally, if you are going to enter into physical sponsorship agreement, make sure you get that contract review because that’s defying everything and all of your rights and the terms and conditions that both parties are agreeing to. Thanks very much, emily. Okay, we want to make sure we set the stage correctly for people on fiscal sponsorship now with private benefits. What are we’re not talking about friends with benefits, my innuendo? Because, you know, that’s just the way i think, for some reason, what are we? What are we concerned about with respect to private benefits? Private benefit is really one of the core concept for public charities because they’re organized for charitable purposes for public purposes and deserved charitable classes. So there’s actually three rules that helped to govern organizations to make sure that they’re in compliance with the federal tax laws and keeping there five, twenty three tax exemption, the three rolls are the private benefit doctrine, the private interment doctrine. And then finally, the access benefit transaction roll some hoping today we can just do a kind of a primer on these three rules to give organizations of better understanding about maybe some areas where they’re starting to tiptoe into violation. Okay, it’s. Interesting. You say primer? I say i always say primer, you know, that’s interesting i could do to short out. You do long i interesting. I don’t know which okay, maybe depends where you go to law school. I don’t know. Where did you go to law school. You see hastings, you see hastings university? Okay. I went to philadelphia temple. So could be a different philosophy thing. Maybe prime ing and priming. Ok, let’s, stay prim and proper when our prime ing and priming and talk about the private benefit doctrine what is what is that one? So this is the broadest rule in its applicability. It’s really? Just saying that in order to be organized exclusively and operated primarily for your exam purposes, you need to serve public purposes as opposed to private interests. So what this mean, really? Some examples would be entering into unfavorable or unreasonable contracts with third parties. It may be serving too small. The class of beneficiaries. Okay, wait, wait. Let’s, let ze unpack this little bit for listeners so unfavourable or unreasonable contracts. What? What does that? What does that look like? You? Yeah, so for example, paying more than fair market value for goods and services. Okayo are agreeing to certain terms and conditions that are just to the detriment of the organization, really giving more to that third party than the organization is getting in return. Okay? And that could be any any vendor doesn’t have tto be anybody who has a relationship to the we’re going to get to those but doesn’t have to have any relationship to the charity at this point right in this in-kind benefits and that’s quite the private benefit rules really the broader because we’re talking about any person, just any person out there saying that you cannot serve their private interests. You really deserve that public interest, okay, right, you’re enriching them unreasonably, and so your public benefit is being eroded, right? And it’s currently the iris acknowledges, though you know with e-giving public benefit, there may be some private interests that benefit from that. So the key for the private benefit doctrine is that any private interests that are served, they need to be incidental. So thie irs looks at it both on it qualitative perspective and saying it’s just a byproduct of serving that public benefit as well, quantitative so that private interests being served needs to be in a substantial amount as compared to the public benefit on an example would be an organization chooses to help with the restoration of a lake for public use. Yeah, and there’s certain properties that live around the lake, those properties are going to increase in value if that lake is improved. But that’s a byproduct of fixing this lake so that the public can come in and use it as a public space. And when they compare it, then hopefully thie value that’s being given to these homeowners that live on the lake, hopefully insubstantial as compared to the public benefit that’s being served by fixing this lake. Okay, way sent. I sent live listener love out to minneapolis, minnesota. That could apply right there because it’s, the land of ten thousand lakes that’s very timely example. Very, very bright. You see, hastings, very good law school. You’re the outstanding young attorney in two thousand twelve, so i’m not surprised at all. You’d make that connection. Okay, so is this. So this is sort of related to ensure ensuring your exam purpose the same as what the irs does when they initially evaluate whether you’re entitled to a tax exempt five oh one c three status, right? This is just sort of same evaluation, but ongoing absolutely and so for organizations out there that are applying for their toxic status, private benefit is a big red flag for the irs in delaying the application or maybe even a denial of exemption. So it’s important to understand this when you’re developing your programs and you’re describing it on your application and also thinking into the future about how you’re going to operate, right? It’s not it’s, not enough to just do it at the outset, meet meet, meet the criteria in the beginning, get your approval and then lose. Lose, i guess lew’s mission focus. Really? I mean, you are supposed to be a public charity, right? Public benefit. Ok. And the organization’s record on this well on their annual information returns so that’s another area that even after they get their exemption, that they need to be cognizant of this rule, and understand that their programs need teo being compliant with this doctrine. So it’s part of the form nine ninety or the nine. Ninety easy there’s an explicit question are you serving? Would say no to that? Yeah, the questions they ask, though, certainly can reveal those types of facts. So when you describe your mission or you describe your biggest program on these are the things that will come up also looking at payments, you know what parties do you have contracts with? What kind of relationship you have with them? All of this information just kind of comes out through the form because it asked so many questions. Okay, interested? I want to send live listener love teo someone who joined us from brisbane, australia live love look live love going out to brisbane. Emily, there is, uh, anything else you want to say about the private benefit doctrine that that broadest of the three, i think that’s i think that’s a good start. You feel you’ve exhausted that. Ok, ok, i’m not exhausted. I’m not saying i’m exhausted. I’m just exhausted the topic way, tio. Now you have the prohibition against private in your mint. I like that word in your mitt spelled with an area of course in your mint is that? How you would say in your mentor, do you say in norman? And you would say in your mind, okay, i thought, maybe hastings, you say it differently than, like primary dreamer. Ok, what’s this what’s, this mean private in your mint? So this this doctrine actually comes from the language in five twenty three of the internal revenue code, which says that no part of him, that earnings of the exempt organization can unearth the benefit of any private shareholder or individuals in your and your to benefit right private, individual or shareholder. Okay. In other words, it means that the organization cannot give a disproportionate share of benefit, too. Specific people and what’s different about this rule on the main difference from the private benefit rules. But it’s looking at just a specific group of people what they call insiders, which are persons who are in a position to exercise significant influence over the organization. So directors the officers and directors right? Sanders to write. And so the most common example of where these problems who comes up is with excessive executive compensation because you’re giving a disproportionate share of benefit to someone who has significant this’s something that we see in the press in the in the popular press a lot. Where a million dollars, nine and a half dollars salaries. And meanwhile, the organization’s cutting the programs. Okay, i mean, it’s certainly an important issue, and it does make people very angry. And when they give their money to the station to find out that you know the disproportionate share going to insiders who have control over the organization but to give to be fair to it may not be a disproportionate share. Me, if it’s a big enough charity, a million dollars salary could be very well justified, right? Yeah, absolutely. Andi, we have just just, uh, let you know, we just have a minute before break or so okay. Um, and i just wanted to point out to there’s other ways that this comes up. For example, paying excessive red paying again less than fair market value for goods and services from an insider. The greg mortenson issue. With central asia institute. There’s. A lot of speculation about whether about organization violated private interment rules because they paid so much to support his book signings and, you know, the publication of his book. And there was a question of what did they actually get in return? There’s. Lots of ways that private interment can happen, even though what we see most commonly is executive compensation issues. All right, we’re going to take a break when we returned. Of course, emily chance days we listen, we keep talking about private benefits, not dirty, but back. Stay with us. Dahna hi, this is nancy taito from speaks been radio speaks been radio is an exploration of the world of communication, how it happens in how to make it it better because the quality of your communication has a direct impact on the quality of your life. Tune in monday’s at two pm on talking alternative dot com, where i’ll be interviewing experts from business, academia, the arts and new thought. Join me mondays at two p m and get all your communications questions answered on speaks been radio. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com how’s your game want to improve your performance? Focus and motivation. Then you need a spire athletic consulting stop, second guessing yourself. Move your game to the next level, bring back the fun of the sport, help your child build confidence and self esteem through sports. Contact dale it aspire, athletic consulting for a free fifteen minute power session to get unstuck. Today, your greatest athletic performance is just a phone call away at eight a one six zero four zero two nine four or visit aspire consulting. Dot vp web motivational coaching for athletic excellence aspire to greatness. Hey, hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com. Welcome back, emily there’s. No there’s, no rule against doing business with boardmember sze businesses though, right? Of course, no there’s not, but because of these types of private benefit rules certainly you want to be cautious that’s an organization and make sure that you understand what is appropriate and what wouldn’t be appropriate, even if it’s the terms and conditions there all there you also have to think about how the public’s going to do it, and how your supporters and also your critics so that all gets taken into account as well. Okay, are there’s some measures that we can use for what’s what’s market value what’s appropriate if let’s say a boardmember is offering office space for rent for the organisation. But what do we do? A market analysis what’s your advice? Yeah, those are all great. Basically you want to take all the steps to show that it’s being negotiated at arm’s length? I’m getting independent appraisal having let’s say if the contract approved, i haven’t reviewed by an attorney you know, documenting in your meeting minutes what it is that you’re considering and why this is justified and why this is really in further in severe exam purposes. All of those steps are going to help protect the organization on it is important because under this doctrine, there’s no de minimus exception. You know, we talked about with the private benefit doctrine that you can have incidental private interests served with the private and merriment doctrine where we’re just looking at insiders it’s an absolute rule and the way that it’s written on the irish i can actually take away your tax exempt status if you violate it. Now we don’t see that happen very often, but let’s, hold off on that. So so there’s. So when you say there’s no de minimus testing me even just a little bit over, say, ah, market value or a little bit over what would be an arm’s length transaction could be in violation of the prohibition against private inhuman. Yeah. In theory, yes, at one dollars. Okay, okay. You’re right. We don’t see it happen a lot because that is a very city air penalty for let’s. Say something that can be corrected or something. That’s. Very small. An amount. So what the irish did they developed. What is the third rule? The excess benefit transaction rolls. On basically what this does is it creates an immediate sanctions so that the irs doesn’t have to go so far as to i’m takeaway tax exempt got it intermediate sanctions okay, immediate sanctions, so this fool is going to sound very similar, but there are a little there are some differences on this school basically says that an organization cannot provide an economic benefit. Tio what i’m going to call it disqualified person, which i’ll explain in a second have exceeds the consideration that the organization is receiving in return, so disqualified person is similar to the concept of an insider, but they want to use a different term for it. You could have just said the supplies for insiders, there was someone and there’s a little nuance to it, it’s someone who has a substantial influence over the organization within the last five years. So we’re thinking of the same type of people, though high level managers, directors hyre speeding, please let’s say papa upleaf founders the same types of people that they choose to call it disqualified person under this role on basically if it found that there’s an excess benefit transaction, the penalty now is an excise tax. So it’ll be twenty five percent of the excess benefit tax to the disqualified person. You received that. Okay, let’s, unpack this a bit. All right. So it’s paid by the individual, right? It’s paid by that disqualified person to dp. Okay. And they could actually get bumped to a two hundred percent tax if they don’t correct it. Ok, ok. Also important for organizations is an organizational manager can also get taxed if they knowingly and willingly approved that transaction as tax tax as an individual. You mean yes. Ten percent of the excess benefit up tio twenty thousand dollars. Okay, so the organization would be prohibited in these cases from from paying these excise taxes for the individual. And it would be inappropriate for the organization to pay the taxes because there are certain indemnification that an organization can provide again, this is going to be a state law that california, for example, a breach of your fiduciary duty takes you out of being qualified indemnification. So here, if you’re you knowingly and willingly approving a gn xs benefit transaction, that certainly, you know, raises the concern about reaching a fiduciary duty and having approved that and so, organizations again doing their homework, getting reliable third party dahna toe look at asking for professionals for, you know their ex offgrid opinion on the matter. Those are all things that help protect the organizational managers from ever finding themselves in this situation on def, they if the charity pride tried to pay the excise tax, that could be in violation of the prohibition against private in your mint, keep going. Good. It’s a grand circle. Okay, we have to leave it there. Oh, god. You have one more point. You can make it a few seconds. Yeah, organisations would also look up and you’re going to put me in jarring in jail a procedure called a rebuttable presumption of reason. Profnet oh, my goodness. She does this with ten seconds left. Idea rebuttable presumption of reasonable this. Go ahead. Googling it’s a three step process that organization’s community based we give some the presumption that they’ve done a reasonable entered into a reasonable transaction with these disqualified people. So we don’t need to get into the details but write it down. Look it up. Okay. Say the phrase one more time. Rebuttable presumption of reasonable next-gen multi-channel. Is an attorney at the non-profit exempt organizations latto group in san francisco and our one of our regular legal contributors. You can follow her on twitter at emily chan. Thanks for being on. Emily would talk to you in just a couple weeks. You’ll be back, thank you very much. My thanks also, of course, teo melanie schnoll begun and the people at her company at morgan stanley who help arrange that interview next week nufer ends at events andrea nirenberg is president of nierenberg consulting group. She wants you to deepen and broaden the relationships that you create with people who come out to your events. We’re going to go deep and broad sounds promising and amy sample ward she’s going to kick off her new exalted status as social media contributed to the show, you’re going to be on once a month. We’re going to talk next week about designing for engagement, andi that maybe a jog in jail before she even gets on the show? I don’t know, maybe i’m a take her mug shot between now and next friday, designing for engagement, social media, new social media contributor amy sample ward shall i unpack it? For you, trust me, have you joined? Are linked in group? We have members from galveston, texas, dubuque, iowa, and muncie, indiana, where ball mason jars come from. Are you in the linked in group? You ought to be because you can continue the conversation with guests at that site. I do it. I asked questions follow-up questions, and in fact, i have a perfect one for emily. If you’re going to talk a little about that rebuttable presumption on the linked in group, i have a new fund-raising fundamentals podcast up just up this week, recruiting the best volunteers for your fund-raising this is the podcast that i do for the chronicle of philanthropy, you’ll find that ten minute podcast on itunes it’s, also on the chronicle of philanthropy website and again, it’s called fund-raising fundamentals wishing you best luck. Good luck, the way performers do around the world last week was italian in cool. Oh, allah bolena, and i’m wondering if you are still in the ass of the whale, you’re gonna have to stay there for another week because not till next week. We’ll have a new language lesson for you and a new way performers wish. Each other luck. Our creative producer was claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is line producer shows. Social media is by regina walton of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Oh, how i hope you will be with me next friday, one to two p m eastern, at talking alternative broadcasting, which is always at talking alternative dot com. I didn’t think that shooting the ending. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. E-giving e-giving it’s. Hi, this is nancy taito from speaks been radio speaks been radio is an exploration of the world of communication, how it happens in how to make it better, because the quality of your communication has a direct impact on the quality of your life. Tune in monday’s at two pm on talking alternative dot com, where i’ll be interviewing experts from business, academia, the arts and new thought. Join me mondays at two p m and get all your communications questions answered on speaks been radio. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three the conscious consultant helping conscious people be better business people. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. Hey! This is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. 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Improving communications, that’s. The answer. Dahna