441: Tech Accessibility & Resilience and Sustainable Impact – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2

This week 

Tech Accessibility
Keith Casebonne and Aurora Holder want you to advocate for accessible tools that will make all workers more efficient. From 19NTC, Keith is at Disability Rights Florida and Aurora is from Disability Rights Wisconsin.

Resilience & Sustainable Impact
Ananda Leeke and Meico Whitlock want you to use tech with intention and foster a culture of resilience. They’ve got lots of strategies for mindfulness and intention. Do you know the Eisenhower Matrix? Also from 19NTC, Ananda is with Ananda Leeke Consulting and Meico is the Mindful Techie.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com 

382: The Donor Journey – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guest this week:

Taylor Shanklin, vice president of marketing at Pursuant. 

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

326: News From Accounting & LinkedIn Latest – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Yigit Uctum, partner at Wegner CPAs.

Also, Maria Semple, our prospect research contributor & The Prospect Finder.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

304: Design On A Budget & Communications Mythbusters – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Oliver Seldman, technical lead with Advomatic; Leah Kopperman, analytics and digital director at The Jewish Education Project; and Jessica Teal, principal of Teal Media.

Also, Melissa Ryan, director of client services for Trilogy Interactive; Kari Birdseye, US campaigner at WildAid; and Burt Edwards, director of media and web strategy for InterAction.

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

295: How We Got Here & New Overtime Rules – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Dr. Robert Penna, author of “The Nonprofit Outcomes Toolbox.”

Also, Gene Takagi, our legal contributor and managing attorney of the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations law group (NEO).

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

286: Virtual Orgs: Managing Your Remote Employees – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

tony_martignetti_300x300-itunes_image2Tony’s guests this week:

Heather Martin, COO at Interfaith Family & Karen Graham, executive director of Idealware. 

Also, Amy Sample Ward, our social media contributor and CEO of Nonprofit Technology Network (NTEN).

There’s more at tonymartignetti.com

137: Followship & Social Media Boundaries – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Allison Fine, co-author of “The Networked Nonprofit.”

Gene Takagi, principal of the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations Law Group

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Dahna hi there on. Welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Have you read it to review the show on itunes? If you haven’t, i’d be grateful if you go there. I know you don’t have to go back once you subscribe, but i’d be grateful if you would make the trip here’s what some people are saying in reviews gold for non-profits the best non-profits show period although that person had eclipsys after that period. So it’s period eclipsys i’m amazed at the variety equality and depth of his interviews. That person probably thinks i’m shallow. Otherwise he wouldn’t have been amazed he should just be fulfilled and his expectations being met. You have no idea what the trouble i went through to put those three reviews up their different accounts, i had to go to a public library, use the computer there. So please supplement those three that i put up with with your own one two, five star rating and and review the show. I’d be grateful. This is friday, april twelfth and i very much hope that you were with me last week because i would develop acute pancreatitis if i heard that you had missed talk between the generations. Phyllis weiss haserot president of practice development council, is a consultant and coach in cross generational communications think sixtieth, sixty ish boss and twenty five ish employees or seventy year old fundraiser and thirty year old donor-centric ship, phyllis had strategies for understanding and working across the generations. This week, followship alison find, co author of the network non-profit, has been thinking lately about opening organizational culture to allow non-profits to be more reactive to the interests and motivations of their followers, while still keeping oz insight and she’s going to share her thoughts. Also, social media boundaries. Our legal contributor, jean takagi from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group neo suggests rules for your use of social media it’s not a free for all for your employees and volunteers, jean will help you stay out of trouble between the guests on tony’s take two. The irs is still using form nine ninety to inquire about your compliance with state charity registration laws. Sounds thrilling, but i can make a lot more interesting than it sounds. My pleasure now to welcome alyson find she studies and rights at the intersection of social media and social change. She’s, author of the award winning book mo mentum, igniting social change in the connected age, published by wile e. Her latest book is the networked non-profit co authored with beth cantor, also widely published. She’s, a contributor to harvard business review online that’s at hbr dot or ge she hosts a monthly podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy called social good. I have one of those, too, and she blog’s a fine blawg at allison fine dot com. They’re two l’s in allison on twitter, she’s at a fine allison with two l’s welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Thanks for having me, tony. I’m delighted to be here. Thanks, alison. Um, you work at the intersection of social media and social change. It sounds like a crossing guard. Yeah, what’s their what’s it that intersection well on off a lot of activity, uh, and a reshaping of institutional life right now. Uh, whereas what used to be on the outside for institutions are in use on the insider is out and that’s the kind of changing of the contours in the landscape that i’ve been taking a hard look at the last several years. What do you mean what’s in was what’s out was in what it’s in is out? What do you mean by that? Well, so imagine tony, you’re running a small social service agencies surety and there are bloggers out there and tweeters and a whole bunch of other folks who are interested in your issue and they’re looking hard. So those folks who used to be on the outside not really able to see inside are poking around now, and they’re talking about your issues and they’re talking about your organization and on the other side, the staff of organisations, whether organizational leadership of likes it or not, are on social media channels and talking about the organization. Well, so what used to be on the inside is now on the outside, uh, and what it does mainly for very traditional non-profit leaders gear the heck out of them. Yeah. There’s ah, right. Scaring about scared about losing control. Yeah, they already lost control. Go continue to care that they’re going to lose it. Okay, on dh. What are your thoughts around? Followship? What do you mean by followship? So now we’re looking at an environment and ecosystem where organizations are flatter, some by economic necessity and others because they’re using social media and networks better and, uh, there’s this changing relationship, as i said between inside and outside and the reality is tony, that people who are open toe helping causes and non-profits aren’t sitting back on their couches waiting to be told what to do, they aren’t waiting for the latest press release to come out, so smart organizations are understanding that in this new environment they have to lead by following their crowd and it’s a very different dynamic. It doesn’t mean they’re not leaders right there setting big goals and saying to folks were trying to get from here, there, you know, we’re trying to end homelessness, we’re trying to reduce obesity, whatever the big goal is, but we need you our crowd to help us get from here to there, and you’re going to do that by being creative and energetic and working side by side with us. But why do why does why do i, as the leader of this very well run? Stewart lee run very efficiently run very productive social organised social service. Organisation that that i’m head of why do i? Why do i need to follow? Don’t i know the goal? What you say you like to say, oz and and how best to get there? I mean, i have a strategic plan, i have a board we’ve we’ve interviewed like minded agencies in the town, in the in the community, we’ve included our community in those interviews to produce that strategic plan. I mean, i think i know best i’m sure you d’oh uh, but the bottom line is, tony, you might think you know best, but social problems are enormously complex. We aren’t making progress in a lot of areas, and if organizations are very honest with themselves, they’ll see oftentimes the lack of progress and we can’t do this work alone, we have got to do this work in communities with communities, and the only way to do that is to treat people as part of your effort, not the foot soldiers doing on ly what you asked. So you’re taking a look at the fact that, uh, things like hunger and poverty and homelessness and domestic violence and climate change any literal way economic we’ve been at these things for generations, you know, so look, over the last thirty years, the needle hasn’t moved on these things, not because we’re not trying, not because there aren’t smart people doing the work, but because they are enormously difficult to solve, and institutions alone can’t solve them. It’s very dismaying to me is i think about all those things that we’ve been at for for generations, but don’t be dismayed, tony, because the great news is we’ve got this, you know, very vital, robust, energetic new way of looking at the world using our social media tool kit oh, and engaging networks of people to do great things, but you’re very encouraged, okay? But you’re concerned also, that people are that leaders are not engaging in the right way. They’re more following their their written strategic plan or they’re they’re treating as you suggested constituents as foot soldiers, you know, do this now, volunteer now sign the petition now. Donate now come to our event, uh, and and and they are exhausted. I spoke to over five hundred social service leaders in wichita, kansas yesterday. Lovely, lovely people. And they are exhausted, tony and they are struggling financially and they’re getting burned out and this is a large reason why pushing the boulder up a hill by yourself as a siloed institution is not an effective way of working. Okay, we don’t have to do it anymore. We have an alternative. Okay, followship is our alternative that’s? Exactly right? Okay, i’m not just made anymore. I’m already uplifted and just just ninety seconds you turn me around all right? So you want teo, you say, you know, take down silos, break down walls, open the culture wei have just like two minutes or so before our first break. What’s our what’s, our first step we need to know where these people are, what they want to do. The first step is listening. Yeah, right. So the first step is once you have come to the understanding of i need to work different, like, you know, there was a world out there that i can connect with. But i have to do it in the right way. Then you begin by listening. What are people out there talking about in regards to my issue and regards, maybe to my institutions. And how can i best help them more listening than we did in the interview’s for creating this music plan that’s exactly right? I’m in a more natural wave of listening through conversation like tony, right? This isn’t a science. This is being human and asking people tell me what you think. Tell me how we’re doing. Tell me why you were dismayed last year when we didn’t do act. I really think social media provides an opportunity for us to re humanize ourselves out there. So i, as the head of this social, i’d like to be ceo of a rather executive director. Okay, president, ceo of this social services so i khun b or i should be engaging directly. Well, you know, social media is not a spectator sport contact sport made everybody hands on and in order for you to run your agency, i think you’ve got to be engaged with your community. All right? I don’t want to break my collarbone. No, like that baseball player did just yesterday. That would be bad. That was just too much contact. But you can’t go on injured reserve. We need you on the field. Okay, on doubt. I mean, i could be having face to face conversations with my folks, too, right? Yes, thanks for the reminder. I never, ever want to give anybody the impression at social media, a substitute for in person engagement. It augments it, it never, ever take the place of it. We’re gonna pick up right there. We got to go away for a couple of minutes. I’ll have some live listener love when we come back and continue this conversation with alison, fine about followship. She’ll stay with me, and i hope you do, too. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you confused about which died it’s, right for you? Are you tired of being tired? How about improving your energy strength and appearance? Hi, i’m ricky keck, holistic nutrition and wellness consultant. If you have answered yes to any of my questions, contact me now at n y integrated ghisolf dot com or it’s. Six for six to eight, five, eight five eight eight initiate change and transform your life. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s. The answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com konnichiwa live listener love to tokyo and support of japan. Konnichiwa. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Live listener love also california. We got san francisco and tustin, california. Welcome, san antonio and clifton, texas live listener love to you as well on dh lots of others to come. All right, alison, what should we be listening if we’re gonna be listening? We need to be asking questions of the folks who are connected to our to my cause. What? What? What questions should i be asking? Well, it’s it’s going to depend entirely on your particular cause, tony and and where you are and your life cycle of your organization you just starting. Are you? You know, more mature. I really strongly encouraged people to actually start by just listening and not speaking. Not something that we are taught to dio anywhere. I didn’t take a graduate course in it, did you? No. And in fact, when i was in the dark days when i used to practice law, i was i was always upset that there wasn’t a billing code for listening or thinking that was another there’s never a code for. Thinking i always had to be doing something, producing some documents, some delivery ble what couldn’t i just bill half an hour for thinking about your case? I couldn’t do it. No, i i understand that. And we, you know, in the nonprofit sector b value, dizziness, a great deal. Uh, but it’s very important to get a feel for what people are talking about, what they’re passionate about, what they’re interested in and then to begin to practice asking questions. There’s a great irony, tony actually have to remember howto ask a good question because organizations aren’t good at it we’re so used to broadcasting, though, used to wrapping up ourselves and talking points that are closed, that learning how to honestly openly, authentically asked a riel question that you want to know the answer to that you don’t already know the answer to take some practice. And, of course, this all feeds into riel engagement in the social networks. Exactly. Exactly think about it, tony, think about the number of times you’ve been approached by a non-profit right that there is a they send you a press release or they send you? Ah, you know, direct mail piece. And those aren’t conversations, right? Those they’re just messages being sent at you. You know, it’s a broadcast broadcast right now think about the difference of if you got from somebody who said, you know, i know that you came to our event last year. Um, how’d it go for you? Would you think about it? What do you think about us? What can we do? Better but that’s a conversation. Okay, okay, now we need to ah, keep our goals in sight. Um, you’re just you want us to be you want me to be flexible and how i get to them. That’s exactly right. There’s a group called epic change epic epic change. Okay, they are raising money to give to for global poverty alleviation. And the way they go into every year is they create a facebook group. They invite their, you know, folks duitz expressed an interest in their cause or rather than few fewer into the group they here’s the goal for the year. We’re trying to raise x amount of money or we’re trying to work in a new country. How we going to do it? How we’re going to get from here to there and people really engaged, it takes those great facilitation skills. That’s what followship is all about right? It’s, not the wild west you’re not just letting it go anywhere it wants to go. You’ve got to be a great cocktail party host to make that happen, right? Keeping the conversation going, but it really is being respectful of the creativity and smarts of your supporters and engaging them in a process of getting you from here to there. What am i going to say to my board that looks at me let’s say this is a five year old agency and i’ve got ah, oh, seven hundred fifty thousand dollars annual budget, right, trying to keep it fairly modest, but, you know, i’d like to have achieved something in five years for pete’s sake. Um, my board expects me to be the leader. What am i going to say to them when i’m asking when i’m asking them to allow the agency to be flexible and taking tio not only take into consideration, but follow the follow the lead of the crowd? Uh, with so if you have a very skeptical board, which would be a shame, right? We really got to think about who serves on board and and why we keep packing them with so many lawyers. Yes, much bigger topics for life, right? Because, lord find on certainly uncertainty very, very unsettling. Yes, you well, now. Ah, so if that’s the kind of bored that you have, what i strongly recommend is that you try followship as an experiment, take one small area in which you work for this year, maybe it’s one fund-raising event, maybe it’s one new program or revamping an existing program and try out the idea you’re not throwing the whole organization out. You’re continuing with the things that work. But you are figuring out a new way to work with people that will be particularly appealing to younger supporters. That’s, i think, is the case you could make any board. Okay, we’ll take it and we’ll take it in bite-sized pieces. Could it be? Could we do this around an event? Absolutely. You had suggested the event earlier. How do we do have a wee look what could have done better? Think about the difference tony of posting on facebook from a group that you’ve liked that says march nineteenth is our gala dinner buy your tickets now from a post echo’s up six months earlier that says we’d like to do a spring event. What kinds of things have you been to lately that you like? What kinds of things do you think we could do and start a conversation about it? Which one do you feel more excited about? Yeah, i’m going to participate in the latter. Mohr you engaged me now i have a pretty sizable ego, though. It’s gonna be hard for me now. All right? So you’ll help me persuade the board. Now, i have to now have to persuade myself that i don’t have all the answers in our community geever so if you feel that you have all the answers, i would suggest social change work is probably not a good fit for you. Therapy is probably wise psychiatry, perhaps even psychotropic drugs i’m already using them. I’m afraid already on psychotropics led me to this delusion. This is really, really hard work now, okay? It doesn’t mean that we don’t need mars confit and people running organizations. Of course we do. But if their ego is so large, they don’t allow other people. To help them solve large community problems, and they’re not going to get very far because these are collective problems that need collective solutions. You’re critical of president obama’s campaign back from two thousand eight what what happened there? I don’t think so much in two thousand eight is as opposed to this last one, so two thousand eight it was great fun, right? They let people come in and gave them a menu of things that you could do and let them go, which is great then they forgot about them once they got elected. I didn’t quite know what to do with a multimillion person proud once they got into the white hot right house because, you know, forbid somebody should talk about marijuana or something that made them uncomfortable. So they put them all into a direct mail, dona base and that’s. What they did this last election cycle was that they had a very clear, tightly controlled, um, ways of managing people as fundraisers and as voters. And that was it. So i found the last cycle enormously disempowering for people. Zamora how they treated the two thousand eight followers. Exactly in two thousand twelve you don’t really think you’re so smart and creative anymore. We don’t really need your help that way. All we need are your checks in your vote. People have a lot more to give them that ego. We know it now. We’ve been in office for years. We know what we’re doing, we know what we’re doing, and we’re going to control this thing to get from here to there. Allison fine is and author most recently of the network to non-profit, which is widely published and that you can find it on amazon. You can also find it on the barnes and noble actually found it a little less expensive at barnes and noble. Um, and i want to send some more live listener love, so to new bern, north carolina, frederick, maryland, and lasalle, illinois live listener love we have listeners in china knee how that’s from shanghai and hei bai, the asian continent very well represented for tony martignetti non-profit radio. Thank you. I’m glad you’re with us week to week. Um, alison, do you think a a presidential candidate could emerge from the social networks? I think what we’re going to see tony is we’re going to see it start at a more grassroots level. We’re going to start to see some layers around the country and then some governors who come up this way. Uh, it’s too hard to try to scale this at a national level first, i think, but you’re going to find somebody who’s very good at this. And, you know, rand paul could be that person because the tea party really get followship or there really are they particularly grassroots organizing online in a way that other people down they are particularly good at online engagement there. Fenton, stick at it. How so? What? What does that they do that you admire? Uh, they allow lots and lots of people to talk very loudly. Right? So being loud doesn’t bother them at all. A part of their dna. Being loud bothers other organizations and awful lot. It scares them. They support local organizing without having a need to try to control all the local organizing. They’re fried or foundation does the same thing right gives you an idea of what you should be doing. So the local p party talk. About these kinds of things, but when and how you do it that’s up to you say the name of the foundation again. You cut out. I’m sorry. The surfrider foundation. Thank you. Surf rider. Okay, they’re fried. Er it’s a non-profit thirty five years old in county started in california to provide coastal cleanup. They have hundreds of, um, chapters around the country. And tony, they basically let them do what they want to do. If you want to mash up our logo, go ahead. If you want teo street cleanup this year instead of coastal cleanup, go ahead. And in the end, the spokes do an amazing amount of work on dh. Just engage thousands of volunteers in this third rider. Like the tea party, i understand that you can provide big goals. You can provide the contours of what we need done and then let people go. Those are excellent examples. I never thought of the tea party as as such a good example of online engagement. But yeah, everything you’re saying is true. They do. They said broad outlines and and then they have hundreds of local activists and i mean and low under the local. Chapters and they’re not worried about descent. They’re not worried about disagreement, they’re not worried about some yelling. You know what happens to awesome with organizations, tony, is they’re so concerned about anything that smacks of criticism that they find it very difficult to step outside in unguarded ways. All right, um, the strategic plan that i’ve mentioned that we my organization spent about twenty thousand dollars on for a consultant to help administer and do the interviews and coalesce, and we had that nice powerpoint deck that they presented to the board a year ago. What am i going to do with my strategic plan? Throw it out. Oh, allison, fine, i said i was being very polite when you mentioned it the first time, and i didn’t bring it up. What a waste of money it was. Well, all right, let’s, talk about it now, because i’ve got my board on board and i’ve set my ego aside. That’s a very big step. Yeah, but it hasn’t solved the problem yet, right? So look how many groups you know that spent all that time and money on a strategic plan. Do everything in the planet at the end. Go the boy. That was the best thing we ever did. All right, maybe one or two over my career. Mainly. What you hear is holy, who spent a lot of time on that thing for sure. And in that process, you know, closer to your community as an organization, right? You had an outside or talk to them a zoho you couldn’t talk to them, which i don’t underst dan oh, that’s interested? Yes, i can’t talk to your community. That’s the core got a scientific approach, tio data collection because that’s the corner of their plan. You know, i was a program evaluator for a long time, tony. So you know, i have respect for people who collect data, but to say that you need an outside to come in and interview stakeholders for your organization, as opposed to the conversations you should be having every day with the people who are most important to your efforts. I don’t get it. And then the worst part, though, is pretending that we can project out years at a time. Right now, when anybody who’s successful in business will tell you right now that you can’t plan out more than a year? You just can’t your troublemaker. I am okay. And i’m small, so people really kind of leave me alone. I admire troublemakers. I like things to be shaken up. It’s a school during you call a pot stirring okay? During, right? Something that pops. Not so much troublemaker. All right, i’ll call you troublemaker. You call yourself a buster? How does the occupy movement do? Just we just have about two minutes left. What’s your assessment of them. I think that, uh, i think it’s fascinating. I think they did a great job of turning out. Ah, lot of people. But i think of that kind of organizing tony like a pointillist painting. It’s one dot and it’s going to take a lot of dots over a lot of time for that thing to mature. It’s. Not over yet. It’s just in its infancy ilsen. Fine. I hope you’re going to come back. My pleasure, i hope. It’s been my pleasure talking to you. Thank you very much. Alison. Fine. Her latest. My pleasure. Her latest book, the network non-profit co authored with beth cantor. You confined it. Amazon. You can find it at barnes and noble and on twitter, she’s a fine thankyou again, alison. My pleasure, tony talking. We’re gonna go away when we come back. Tony’s, take two about some charity registration technicalities and then social media boundaries with jean takagi. Stay with me. Ditigal lending the dude in the good ending, you’re listening to the talking alternative network e-giving. Nothing. Cubine are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. Hi, i’m ostomel role, and i’m sloan wainwright, where the host of the new thursday morning show the music power hour. Eleven a m. We’re gonna have fun. Shine the light on all aspects of music and its limitless healing possibilities. We’re going invite artists to share their songs and play live will be listening and talking about great music from yesterday to today, so you’re invited to share in our musical conversation. Your ears will be delighted with the sound of music and our voices. Join austin and sloan live thursdays at eleven a. M on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Lively conversation. Top trends and sound advice. That’s. Tony martignetti non-profit radio. And i’m janna agger’s, senior vice president, products and marketing from blackbaud. Dahna and i’m tony martignetti tony martignetti non-profit radio time for my take to taxes are on everybody’s mind april fifteenth coming up so i’m talking about the tax form that charity’s fill out the nine, ninety and between that form and one of its schedules, there are two questions that probe your offices compliance with state charity registration laws, which i always think is interesting that’s a federal agency questioning whether you’re complying with state laws. It’s not a good idea too fudge on those questions because you’re nine, ninety assigned by an officer under penalty of perjury. So you want to be conscious of your compliance with those registration laws in each state where you are soliciting donations, it’s not enough to just be registered in your home state if you are soliciting in other states. The post on my block is irs continues inquiry on charity registration compliance the block is that tony martignetti dot com and that is tony’s take two for friday, the twelfth of april fifteenth show of the year jean takagi is with me he’s, our regular legal contributor to the principal at neo non-profit and exempt organizations law group in san francisco he edits the popular non-profit law blogged dot com, and he is at gi tak gt. A k on twitter. Jean takagi, welcome back. Thanks, sonny. How you doing? I’m doing well, pleasure to have you back, it’s, good to talk to you. We don’t want to need to set some boundaries around social media. Why do we need more than just sort of usage guidelines? Well, let me first get some of your opening comments, tony, dark days when you’re a lawyer. Oh, yes. So you have a song about just go i jean i you know, i i love that you love the practice of law, it did not do for me what it does for you, but i appreciate that, tony, it definitely isn’t for everyone. And i heard alison’s comments as well about lawyers finding uncertainty unsettling on probably being deal breakers and, well, now i don’t think she said, did you say deal breakers? I know should i sort of added okay, well, let’s, not let’s, not put words in my mouth because defamation is one of things we’re going to talk about your there we go. So part of the reason why you need you need rules in this game. And so i actually agree with ours that lawyers do find uncertain uncertainty unsettling, and we can sometimes be deal breakers, which are my words and part of the reason why is that? Because if we give advice, tio some organizations and, you know what, consultant were to give that advice and has ninety nine percent effectiveness and ninety nine percent of the organisation it works really well, there is that one percent it might not work well point, and they might actually get in trouble using that advice with the lawyer we can’t afford to do that. We’ve got to make sure that we’re protecting one hundred percent, which means we can’t quite be is aggressive in some ways in other ways we can let organizations and our clients know how we can empower them to let them know what is okay to do and that they should feel comfortable doing it, that it may be part of theirs, their duties in terms of furthering their mission in order to engage in those things. So that’s one of the reasons why, why we wantto have rules so there’s a better understanding of how to play this game of using social media. And, you know, i think, tony, when you play any game, we should read the rules first, right? They understand what you’re doing. My favorite game is monopoly. I don’t like other players to read. The rules just, you know, yeah, i know. And then and then, you know, i have a good eye use the rules of sort of guidelines, and then, you know, i’ll borrow a little from the bank and things like that, you know, at below and at below market rates and things like that let’s go actually into a couple of those things that you talked about borrowing money from the bank, okay? Let’s say, you know, we organize this nationwide effort and have our volunteers go out and create different events fund-raising events in, uh, in different locations throughout the country, on behalf of our organization and furthering our movement. Well, let’s say, we’ve got ten of these things going on in seven go really well, can we gene, can we taken example? I’m thinking of ah, move on dot or ge, they are frequently get their emails, attend an event in manhattan or the bronx or, you know, can somebody in well, they know that i’m in new york, so they don’t ask me to host elsewhere, but they’re certainly doing these things throughout the country. Yeah, and a lot of organizations are now using facebook and and other platforms toe mobilize their supporters throughout the country, right? Okay, so, you know, let’s, say it’s an organization that’s like move on that that’s got a nationwide presence with a lot of supporters throughout, and they’ve got some active people in different locations again, let’s say they’re ten events and seven go without a hitch and raise a lot of money for the organization. But one of the things you asked and when the things you talked about your take two is, are they registered in those states in which the volunteers there suddenly engaging in these fund-raising activities? Because if they’re not, that can get them into trouble, right? Tony, i think you know better than anybody it can is the now the volunteer yeah, they’re volunteer is acting as an agent of the of the organization at that point. Or is that? Is that a question? I think that’s a question and, you know, the more that the organization is telling the volunteer on how to organize the event and what rules should apply to the event and how the money should be collected and forwarded to the charity, i think it looks more and more like it the organization’s event and charity registration has got to be something that considered okay. Now i’m skirting jargon jail. We haven’t talked about jack in jail for weeks. I’m disappointed too many. My guests are plain talking, plain language. I don’t like that like abstruse language talks over everybody’s head. So why don’t you help define define for me? Because i said, are they an agent, but that that actually is a term of art has legal import, doesn’t it? Yeah, so generally an agent is acting on the authority and on behalf of the principal. So if i ask, skew tony and you are except that you’re going to make a donation on my behalf, another charity and i give you the money to make that donation. You’re acting as my agent, your not making your own donate donation of money. You’re donating the money on my behalf. You have certain responsibilities by taking on that relationship. I’m the agent and you’re the principal in that example, correct. So if the charity tells a volunteer agent to start fund-raising them and organizing an event on their behalf, then it’s really the charities event and the volunteers acting as their agent, which means the charity has responsibilities in that jurisdiction. Okay, okay, so the other things that you raised is, well, what if somebody just took off with the money? But if you’ve got a volunteer there but you have no staff presents there and you don’t really know this volunteer, you just sort of engaged with them online, and all of a sudden they’re holding this event for you, and they take off with the money. Now, what happened? What did you do? What? What? Showing a reasonable care did you take to make sure something like that wouldn’t happen then the awful thing is, what if somebody gets hurt at this event and right? And now in this case, it doesn’t even have to be an event that is a solicitation event like maybe we’re just we’re just rallying the troops, but we’re not asking for any money we’re not soliciting, just trying to maybe we’re all watching a video together or it’s some, you know, kind of activist activity, but but no money is changing hands. Go ahead. So something else could happen. Yeah, exactly. Right. So whether it’s just being an educational event, uh and you’ve got some people out there, they’re gathered together under the charity’s name and you know, they’ve gotten together and maybe there weren’t any steps, teo, prevent some risks or maybe it’s like a walkathon, so maybe it is a solicitation event that’s part fun solicitation, but there weren’t these risk management steps that were looked at charity. The cherry didn’t really take any step to make sure that no harm’s could be prevented that were reasonably foreseeable possibilities of that. So those are things that charities have to think about when they start to mobilize their supporters are are the supporters holding their own events? In which case do do those people after register in order to fund raise for another charity? That might be an issue as well? Or is it the charity’s own event, in which case the charity’s got to think about registration and also creating rules of the game again that have to do with holding that event to make sure that the people who attend or the people who have money get solicited are protected? I’ve got two troublemakers on the show today you’re a lot of trouble, gene, you’re asking a lot of questions? Let’s, try toe help with some answers. What? What? What do you know? Right now, we know what we have to think about, but what are we going to do should we not be hosting these events? Or is it cannes insurance help or we need we need written regulations about what volunteers khun do in other places. Where we supposed to do? Yeah, i think we’ve got to figure out first two’s event is it? Is it the charities event? Or is it the individuals that are gathering together that are raising funds on their own? And if they’re raising funds are their own? Are they going to get in trouble? And should we try to help them understand what their responsibilities are in what limitations there are for them to start raising money on their own without being under the umbrella, if you will, of the charity so rules of the game, first who’s event is it, and if the charity has authorized and encouraged it, it should try to protect those people who are going teo organize the event as well as those people were going to attend the event and having rules there instead of just guidelines makes perfect sense to me, you know, you you’re not allowed to, uh, you know, serve alcohol to minors may may seem, you know, very simplistic and obvious, but sometimes when you’ve got volunteers who you’re unaware of, you’ve not screamed, not interviewed them. Um, you’ve got to be really explicit about what’s, okay? And what’s not okay, even if you think it’s obvious. So rules of the game and rules of the event, i think there’s something that you have tohave in-kind also have some people, you know, on the charities staff that or they’re volunteers, if they’re in all volunteer organization really think about risk management of that event, what risks are involved? And should we take steps like having a first date? You know, kid available or having some people there are having a written release and waiver of liability form that all event participants find those air things to think about? And then the charity registration thing on top of that, if it’s an event of any significance, i think you have to really seriously think about that and probably by your book, tony. Okay, or have me register for you. There you go. Now what if the agent doesn’t follow the rules, then? Is the organization protected at least? Well, maybe, maybe not, but what could i have got any colonization playing the agent and sue the agent? But whoever got hurt from that if its a charity, that man is going to kind of everybody. And if the charity has a deeper pocket than the agent and if it’s, you know, just day ah, volunteer who may not have ah, a lot of that worth and the charity may have a deeper pocket, and the plaintiff lawyer will go after the charity in that case and if they’re not register stirred on top of all of this in that state, it’s going to look even worse for the charity in terms of saying, well, you know, we tried our best, and we just didn’t you didn’t weigh had rules, but but the the solicitation was illegal because the charity wasn’t registered in the state. That looks bad. Yeah, your insurance company might, even if you have insurance might say, well, you’re operating illegally. We don’t ensure that well, okay, uh, okay. So we we strayed a little bit from social media, but that’s fine, because we’re talking about events which might be propagated through social media. What about more directly, you know, the advocacy advocacy online? Sure, i mean, i guess he’s a big thing for for non-profits and i’m just a big proponent of non-profits engaging in a lot of advocacy to further their their mission, but social media channels again allow, you know, a lot of questions to rise, like whose message is being sent? You know, we’ve allowed staff members and volunteers in this kind of followship model that that alison is describing in and where everybody’s is contributing, are you going to be sending conflicting messages? And are some of those messages going toe actually be attributed to the organization and not be a communication of the type that the organization is allowed to do? Like an election eri and communication worth jargon jail right durney election hearing endorsing a political candidate which a five a one c three cannot do, but an individual can do so it gets a little grey when an individual uses an account that has the organisation’s name somehow attached, whose account is it? And is that communication? Ok, ok, but what about i mean, alison was sort of seeking feedback from from the community, i mean suppose someone uses their own account to post something on the organization’s facebook page or or points ah, address is a post on twitter to the organization that i mean that’s what the person’s using their own account? Yeah, i mean, would that be ok, though? That’s the organization is not responsible for that one, is it? Even if it’s just on their facebook pages, somebody else posted it? Well, let’s think about that. What? What if it was a really defamatory statement against somebody? Or what if it was endorsing a candidate for political office, tony and the organization has control of that facebook pages being able to delete that comment out of there, should they do it? Or should they just let it sit there? My my feeling is conservatively, you’re going to want to delete something that would be illegal if the charity had posted it itself. Obviously, you don’t want to show opinions and participation of your supporters on the facebook page, but you don’t want, you know, people the flame or defame others, and you certainly don’t want, uh, charity metoo attributed with endorsing candidates or engaging in some sort of private benefit that that benefit thie organizations, insiders. Those can all get the organization into a lot of trouble. We’ve got to go away for a couple of minutes. When we come back, jean run, and i will keep talking about the social media boundaries. And i’ve got some live listener love for the korean peninsula. Stay with us. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Latto are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Altum have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Welcome back on io haserot for soul, young son and day, john korea on your haserot. Dahna. As i said last week, especially south korea, in our thoughts, lots of saber rattling, you know, i saw i saw seventy something interviewed, and he said, the north is just like a schoolyard bully. It’s, no big deal. Andan. I saw a twenty something interviewed, who said she was nervous and pays attention to where exits are. When she’s, when she’s in buildings. So, anyway, are our thoughts are with you, south korea jane. Let’s, let’s see about okay, so let’s, continue with this online. The all these questions about online your you think that? Ah, non-profit should delete things that it wouldn’t be able to print or ah, post itself on, say, facebook or twitter? Yeah, i think it depends on the channel that you’re using. Sometimes you’ve got listservs where you’ve got a charity, that’s decided not to moderate the contact content, but put in disclaimers that might be one set of rules that applies. But with your facebook account, i think you’ve got to be be careful, especially if it’s a page that’s under the control of the charity, if their comments on there again, that would be hurtful to the charity or hurtful toe. Others that’s something that you might think about the leading, and if it’s obviously going to be in violation of of laws, you’re going to want to report it. You know, it’s against facebook zone privacy or policies as well, but to protect the organization, i think that’s really important, and that gets into what we were talking about earlier about defamatory statements, um, could also be is like harassment? Yeah, absolutely. So you’ve got to be careful, there’s. Some sometimes employees or even managers will use social media channels now to communicate with their people that report to them and got to be very, very careful that they’re not sending messages that if they communicated in real life or by email. This is not all of a sudden. Better because it’s being broadcast on social media. Aren’t there also issues around posting other people’s content? Either me either an excerpt or even just linking to it let’s talk about that? Yeah, it’s a great question. Tony gets a little bit confusing when we’re talking about copyrights on copyright protection there a lot of non-profits out there that are just accepting from other sites and thinking that as long as you attribute that that source that it’s okay, and that might not just be content written content, but that could be photos and music as well. The company presentation, you got to be careful because somebody else owns that content, and just because they’ve published it on the web doesn’t mean they’ve given free permission for anybody else to copy and use it so that can get organizations into trouble. There are some some exceptions for fair use, uh, which might involve charity or commentary or criticism on sometimes for non-profit educational purposes, but that can get really big. Ah non-profits really want to know what they’re doing when they are borrowing or accepting content from other sites or from other individuals, and then suddenly posting it on their own and again, even with attribution that that may not be sufficient. Yeah, attribution doesn’t hear it. So you’ve got to make sure that either you’ve gotten written permission to use that content or you’re using it in a fair way that would not create an infringement liability issue. Okay, but those fair, those fairways, those those are the exceptions that you were talking about in fair use and they’re pretty pretty well defined. Well, not so well defined. Well, ok, they’re specific categories. Yeah, and they’re definitely enforced in different ways in different jurisdictions. So if you just read, you know, website resource on fair use don’t rely on that, but i do encourage all non-profits if you are borrowing or accepting or commenting on other people’s content and putting it up on your own sites to make sure you understand what the rules are, so do look some good, you know, reputable web resources for that and then move on from there in california, we’ve got an organization called public counsel that’s got excellent information on copyright and fair use, and i think other other states organisations could probably look at that stuff as well, because some of the state laws will be similar and just get a general idea of what the rules are and that’s a public counsel c o u n c l e that’s, right. Okay, just a couple of minutes left before we have to go away. Gene. So if there is a violation or something you’re you’re just concerned about you talked about deleting the post, what else should we be conscious of? Well, i think the important thing, especially on a governance levels way talk about board board duties now, tony is the board to develop a social media policy for the organization, so now they think and delegate the drafting out to management, but to have a social media policy and to make sure that everybody using social media on behalf of the organization understands what the rules are and what the risks are, because those those volunteers and supporters want to do good things for the organisation for its missions, they don’t want to go get the organization into trouble, but what happens is oftentimes they just don’t know what the rules and risks are, so educating them through a policy have guidelines for sure, but also have solid rule in place that don’t allow them to. Do things that would violate the law think that’s critical, just like thirty seconds left. Jean how about apologizing on the site where the violation occurred? Sometimes i can work, some sometimes can get you into more trouble, so you know, sometimes you’re just during the pot even more tomorrow how allison’s, where then? And that can create more more divisions, so it sort of look at it on a case by case basis. Look, a senior management, the american red cross put out a tweet before that says this was a rogue treat that says, when we drink, we do it right getting withered. This was a mistake, somebody using their personal account and thought they thought they were using their personal count. Instead, the american red cross account american red cross immediately came up with an apology that said, we’ve deleted the road treat, but rest assured the red cross this sober and we’ve confiscated the keys, humor, apology and everything worked out just fine. All important points to keep in mind. Social media is not just a wild west gene takagi principle of neo, you’ll find his block at non-profit law blogged dot com, you’ll find him. On twitter at gt a kg tech gene, thank you very much. My pleasure to talk to you again next month. Got some final live listener love teo taiwan we don’t know the city, but taiwan welcome and ni hao next week a conversation with amy sample ward reduction part do we’re talking about her new book co authored book social change? Anytime everywhere we started last month and there’s more to cover about your fund-raising calendar and social media. Andi, i’m hoping for a special appearance by tim amy’s, dad hoping we can get him to call in like to have a little fun with tim sample we’re all over the social web can’t make a click without lador a spark a testa trying to say, smacking your head hard into tony martignetti non-profit radio pinterest for example, i’ve got boards for the show and my blogged my favorite board on pinterest, though that i’ve got is women leading non-profits lots of videos of female non-profits ceos like abby falik of global citizen year and marry in wright edelman of the children’s defense fund. If you can suggest some that are missing, please do our creative producer is claire. Meyerhoff sam liebowitz is our line producer, but not today. Today, the line producer is janice taylor. We don’t have an assistant producer, but we struggled through. Janis filled both roles. The show’s social media is by regina walton of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. I hope you’ll be with me next friday went to two p m eastern at talking alternative broadcasting, found at talking alternative dot com. Duitz found anything? That dude, in the good ending, you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Get him. E-giving you could hi, i’m donna, and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream. Our show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life will answer your questions on divorce, family court, co parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com we look forward to serving you. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays, one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology no reality, in fact, its ideology over in tow. No more it’s time for action. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower will discuss what you’re born. Teo you society, politics, business it’s, provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic. I want to go what’s. Really going on? What does it mean? 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116: Grow Your Grateful Patient Program & Disaster Relief – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio

Tony’s guests this week:

Bill McGinley, president and CEO of The Association for Healthcare Philanthropy (AHP)

Nancy Johnson, senior consultant at Target Analytics

Gene Takagi and Emily Chan of the Nonprofit & Exempt Organizations Law Group

Read and watch more on Tony’s blog: http://tonymartignetti.com

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Dahna hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, i’m your aptly named host. My thoughts this week, of course, are with everybody affected by sandy up and down the northeast than into western new york, the finger lakes and ohio. My thoughts are with you, i am calling in from north carolina because i couldn’t get back home in time to do the show. So what? We have a show and we’re proceeding, i hope you’re with me last week. Oh, it would hurt me deeply tto learn that you had missed a conversation with janet eggers she’s, a senior vice president of products and marketing for blackbaud at their bb con conference last month, we talked about what’s coming in the non-profit technology market, special considerations for purchasing technology and leadership lessons that she learned from being a triathlete. Also gps global positioning. Scott scott koegler is the editor of non-profit technology news in our technology contributor, we talked about location based services that use the gps technology in your smartphone. Four square, instagram, yelp and facebook places are examples of sites that you can learn from your partner. With to get to know your donors and volunteers better this week grow your grateful patient program bill mcginley, president and ceo of the association for healthcare philanthropy, hp and nancy johnson, senior consultant at target analytics, sat with me at the bb con conference to talk about health care, grateful patient fund-raising why these prospects are critical and very generous privacy concerns and how to start your relationship. Also, disaster relief charities want to help hurricane sandy victims, but in the rush to help, you can’t ignore the rules around private benefit needs assessment and documentation, you’ll be on the right path with our legal contributors, jean takagi and emily chan from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group between the guests on tony’s take two i have a bunch of sandy disaster relief organizations that are doing very good work, and i’ll share some of those. If you’re on twitter, you could be using the hashtag non-profit radio to join the conversation with us. You take a break and when we get back, we’ll go right into grow your grateful patient program stay with me! They didn’t think dick tooting getting dink dink dink dink you’re listening to the talking alternative network waiting to get in. E-giving, you could joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre awareness for two exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city in pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller, emotional freedom, and greg brady will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot or or a nj dot net. Hi, i’m donna, and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family, court, co, parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more. Dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever. Join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten a m on talking alternative dot com. Dafs you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Yeah. Geever. Durney durney welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of bb khan twenty twelve we’re in maryland, just outside washington, d c my guests are nancy johnson she’s, a senior consultant, target analytics, blackboard company, and bill mcginley, president and ceo association for healthcare philanthropy, both of you. Nancy bill, welcome, thanks for taking time on a busy day. Delighted fundez your seminar topic is best practices for successful healthcare fund-raising strategically grow your grateful patient program. Bill president, ceo of association for health careful answer. I’d like to get the articles right that got you surrounded. Details report. I like the articles. Why is a grateful patient program critical to healthcare? Fund-raising let’s start with basics in health care and our group, particularly those were representing providers, hospitals, medical centers, long term care, hospice and such. The group that is connected that has had an experience that has been touched by the provider is a very important group. They’re very generous, they are involved. They know what the organization is about, what it can provide. So there they are more generous, the average member of the public simply because they’ve had an experience with the institution they know what it’s like they are part of a major part of the family, which is the physicians, the employees, the governance, the executive, the trustees of the hospital, and grateful patients. They represent over fifty five percent of individuals that give healthcare so they’re essential for us and their big givers help me understand why they’re not unapproachable because of privacy laws. Well, they are very approachable, and privacy rules allow the health care provider access to demographic information, so names, addresses of patients are part of what we do internal for our fund-raising is perfectly acceptable. So it’s acceptable for the clinician to share with you development office is that right? Think the physician at the hospital, the nurse, the janitor can refer a name to the foundation for somebody who might be interested to get okay is perfectly acceptable in permissible under the law. And nancy, why don’t we start with some of the tips that you have for growing this very important grateful patient program? Fifty five percent of individual fund-raising to health care’s from these people. How do we get started? Absolutely well, one of the main objectives have to be able to find the people that are. In the hospital immediately so that the foundation can really approach, not approach them for it. I’m coming to say hello, i’m introducing you to the foundation and letting you know that our goal of the foundation is to increase the awareness of what we do to help raise more money. And so what we see is the opportunity to find the best people to make the right gift at the right time, and what we’re doing is identifying with people that are most capable as well as the people that are already connected. How do we start that conversation? Once we’ve identified people, how do we initiate conversation while they’re in the hospital? It’s a quick hello, i want to connect with you now, if you’re already a donor, i’ve been wanting to meet you. You’ve probably been wanting to meet me. We’ve maybe meditate events, we’ve we’re friends, so you would expect me to come by and say hello to you. So these people were starting with the premise that these are people who are already known through the hospital, oftentimes they are ok. Other times you’re a new prospect. A new patient, that’s just came to the hospital and what’s important is to let them understand and know that we have a foundation that will be working with them for the future. Okay, bill, what do you hear from fund-raising professionals in hospitals about making that initial contact? What kinds of responses are our patients willing to talk? Oh, very much so. And when our members are making these visits there rounding and they’re there in the room with a patient, one of the things that are offering to do is they’re they’re our contact for you, anyone that comes into a hospital to have a procedure that is very unique for the individual. It may be a bit routine for some of the providers are member, you know, really steps across that gap, providing for as a resource answering questions, someone they could turn to for communication to make sure that they’re comfortable, what with what they’re receiving and the kinds of things that they’re going to undergo an experience while they’re in the hospital, because it is a foreign land to anybody. Who’s, a patient who’s coming in for russian scary that can be absolutely it’s unknown and while again, it’s very routine for the providers in the sense that they lived there, they worked there. It is a unique experience for any patient is coming. Nancy, i took you on a slight aggression howto make contact once we’ve identified, but what’s your advice around doing the identification. Current patients absolutely. We have a process that is totally automated, so no human hands touching the data way. Use the black boy as blackwater target analytics. Many of our clients use razors edge as their donor management system. So many of their donors are already no one, and we compare they’re the names of the new admits two there database as well as to wealth program, and we’re putting a radio, letting them know the best prospects for major gifts, the best prospects for annual e-giving and that allows them then to make a decision if they should go visit okay, and or put them into an annual solicitation lorts joining and something even better. Yet, if we’re visiting someone that we know that is a major gift donor. And maintaining their interest in the programs and their opportunity to support activities that are beneficial for others in their this is an opportunity for the foundation to reach out to people with them in the hospital. So i look at it is they’re coming to visit you there, there if you don’t reach out and say hello to them after you’ve had a relationship for years, not really good. I want to say at least a hello it’s not going to be a long visit, but i’m reaching out to you. What if it is someone who’s who’s due to the hospital? Not part of the family, not someone you’ve known for years still appropriate, too. Greet them while they’re in the hospital? Absolutely, i believe that most people when they’re in the hospital, they’re experiencing something unique buy-in it may be the first time they’ve known about the hospital, they become part of the health care family there and by reaching out to them they expect it’s, a buffalo here here’s i discount for gift shop or maybe i’m goingto leave the newspaper behind for you. I come in with a friendly face, i’m not bringing in needles. And i’m not taking blood from you and it’s. A quick high. Okay, okay. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre. Awareness for two exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city. In pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller, emotional freedom, and greg brady will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot, or or a h a n j dot net. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll durney i found that interesting. What nancy said in the session earlier today was that these people are coming to your home. They’re coming to the hospital are home, they’re coming into our facility. Ten there are any experience you have in the hospital there are there five, ten, fifteen people that air in and out that air touching your life during that process and tohave one focal point that could be helpful that, you know, you could turn to if you’ve got questions or a spot that you can go to a person, you could go to facilitate communication and make sure it’s clear among all these services that are being provided is very much appreciated by patients. That’s what we find so you’re encouraging the fundraiser to ask, act as a resource? Yes, from times they do on dh it’s quite appreciated, as you know. All right. So then, after we’ve identified we’ve initiated contact bill what’s what’s another strategy for growing this program. Well, that’s part of what we were talking about today, there are different levels of grateful freight patient programs at the very basic level, you find that contact that call being made that introduction and it may be sixty or ninety days later where we’re looking at that individual and deciding is this someone we wantto make an appeal to our reach out to bout some program or service that we’re offering where their donation can help someone else? Is it someone who’s contributed in the past or who has the capacity to do more? Do we want to put them way want to put an effort in front of them or an opportunity in front of them as a major donor, where they can make a significant difference because of their contribution to the community and, you know, that’s very basic there others where you’re doing the analysis in the analytics, if you will, you’re assessing wealth management capacity so that when you talk with someone, you develop a relationship, you clarify their interests and also the level of what you believe they can support a particular activity in helping others. Now, nancy, you’ll have to forgive me because i’m going to ask bill about what some advice for hospital may not have reasonscall so there are some way to walk away. I don’t want to have a conversation, but i’m just thinking of our audience is small and midsize charities, and there might be smaller hospital. It doesn’t have reasons aid xero identifying you wanna do it right? Well, i will tell you. Okay, identifying grateful patients. We often look we’ve compared to their database no matter what it is, and so doesn’t have they don’t have to be a razors that juicer. The ideas were helping them identify grateful patients and look into the patients that air there so that they’re contributing to their experience. So it’s a step just that they would have to be a mechanism for sharing the information from from no, i don’t know if it’s missions exclusions. It comes from admissions. Typically it kind of sermon ambitions. And then it’s submitted and and no one really has to touch it. It’s, elektronik lee done. We screen it, and then the results are back within ninety minutes so that the foundation can decide. Okay, who’s the best person to go visit this oversignt bilich and our members are clearly using razors, edges of tools. And one of the best advantages of this as a tool is simply that expands our members capability beyond it. Maybe multiple be able. To multiply the impact, one person can have two, twice a ce much three times as much because it is some of it’s automated but it’s more instantaneous than than operating off of written records comparisons that you’re making relative to wealth management to an individuals in the hospital or who has been discharged is instantaneous, as opposed to trying to make all those connections in your head. So this truly, really expands our members capacity, forgetting to more donors this right on that’s, that’s, invaluable. Okay, well, do you have specific advice for smaller hospitals, health care facilities that whether they’re using razor’s edge or not isn’t an advantage to be a smaller, maybe community hospital? Well, you know, it’s it’s so much like any everything you’ve heard around the world all fund-raising is local, and it is individual in many respects and again razors age is a tool enables that capacity if you don’t have razors, eggs, there are some other alternatives and things you could do all the way back to when i started, when it was, you know, index cards in a shoebox, but it’s, that kind of approach, so there are things in between certainly. Razor’s edge is sophisticated, and really, the value is really an expanding capability. But there are other ways you could do that. Part of it is more manpower, which is hard to get in smaller organizations. Part of it is a process and dedication to that process every day, no matter what the elements are that you put in place so you can make it work. That may not be quite as effective without some of these tools, but it’s still gonna work. Okay, so the smaller community, when i’m familiar with a smaller community hospital, shouldn’t avoid grateful patient program. No, not it all so quickly. If your foundation executive this fund-raising is part of your obligation, your purpose and it’s within the health care community. These are institutionally related foundations to the hospital, right? They’re not out raising money for the you know something else in the community focusedbuyer hospital? Absolutely. Okay, honey. Another area that we all thought blackbaud way want to be able to help all sizes of none. So we eat. Tapestry is a wonderful solution. That is many times used for the smaller community hospital. See tapestries at a cloud based. Is it ok? And so i don’t think we know history tells us we’ve worked together for many, many years that many of the hospitals use razors edge that it like you say some of the smaller, newer hospitals, maybe they don’t need the sophistication, and they have way have a wonderful opportunity for them to use a tapestry let’s talk about some other advice around building back to building this grateful patient program. Nancy what what, what, what what further advice did you give him? Your seven? Well, each hospital is unique. And when they started looking at what makes the program different, it’s getting buy-in from the whole health care community from the top all the way to the to the janitor that’s in the room with someone the foundation needs to be more than the organization of the part of the organization that says, hey, do you want to be, how much are you going to give to the employee program this year? We want to make sure that the foundation is connecting with the nurse is the people that are front line with patients and making sure that we’re hearing you need to stop in and have a visit. Kayman we need to make sure that we’re introducing grateful patient programs that can enhance all the different areas of the hospital so that everyone’s understanding those programs and bringing the community together because really it’s all about the services that were providing to these cubine what’s your advice about getting getting clinicians involved in fund-raising first, they’re busy, my my what i hear and my experience in doing some plant e-giving consulting for hospitals is docks are typically well, i don’t know a good number of doc’s doctors are not willing to partner really with fund-raising with development office for the foundation, what’s your advice for sort of breaking down those walls, i think when you really start involving the whole team and you have a new approach and it may be a totally new approach, you have to think outside of what you have done in the past, health care is we’re having to raise more dollars every year, and when you’re asked to raise more dollars with less, you’ve got to use the right tech what’s what’s into approach help us help the audience understand what what’s one new approach they go to their their doctors by implementing this information so that i can focus within ninety minutes and be able to be next to someone and introducing all the good work we do that makes it takes the guesswork out of it. It allows me to be more focus, and then it also allows doctors to have opportunity to refer people to us and a system in place so that they know as a team we’re working together. Will you have you have advice for breaking down those walls, getting into those characters who are often unwilling it’s, not just the doctors you’re talking about building a culture of philanthropy and awareness throughout throughout the community, right? You do that, you do that. You do that with the orientation, with new and ongoing employees that you have. You do that in the training opportunities with the nurses and with practitioners and such that you’re talking about philanthropy or letting know about the foundation with the physicians, they’re human beings, too. You need to embrace them the way you do others, and there are programs and activities that could be very supportive of areas that they are interested in, either in their specialty orin pieces of equipment. Or things that are going to make their delivery of care much hyre to their patients, so sometimes it has to be very specific for helping them to see what the foundation could do for them if they’re willing. Tto partner and i mentioned that family of donors, the physicians are large portion of that, right it’s not every physician, but it’s, the ones that turn on to see the fact that getting involved this way, and even being philanthropic myself, which, if i do it through plan giving or some other vehicles, can benefit me and directly, you know, that has a meaningful impact on my patients and that’s where doctors focus it’s all about them and their patients seems to me so if we could bring it down to the patient care level, the benefits of working with the foundation, making those clear and one one other element that struck me is that in that culture of philanthropy, what you want to get it too is a point in the overall institution that this isn’t something that’s nice to have. This is something that’s essential that needs to be elevated to the strategic level, the planning of the whole so that the executives on the hospital side are learning to plan for and depend upon and demand that philanthropy be a major part, their business, and what they’re trying to do with it has to come from leadership, right, creating a culture and and we see in our benchmarking service that we do with the standards where you have the ceo of the hospital involved in active way in, you know, signing letters in being president, making some of the calls with you as appropriate, you’re getting a much better result in a much better return on the dollars that are being raised, because donors want to know that there have any impact, and the important people in this business are aware of what they’re doing. And bill, i think we’ve seen that change over the years. The two of us sitting in these seats have watched healthcare philanthropy changed enormously. Wey have to leave it there. Thank you. Nancy johnson, senior consultant with target analytics and bill mcginley, president, ceo association for healthcare philanthropy, thanks very much for being guest. Thank you. You don’t know what you want. Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of become twenty twelve. We’ll be back with additional guests. I, you’re here further seconds, stay with us, my thanks to nancy johnson and bill mcginley and all the people at bebe con. It was a pleasure to be there, and i have more interviews from b become twenty twelve coming for you. Right now. We take a break when we return. It’s, tony, take two, and then gene and emily disaster relief. Stay with me. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam lebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology, no reality, in fact, its ideology over intellect, no more it’s, time for action. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower. We’ll discuss what you’re born, teo you society, politics, business and family. It’s, provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on. What does it mean? What can be done about it? So gain special access to the ivory tower. Listen to me very sharp, your neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s, ivory tower, radio, dot com every time i was a great place to visit both entertainment and education listening. Tuesday nights nine to eleven, it will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com lively conversation, top trends and sound advice. That’s, tony martignetti non-profit radio and i’m janna agger’s, senior vice president, products and marketing from blackbaud. Time now for tony’s steak, too. I have a lot of ways that you can help hurricane sandy victims throughout the country because, of course it was not only the northeast, not only new york, that was that was hurt, but the hurricane then you know, from new york city went into western new york and upstate, into the finger lakes region and then into ohio. So nationally there’s the american red cross. Um, you can donate at red cross dot or gq, or you can text red cross two, nine zero, nine nine, nine, and you’ll be giving ten dollars, to their disaster relief fund, including sandy. Red cross is also looking for volunteers, so if you’re able to volunteer red cross dot or ge is the place feeding, feeding america, they have a lot of food and emergency supplies. Water uh, that they’re e-giving throughout the disaster zone and to donate to them, go to feeding america. Dot org’s save the children is also working to provide relief to families and their children metoo they are at save the children dot or ge craig newmark, who has been a guest on the show twice uh he’s, the founder of craigslist and craigconnects and he’s uh, he’s matching donations up to twenty five thousand dollars for sandy victims and he’s doing that through crowd rise. So to give to that fund-raising dot com flash sandy relief. And when you go there, a picture of craig pops up. If you want to be more local in in new york, there are a lot of blood drives. I read hundreds of blood drives that were canceled because of the hurricane throughout new york state. So now we need blood. And if you want to donate blood in the new york city area it’s, new york sorry. And why blood center dot or ge? If you happen to be a techie in new york, you have tech skills. Um, new york tech meet up and new work city are organizing volunteers that have technology skills to help with relief efforts to help new york area businesses and non-profits get their technology back up and running. For that, you can go to bitterly dot slash hurricane tech volunteers. So that’s, uh, which place is that you can give time or money too, in support of people that are really in need throughout the northeast and a pinto, i said, north northern new york state and ohio, and on my block this week is a post called researcher bias in smelters planned e-giving study. Delta company did a a survey of potential planned e-giving donors. These people, they believe, are potential plan giving donors, but i detail in my in my block that still, the company also makes its money in large part bye selling print materials, direct mail materials, no website and consulting services for for outreach. So to me, it’s in there, broad corporate interests to have a bigger base of, of playing, giving prospects than we traditionally have had, and that, to me, creates conflict. They want to sell their services, and they’re encouraging charities to look beyond the what’s. Been the traditional prospect pools in terms of age and boiled e-giving history, and that i detail at on the block again. The post is called researcher bias in altars. Planned e-giving survey and my blog’s is that tony martignetti dot com that is tony, take two for friday, november two forty six show of the year with me now jean and emily. Jean emily, are you there? Hi, tony. This is jean and least beside me, but it’s going to be me alone today. And we hope that you and your family and all your loved ones are doing well. Our thoughts and prayers for everybody affected by the hurricane. Thank thank you very much, jane. I know you’re familiar with natural disasters being in the san francisco area. Yeah, we certainly did. Emily is there she’s just holding your hand or what? You’re not going to die. She pretty much is holding my hand and promising, tell me what to say. Okay, of course. Jean takagi and emily chan, they’re firm is the non-profit and exempt organizations law group neo-sage which you’ll find at attorney for non-profits dot com and jean jean’s blawg is gene. I don’t have it in front of me because i’m remote right now. Remind people what you’re what you’re bloggers, please. Sure. It’s just the non-profit lob log non-profit law blawg dot com and emily is the contributor to that as well. Um, so we’re talking about disaster relief, obviously timely. If a charity wants to do something, they’re so moved, maybe they’re in of a neighborhood that was that’s affected or whether they are or not. Can they just start, eh? Sandy disaster relief fund that’s a great question, tony, and, you know, charities are often the centres of their communities, especially in small communities and it’s really great to see communities pull together and non-profits wanting to help, but sometimes the non-profits mission is not aligned, oh are consistent with providing disaster relief. They might be in existence for doing some others types of services, but that doesn’t mean that they can’t help, but it does mean that they may have to take some steps before they help, and one of the things that they need to do is they need to change their mission. So they’ve got to make sure that on their website, on their marketing materials, and particularly if they’ve got a mission statement in their articles of incorporation or their by-laws to change that, to expand it, to be being able to provide those disaster relief services that they want to provide for pete’s sake. So if i want to do something, i can’t just do it the next morning, i have to look at my articles of incorporation first, yeah, you’ve got to get that board together and take a in an emergency action txtgive that that mission statement to the extent that it is constrained by your articles, so you’ve gotta operate consistent with your governing documents. So you’ve got to change those if there is that statement in there, that’s one of the reasons why we like to make sure that the articles purpose statement, they called a certificate of inc in new york, it’s not so specific that you can’t uh, uh, let your organization of all take on things like this in the future and then a tip for revisiting your mission statement for all non-profits so is there a phrase that is safe that is brought enough that you recommend it doesn’t have to say hurricane relief, right? Absolutely. So you can say we’re providing charitable services in whatever area you want to focus on on dh leave, it is broadly is that in your articles, and then you could define it more specifically on your website and on marketing materials like grant applications, but when you decide to engage in a new activity like disaster relief, and that really goes outside of what you’re doing. Perhaps you were providing music education, you know, when you really go outside of that pounds, you’ve got to make sure that you don’t use prior donors funds, which were dedicated towards music education in our example. But you’re using nufer funds once you’ve changed your mission statement to engage in that disaster relief activity. Okay, onda of course, once you start collecting funds for a certain purpose, then you have to use them for that purpose. That’s correct. You can’t then if if the if the disaster is is overcome, you can’t switch your funds back to music, right? So the money that you resent you raised for disaster relief, you’ve gotta make sure that they’re focused on that. And we had some issues with that after nine eleven. And so are some other duvette actors where organizations felt that they had expended enough money in that area and wanted divert the rest of the money into other areas beyond that could be a real danger. All right. Is emily passing you notes right now? She always passes me notice. Okay. Okay. Stop it, emily. Genes genes good on his own. He knows what he’s doing. Okay, so once you then expand the mission statement, if you need to, you also have to inform the irs. Is that right? Yeah, although you don’t have to do that right away. So you can engage in the disaster relief activities, which usually you’ve got to do pretty quickly. But you can report the change in your activities and the change in your mission to the irs when you finally form nine, ninety for the year in which you changed those activities. So for example, you wouldn’t have to file if you were going, you know, finally for two thousand twelve until may two thousand thirteen. Okay, okay. That doesn’t have to be immediate. I just realized i neglected to send live listener love during tony. Take two. And we have a lot of listeners abroad. Tokyo, taipei in taiwan and yung yung in korea and send gen china welcome live listening love to all those foreign countries and also to philadelphia, which is not quite as far into me. I live in new york, but philadelphia’s not quite as far in as those other. Cities, um, pardon me for that, but jean but i have to send my listeners love. Sorry, uh, that’s great. All right, so once so, then once you have expanded your mission statement, if necessary, then is there any limit to what kinds of relief you can provide? Well, there are so you’re still restricted by what we described on our last couple shows private benefit issues. Oh, man, private benefit again? Yeah. You know, charities exists to provide a public benefit, and they can’t be operated to promote private interests. So you’ve got to be careful. So we can’t give a million bucks away. Teo, somebody who was barely hurt by the hurricane that would that would not be appropriate. You’ve also got to be worried about conflicts of interest so forgiving to board members or toe officers of the organization and not in an objective matter, not as part of a charitable class of individuals affected or with preferential treatment to those insiders. That would be wrong, but we certainly can provide funds, services or good ensure that victims have basic necessities like food and clothing and housing and medical assistance and things like that. What can you define a class of people that you want to help. Yeah, i mean that’s, something you should do. So you should say, you know, this is good for business and not only legal reasons, but are we just going to help anybody affected by the hurricane? Are we goingto, you know, really look at financial need? Are we going toe not look a financial need, and we don’t have to. We learned after nine eleven that we can even help communities that don’t have financial disadvantages, but that were hurt badly by the hurricane and or any disaster and weaken give emergency relief so emergency relief services can be given without a needs assessment. Otherwise we want to determine what type of needs we’re looking for. Is it financial need? Is it medical? Need it, you know, for disabled individuals within a given area? Are we goingto limited geographically all sorts of things that we need to target our mission towards? And then when we get this whole pool of charitable class members that want our attention, we have to figure out what type of resources we have and how we decide who to give it to the needs assessment. Is something that’s required or it’s just very smart to do well, it’s it’s really required if you’re going to be required to go the scorning assistance yeah, it’s not so required if you’re just providing emergency assistance. So for giving out blankets and food and shelter in the next couple weeks for the hurricane victims. There’s no needs assessment required for that, you know, it’s pretty obvious who’s in need. Okay, but if we’re gonna be e-giving ongoing, you know, rental assistance payments and that’s going to last for several, several months past the hurricane, then we’re going to think about why are we just giving it to a select few individuals? And how did we choose them? We’ve got has some objective in good faith criteria there. What about helping businesses? We’ve been talking about people. Yeah, that’s actually possible, and some people, you know, don’t realize that that’s possible, but sometimes business owners are financially needy, and that would be okay to provide businesses in that case and otherwise they might be distressed or or to come back community deterioration or lessen the burden of government. And we’ve seen, you know, from the west coast we’ve seen the photos of some of the the impact of the hurricane on the seaboard, especially, and those air communities where, you know they’re not going to recover unless their businesses recover their small businesses. And the small business owners need assistance to get back in there. Otherwise, the community is not going to get back. And so that’s a case where non-profits can actually provide assistance, the businesses as well. Okay, but go and going back to people. We can’t define a class of people that, uh, illegal in or, you know, impermissible in other circumstances just because we happen to know that they were particularly burdened by whatever the, whatever, whatever the disaster is. Oppcoll well, i mean, you could certainly define your class how you want it. But it’s got to be again, pretty objective. So that you’re not, you know, favoring people who either don’t really have a need or favoring insiders of the charity over others. Okay. We can’t target this too specific individuals, but we can certainly say community’s, though, right? Yeah, and it could be a small neighbourhood community that you’re targeting that was especially impacted or where the charity is an existence and it’s kind of the hub of that community, or or we could have more expansive criteria. Okay? Bonem now, so the people need to fit into the the people you’re helping need to fit into that terrible class. As he said, um, a little more about conflict, potential, conflicts of interest? Sure, well, you know, if you’ve got a board of directors of a charity of charities should have and they’re determining who’s going to get aid from the charity, we certainly don’t want them to benefit themselves, though there others, even if they’ve been affected by the disaster, they might be able, teo, be eligible to be considered among the charitable class of individuals and so they might get some benefit, but it would be incidental, and they should certainly not be making decisions on benefiting themselves. They would have to abstain if they’re part of that charitable class on who to pick that will receive help. I mean it. Would be nice if charity’s could give help everybody, but obviously resource is air limited, so they’ve got a decide who’s most impacted or who they want to help the most in line with their mission. And board members and officers of the organization have to really be careful because they’re in power positions of making those types of decisions that that’s the conflict of interest issue. And sometimes when you have outsiders who are part of the selection committee, you know that can create more trust if you get community leaders who are not on the board but involved in selecting who might be able to receive relief that might give some, you know, assurance to the community that they’re not going to only benefit themselves the board of the charity, that is, but it also creates additional conflicts of interest so that we make sure that those people aren’t benefiting themselves, thie outside selection committee members or their families or their business partners or route, you know, and, you know, business relations. So we just have to be careful about those things i see and that’s consistent what we’ve talked about in the past. That’s absolutely right, we have just a minute before break gene it. Would it be permissible for a charity to say that the charitable class they want to help volunteers to that charity? People who have been volunteering with them in the past? Yes, longest that’s a signature una, significantly large enough and indefinite class of individuals it’s going to be okay. So if we’ve got, you know, one hundred volunteers and we’re open to taking more volunteers and we’re going to help our volunteers that’s going to be okay, especially if they if they, you know again, not preferentially board members and officers of the organizations who are volunteers. Okay, but if it’s too small a classic like five people who are volunteers, we can’t sir, you know that just those five people is a charitable class that would be impermissible private benefit. All right, we’re going to take a break team takagi stays with us. We’ll keep talking about disaster relief, and i hope you do, too. Talking. 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Got more live listener love to salt lake city and moscow and dallas, texas also south bend, indiana thanks for joining us live listener love to all those cities, jean what if you collect more money than there is need? Now you’ve you’ve said, you’re specifically collecting it for this purpose. It’s not needed anymore. What do you do? Yeah, that’s really tricky tony so one of the things that’s kinda boyd that situation. So you want to be careful when you read to find your mission? The only way that happens is usually when you defined your charitable class so small that you know you, you raised enough money to help them out through the air. Emergencies on dh you’ve decided you’ve got extra money left at that point, you’ve gotta operate as close as you can t to the charitable purpose for which those monies were collected, donors typically don’t have a right to get that money back, so, you know, you could go to court, and we figure out what to do with that extra money and people could bring you into court, too, to decide what to do with that. That happened with nine eleven i don’t want that to happen, so be very careful of that. You can usually find your way around it as long as you haven’t made your mission and your charitable class so so tiny and specific that that that it becomes a knish you later? Okay, but what do you do with the money? Well, you’re going to use it for close to that mission is possible, and if it’s if it’s really outside of that, then you’re gonna have to go to court and get them tio follow through an approved where that money is going to go and it’s called a sight prey issue. But i didn’t want to get into jargon jail, but i suppose they just have so i pray i like i like how that spell right? See why pr ess, isn’t it? That’s your sigh, pray okay, go ahead, go ahead, tell us, what’s, i pray is show off. Well, i pray it is, of course, latin and lawyers like to use it to impress other people on dh when i literally mean like you’re doing right now, james, i think it is near it’s possible or as near as i may be possible. And i think it’s latin. It may also actually be french coming from the old french language. So it’s often used where people have designated their gifts their charitable gift to certain purposes, and that purpose is no longer required or becomes impossible to fulfill. So that might be, for example, the eradication of polio which the march of dimes had encountered early on. And they needed to change their mission. Later they decided to otherwise polio had, you know, essentially been eradicated with jonas salk back scene on dh. They changed to birth defects. So i pray, is a very common doctrine used when charitable purposes have been completed or impossible to complete further. That sounds like a lot of trouble. Could we give the money that’s excess to another charity that does the type of work that we had raised the money for? Yes, certainly. If they can, if they can, if they khun do those type of activities and we no longer can then that that certainly is permissible. So long, focal donor’s intent and what the charity had said the money would be used for is still used for those purposes, you know. Okay, so there’s a dozen easier way out than going to court. All right, right. So long it again. You didn’t pick such a fine mission that nobody nobody else could do it either. Yeah. All right. We have just about two minutes before we have to go. Uh, let’s say a little more about documentation. We talked about the articles of incorporation amending those and we talked about the nine, ninety in that year. What else is required? Well, you know, what you should be requiring is the type of assistance that you provided, whether it be financial assistance or in-kind good blankets, food, housing, whatever the costs associated to the charity with providing that assistance, the purpose of why you’re giving that assistance and why you’re giving it to those individuals that are receiving the assistance over others. If the board was not making those determinations about who gets and who doesn’t get on dh, there was some selection committee. How did you choose that selection committee? On what criteria did they use for dispersing the aid you want? Also document the names and the addresses of the river citians of the financial aid that you’ve given or significant non financial. Aid given again, this wouldn’t be necessary for emergency relief, or you’re just giving food and shelter and blankets and things. But if it’s ongoing gauge, you wanted to make sure you know who those recipients are and you want to disclose that either there was no relationship between the recipients of aids and an insider, a director officer or substantial contributor to the organization our thirty document that i have one last thing, tony, make sure donors don’t hey don’t earmark their donations towards specific individuals that’s not allowed, so i can’t give a gift and say give it to my uncle, who got affected by the hurricane that we’re not allowed fifteen seconds. Where do we document all this is just inboard mitts you khun documented in board minutes or any sort of organizational document that you you hold and that the organization can attest it is the policy or the practice of the organization. Jean takagi, his firm is non-profit and exempt organizations law group in san francisco and you’ll find him at non-profit law blawg. Thank you very much, jane. Thanks, tony. My thanks. Also to regina walton, live listener love going tow her in san francisco and she also very helpful in compiling the list of agencies that i had for tony’s take to regina, thank you very much. I have a new fund-raising fundamentals podcast out with the chronicle of philanthropy, it is how to recruit and motivate volunteers for your events. You’ll find it on the chronicle website, and you’ll also find fund-raising fundamentals on itunes next week. Career advice for your entry level and junior employees jonathan lewis produces career advice videos with leaders in non-profit social change uh, he his video interviews are free and they’re short, and i think they’re valuable as you lied and mentor twentysomethings who want to make a difference in the world, he and i are going to listen to, and he’ll comment on a couple of clips. One is called mentoring for dummies, and another one is called shut the hell up and also next week, maria semple returns our prospect research contributor and the prospect finder has resource is for researching privately held companies. You know, she always has a ton of free and low cost sites and ideas, and next week will be no exception. You can find us on linkedin reveling in group you can offer ideas for the shows and continue the conversation with guests on linkedin. We’re on facebook, you know that i haven’t said it recently, but that’s because you already know it. You can listen to non-profit radio, live or archives. The archive is on itunes at non-profit radio dot net on twitter you can follow me, use the show’s hashtag non-profit radio and you can also follow me on foursquare we can connect there wishing you good luck the way performers do around the world. We have left estonia, estonia is behind us so from estonia go west across the baltic sea and you land in sweden where they lightly kick performers in the bud before they go onstage. No hands allowed on ly a kick, please and when they’re doing it, they will say, breathe at the bend freak at ben, which means break a bone so i guess sweet don’t have femurs and to be his invidious, so just break any bone in your body is fine. You don’t have to be specific to the leg, so i’m wishing you breed at ben. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. I’m leaving, which is our line. Producer assistant producer janice taylor is sending me text telling me when the time is coming up. Thank you very much, general shows social media’s, by regina walton, of organic social media and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Oh, i hope you’ll be with me next week. Friday one to two p, m eastern on talking alternative broadcasting at talking alternative dot com. I didn’t think that shooting. Good ending. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, waiting to get anything. Hi, this is nancy taito from speaks been radio speaks been radio is an exploration of the world of communication, how it happens in how to make it better, because the quality of your communication has a direct impact on the quality of your life. Tune in monday’s at two pm on talking alternative dot com, where i’ll be interviewing experts from business, academia, the arts and new thought. Join me mondays at two p m and get all your communications questions answered on so speaks been radio. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam lebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three the conscious consultant helping conscious people be better business people. Dahna you’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. This is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication. 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